Classic Rotary Phones Forum

Telephone Talk => Pay Station Telephones => Automatic Electric Pay Phones => Topic started by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 04:51:00 PM

Title: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 04:51:00 PM
Here is a phone I am considering to buy. It is on craigslist about 4 hours from my home. Seller has owned and used for the last 25 years (since around 1985) in their game room. Phone works and has a ringer. Phone appears to be in nice shape.

It appears to be an LPB that has been modified by GTE to LPC configuration to be a residential phone?

I can see for myself that the entire coin relay is gone. Upper housing looks completely original. Anything else missing or not right?

Questions:
1. Was the Teltronics network an original part of the LPC?
2. Will the Teltronics network work with a coin controller?
3. How much would it cost to get this phone back to where I can use coins using a coin controller? I would do the work myself so we are talking about cost of parts.
4. The seller is asking $200. What is a reasonable offer considering the coin relay is gone?

My purpose for the phone is to be installed in my 1951 phone booth and to work as an everyday phone. I want to be able to use coins to make calls. I understand I will have to buy or build a coin controller.

Is this phone going to do it for me if I replace the coin relay?

Thanking you all in advance.

John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: Haf on September 21, 2013, 05:06:27 PM
Look at this:
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=9719.0
I converted an LPC 86-55 into an LPC 82-55 and there are pics how both look in out of service condition.

Haf
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 05:09:58 PM
It will work as a standard extension telephone but if you want it to emulate a traditional coin telephone then the answer is no.

You need a payphone with a coin relay since it is the mechanism that performs the collect and refund functions as determined by the external controller.

While these payphones were not originally equipped with Teltronics boards, GTE and others later installed them during refurbishment. They are shown in the GTE coin practices.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 05:27:15 PM
G-man,

I know this phone will not collect coins without the relay. If I installed a coin relay would a coin controller device work with the Teltronics board?
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 05:33:53 PM
Haf,

It looks like you completely replaced the coin relay. What did you pay for the parts and who did you get them from?
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: RotarDad on September 21, 2013, 06:44:58 PM
John,

You may know this already, but you will need some extra pieces for your hopper where the relay mounts.  They are a couple of plastic parts which allow the relay to hold and then release the coins.  There is also a wire "keeper" which holds the hopper parts in place.  Yours appears to be present but was mangled to hold the coin vane in the return position.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 06:57:20 PM
RotarDad,

Who would be the best source of getting a complete coin relay or coin relay/chute assembly. Trying to see what the cost would be to put this phone back correctly. I am not too concerned about the network unless the teltronics board will not work with a coin controller.
Any advice?
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 06:58:06 PM
Automatic Electric payphones using Teltronics boards were fully operable.

However, in your case you need to make sure you do not purchase a semi-postpay coin relay which looks similar to the prepay types.

Also, I believe you should be able to find a complete payphone for $200 or less on eBay or elsewhere which would save you the hassle of trying to find all of the parts and any associated wiring difficulties.

In any event, before you invest money in parts for this telephone you should contact Stan Schreier directly as to what models are compatible with his controllers.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 07:01:51 PM
Opps...

Stan's instructions are now attached.

Quote from: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 06:58:06 PM
Automatic Electric payphones using Teltronics boards were fully operable.

However, in your case you need to make sure you do not purchase a semi-postpay coin relay which looks similar to the prepay types.

Also, I believe you should be able to find a complete payphone for $200 or less on eBay or elsewhere which would save you the hassle of trying to find all of the parts and any associated wiring difficulties.

In any event, before you invest money in parts for this telephone you should contact Stan Schreier directly as to what models are compatible with his controllers.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: rdelius on September 21, 2013, 07:11:56 PM
That board should work,make sure that mone of the solder pads are broken. You can get AE LPC wireing harnesses and the other parts from Paul Vaverchak if you wanted Orifional parts. Nothing wrong with that circuit board. This is better than somebodys wireing kludge
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 07:15:59 PM
Quote from: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 06:58:06 PM
Automatic Electric payphones using Teltronics boards were fully operable.

However, in your case you need to make sure you do not purchase a semi-postpay coin relay which looks similar to the prepay types.

Also, I believe you should be able to find a complete payphone for $200 or less on eBay or elsewhere which would save you the hassle of trying to find all of the parts and any associated wiring difficulties.

In any event, before you invest money in parts for this telephone you should contact Stan Schreier directly as to what models are compatible with his controllers.

Thanks for reply G-man,

I have been looking on ebay for the last couple of weeks. Either the phones are semi-post pay, they are missing lots of parts, the sellers have no way of opening up the phone to see what is inside, or the sellers have not responded to requests for pictures of the inside. This is for phones under $250. Very frustrating.

This phone looked good because the seller is very willing to take pictures and not hide anything. It looks to be complete with the exception of the coin relay. What do you think it is worth?
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 07:19:49 PM
Quote from: rdelius on September 21, 2013, 07:11:56 PM
That board should work,make sure that mone of the solder pads are broken. You can get AE LPC wireing harnesses and the other parts from Paul Vaverchak if you wanted Orifional parts. Nothing wrong with that circuit board. This is better than somebodys wireing kludge

He could invest money in what is most likely a $75 - $100 payphone but I wonder if that is a good idea since if he watches eBay he could probably pickup one that is complete for much less than what he will end up sinking into this one.

If I would have known sooner I would have offered him the Automatic Electric payphone that I ended up selling for slightly less than $150 on eBay. It was complete and looked good cosmetically
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 07:25:03 PM
Thanks rdelius and G-man,
On Dave's islandregister.com website he shows a phone number for Paul. Is that the only way to contact or does he have an email or web site?
What do you think this phone is worth the way it sits now. Seller is asking $200. I am thinking it is going to need around $100 in parts?
Thanks for your help.
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: RotarDad on September 21, 2013, 07:29:06 PM
I've seen relays and complete hopper/relay assemblies on Ebay, but they don't show up frequently.  I'm sure someone on the forum has the parts also, but I agree with G-man that a complete phone is the way to go if you can.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 07:50:09 PM
Here's one that was just posted on ebay. Western Electric. I have requested pics of the inside.
Is the metal box screwed to the backing board a network?  It says "IV-69" on the top. I can see an external ringer mounted below the phone also.
I understand that these Western Electrics all need networks and ringers (except the 236G)
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 07:56:39 PM
Upside-down Bell Chime and possibly a Wheelock or equivalent ringing relay.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 08:04:33 PM
Quote from: G-Man on September 21, 2013, 07:56:39 PM
Upside-down Bell Chime and possibly a Wheelock or equivalent ringing relay.
This might be the same model...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wheelock-Signals-Bell-Systems-KS-16301-L15-Relay-NEW-/221275451374?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33850b6fee


Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 21, 2013, 08:21:03 PM
Educate me. What is a Wheelock relay used for? I thought the external ringers were stand alone units that were plugged in between the phone and wall jack.
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: poplar1 on September 21, 2013, 08:48:31 PM
The relay connects commercial power (120 Volts AC, 60~) to an external signal, such as a 120 Vac loud horn in a warehouse. The relay is activated  by ringing current (90 Volts AC, 20~)--I can't remember  whether the other terminals on the relay are for different input or different output.

The F1A ringer shown (Bell Chime) operates directly from ring current. It's installed on the telephone line as an extension ringer in a residence or office. Sometimes it's used with a 701B Princess in lieu of an E1 baseboard ringer. I've never seen one next to a Pay Phone, but in any case, it definitely shouldn't be connected to 120 VAC 60~.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: RotarDad on September 22, 2013, 01:22:11 AM
This beige one would also be in need of expensive parts even if the inside is 100% complete. You will need a vault door and both upper and lower locks.  The lower lock is maybe $15-$25 on Ebay (a WE 30C) but a nice vault door is often $60-80 or more and the upper lock (10G or 10H) often run $30-40 or so but you don't see them as often as the doors and lower locks.   Paying a bit more up front for completeness will save you lots of time and probably money.  I should have done that when I bought mine..... ;)
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: G-Man on September 22, 2013, 07:09:40 PM
Buying a coin relay and other parts for the AECo payphone would also not be cheap.

As with most things eBay, patience is on the side of the buyer. Eventually a real bargain will show up especially if you carefully shift through the descriptions and photos long enough.

I think that some of the eBay prices you quoted are on the high side, but perhaps not. Some sellers are also listing 29S or 10G/H locks that have been modified to operate without a key for much less. I believe that Jody Haralson is one of them.

Since you still have to modify an original payphone for use with the controller and it appears that only cosmetics and functionality are his primary concerns, he can buy an upper-housing locking device and a snap-in door for about $7.00 each from either eBay or Phoneco.


Quote from: RotarDad on September 22, 2013, 01:22:11 AM
This beige one would also be in need of expensive parts even if the inside is 100% complete. You will need a vault door and both upper and lower locks.  The lower lock is maybe $15-$25 on Ebay (a WE 30C) but a nice vault door is often $60-80 or more and the upper lock (10G or 10H) often run $30-40 or so but you don't see them as often as the doors and lower locks.   Paying a bit more up front for completeness will save you lots of time and probably money.  I should have done that when I bought mine..... ;)
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: RotarDad on September 22, 2013, 08:04:20 PM
Single coil relay on Ebay now.  Seller apparently has several to sell.  Item # 121181398234.  I think $50 is high on the price. This seller says he'll include the screws and the plastic cover.  You'd still need the hopper parts to complete that black AE phone previously discussed.

G-Man is right that you certainly can find lower prices with patience, or substitute non-original parts for the locks and door.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: jjacob on September 23, 2013, 10:23:29 AM
Thanks to all for your wisdom and suggestions. Still looking. I did see the relays on ebay.
Found a Northern Electric 233, but I think the coin mechanism is set up for Canadian coins. I have posted some questions on the Northern Electric Forum. Your comments are appreciated.
John
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: HarrySmith on September 24, 2013, 04:52:32 PM
I also saw a couple of NOS WE coin chute assemblies on eBay this morning.
Both were still in the original box. I do not know if they work on an AE or not.
Title: Re: Need phone guru eyes to look over this phone for me that I am considering.
Post by: rdelius on September 24, 2013, 09:37:02 PM
the WE-NE stanless steel chutes will not fit an AE housing.The lead AE chutes should be out there.