Western Electric H & M mounting codes

[unbeldi]

Attached is a mosaic of WECo 300 series mounting codes (H, M).

The colored Tenite sets, but sometimes also the black sets, usually have one or two additional symbols after the mounting code (H1, H3, M3, ...)

One of these symbols is a filled circle and another is a symbol of three horizontal bars.  When present, the sequence is always circle, then bars.

Has anyone tracked these to particular features of the housing?  What does the circle and the bars indicate?

A logical explanation might be that the circle indicates the presence of a dial, but I have not yet owned an original manual colored plastic set to verify. I don't know the original configuration of an ivory M3 I have, the dial is a year younger than the housing, so it may well have been added later, and a black one with dial doesn't have a circle either, but the dial is over 10 years older, so not original to the housing.

As to the three bar symbol, I have no clue.

[unbeldi]

Could the three-bar symbol on the colored housings have anything to do with this three-bar mark on the bottom of a 1941 black set?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201096744834

[poplar1]

Pekin Red non-dial 302 has same dot as five dial 302s.
Only one has the 3 bars; it is a 1953 green set with 6D dial.

[unbeldi]

Thank you!
Only one of six with bars... hmm. that's a lot lower than my sampling. My count has been only about a quarter to a third of sets without bars.

Pekin Red non-dial 302 has same dot as five dial 302s.
Only one has the 3 bars; it is a 1953 green set with 6D dial.

[tallguy58]

If it helps, I have a black NE 302 with H1 in white and 3 bars in vermilion. Why the 2 different colours?? I don't know.

[unbeldi]

If it helps, I have a black NE 302 with H1 in white and 3 bars in vermilion. Why the 2 different colours?? I don't know.

I suppose they may have been applied at different manufacturing stations?  It might get clearer once we have an idea what these things mean.

[unbeldi]

Here is an H1 housing by Northern Electric that has an H1 mounting code and the three-bar symbol only, and in different colors !
This means the marks were applied in separate steps, a feature not evident from the previous observations. But since this came from a different manufacturer, this observation cannot be generalized.

The set contains a No. 5 dial (NE). The auction initially misidentified the maker of the base and housing, but there can be no doubt that it's an NE, based on the style of date stamping.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231268973375

[poplar1]

Seller has updated the description, but says that the handset handle is WE. Did Northern ever make color F-type handsets? If the handset is WE, is it possible that the housing is also, even though the H1 is in black (as NE would do) rather than vermilion (as WE would do)?

[poplar1]

Clues that it is a Northern Electric:                                               Western Electric:

--5-type dial on a 1954 phone......................................................WE switched to 6D with black dot by 1953
--5J stamped in the metal dial case..............................................5-type dials have type stamped in vermilion ink
--Date format on dial month-day-year...........................................Date quarter/year in vermilion ink
--Patent dates on transmitter and base.......................................No patent dates
--Transmitter date month-day-year...............................................Quarter/year
--Clear plastic on induction coil and ringer coils (sometimes)                                   
--Shiny black paint on baseplate
--Northern Electric marked on dial

[unbeldi]

Seller has updated the description, but says that the handset handle is WE. Did Northern ever make color F-type handsets?

I don't know for lack of samples and observations. But I have been wondering this in the past, IIRC, the reason for which escapes me. Probably a similar situation.

If the handset is WE, is it possible that the housing is also, even though the H1 is in black (as NE would do) rather than vermilion (as WE would do)?

The date stamp on the housing is also distinctly NE style.  Between the H1 stamp and the date stamp, there should be no doubt.

[rdelius]

Another NE feature , the open cut out that the induction coil mounting slides under. WE had a rivited metal part.

[unbeldi]

The solid circle symbol following the mounting code means that the tension of the plungers and contacts in the switch hook assembly is designed to accommodate the light-weight plastic handsets that were introduced in January 1949.

It seems that they somehow needed this designation to indicate to field personnel not to replace handsets from the pre-war colored plastic telephones, which had heavier, solid core handles, with the newer light weight handsets.

All new plastic handsets also had a dot following the F1 designation in the logo inscription on the underside of the handle.

This does not seem to apply to the M3 housings for the ivory sets.

Apparently, NE didn't follow this practice on the housings.

[poplar1]

Here is an H1 housing by Northern Electric that has an H1 mounting code and the three-bar symbol only, and in different colors !
This means the marks were applied in separate steps, a feature not evident from the previous observations. But since this came from a different manufacturer, this observation cannot be generalized.

The set contains a No. 5 dial (NE). The auction initially misidentified the maker of the base and housing, but there can be no doubt that it's an NE, based on the style of date stamping.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231268973375

A private email from a Canadian collector states that Northern Electric did not make 302 housings or F-type handsets in color. NE imported these color parts from WE, then applied their own H1 stamp and date (9-29-54 in this one) at the NE factory, where they assembled this phone using all NE parts other than the housing, handset, and possibly the cords. The WE handset appears to have been date stamped (6-54) by WE in vermilion ink,  3 months earlier than the other parts.

[unbeldi]

Here is an H1 housing by Northern Electric that has an H1 mounting code and the three-bar symbol only, and in different colors !
This means the marks were applied in separate steps, a feature not evident from the previous observations. But since this came from a different manufacturer, this observation cannot be generalized.

The set contains a No. 5 dial (NE). The auction initially misidentified the maker of the base and housing, but there can be no doubt that it's an NE, based on the style of date stamping.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231268973375

A private email from a Canadian collector states that Northern Electric did not make 302 housings or F-type handsets in color. NE imported these color parts from WE, then applied their own H1 stamp and date (9-29-54 in this one) at the NE factory, where they assembled this phone using all NE parts other than the housing, handset, and possibly the cords. The WE handset appears to have been date stamped (6-54) by WE in vermilion ink,  3 months earlier than the other parts.

That fits the pattern.
Thanks for confirming that.

[poplar1]

You can see the extra spring in the modified switch hook for post-1948  color 302s here. Perhaps someone has a better photo. Most sellers don't bother to show the inside of any phone.

The solid circle symbol following the mounting code means that the tension of the plungers and contacts in the switch hook assembly is designed to accommodate the light-weight plastic handsets that were introduced in January 1949.

It seems that they somehow needed this designation to indicate to field personnel not to replace handsets from the pre-war colored plastic telephones, which had heavier, solid core handles, with the newer light weight handsets.

All new plastic handsets also had a dot following the F1 designation in the logo inscription on the underside of the handle.

This does not seem to apply to the M3 housings for the ivory sets.

Apparently, NE didn't follow this practice on the housings.