W.E. 444 won't ring...

[Babybearjs]

Heres a interesting problem.... I have a W.E. 444 3 line phone. I use it as a portable outdoor phone on my patio. when I plug it in, it works fine but won't ring.... that is until I call the number again and then it decides to work right. what should I look for? it sounds like the capacitor is bad.... or is it the drain? (red/wht wire) I have the capacitor drain connected to ground, so it should be doing its job right. is it just that the phone is kept in storage and not used all the time? does the capacitor have to "Charge" to make the phone ring? what should I look for in this problem??

[dsk]

I'm not sure I can help, but I learn a here on the forum, and have solved some strange problems. Now, I have to ask, and hopefully learn what you are talking about when you drain the capacitor. (And I'm getting better in understanding English    )

All ringer circuits I have seen for normal telephone lines has a capacitor in series with some kind of ringer. Sometimes this capacitor are shunted or shorted or used as a part in the speech circuit in off hook condition. The only grounding I have experienced of a ringer is; grounded ringing.  

My first advice would be to look at tension and bias springs, and eventually polarity. Sometimes the ac ringing is put on top of a dc voltage, and that may cause some random problems to start the ringer.

dsk

[poplar1]

The slate-red capacitor wire should not be connected to Ground.

Are you using the ringer as a common audible or as a line ringer?

Common audible: connect S-R cap. lead to L1 on the induction coil

Line ringer: connect S-R to the R terminal of which ever line the ringer  is connected to (1R for the first line, etc.)

SD-69128-01 Drawing Issue 6-D Note 308

[Babybearjs]

isin't the Slt/Red wire the capacitor drain? from the BSP its suppose to be shield drain.. the regular 195 caps dont use this lead... just the 400 series phones. should I move it to the ring side of the line? or just disconnect it and cap it off....

[poplar1]

isin't the Slt/Red wire the capacitor drain? from the BSP its suppose to be shield drain.. the regular 195 caps dont use this lead... just the 400 series phones. should I move it to the ring side of the line? or just disconnect it and cap it off....

It will probably work without it. I think it is there to prevent crosstalk when the ringer is connected to a different line than the one you are talking on. Which BSP are you citing? Do you have the ringer connected to one line or is it a common audible connection where it will ring on several lines?

[Babybearjs]

Lets see... its enclosed.

[G-Man]

The SLATE/RED shield lead is used to prevent cross-talk when multiple lines are connected.

Of course this set was intended for use with a key system and even though you did not specify the specific model or whether it is to be connected to one or more lines, I assume you just want to connect the ringer to a dedicated line.

The connections for Bridged Ringing are clearly shown in Table H of the BSP you cited:

        =Ringer Leads=

BLACK-     To terminal "K"
RED-         To terminal "R" of desired line

      =Capacitor Leads=

SLATE –              To terminal "K"
YELLOW-             To terminal "T" of the desired line
SLATE/RED-         To terminal "R" of the desired line

If only one line is being used then the use of the SLATE/RED lead not important.

[G-Man]

Clarification-

From the TCI Library.....

•   http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/document-repository/doc_details/2323-400-series-telephones-502-435-400-i3-440-460-cb-connections-tl

Bell System Practices
502-435-400 - Issue 3

Telephone Sets 440 and 460 Series
Common Battery - Connections

Table H
Ringer and Buzzer Connections

[Babybearjs]

so based on this, the red AND the Red/Slt go to the R term. thank you, I'll make the change.

[G-Man]

Since we only have incomplete information and don't know whether it is connected to a key system or to multiple lines this is only a guess.

Only necessary if more than one line is connected.

[poplar1]

so based on this, the red AND the Red/Slt go to the R term. thank you, I'll make the change.

If you are using the ringer on line 1 only, then both the red ringer wire and the slate-red condenser wire go to 1R (not R on the induction coil).
On line 2 only, 2R, etc.

[G-Man]

so based on this, the red AND the Red/Slt go to the R term. thank you, I'll make the change.

I assumed that it was self-Evident since I circled in red the note stating which connections were to be made to the desired line.

But of course we still have not been told whether there are multiple lines involved or not. Otherwise we could have provided him with the specific terminations.