My Switch box....

[Babybearjs]

well, heres my wooden contribution..... I got this from Phoneco last year and am attempting to rewire it... does anyone know if the TCI Library has anything on these units?  I'm looking for the original schematic and any documentation related to this one or the series its from.... I want to wire it as a secraterial answering unit that works with a 1A1/1A2 system. I need to wire it so it has the lockout feature on the switches. (so if 2 or more switches are in the same position, only 1 works..) It has 4 multipole switches and they all have 3 positions.... up, middle, and down. I've got the lights wired, and the A-lead... but still am trying to figure out the tip and ring part of the circuit...

[Alex G. Bell]

well, heres my wooden contribution..... I got this from Phoneco last year and am attempting to rewire it... does anyone know if the TCI Library has anything on these units?  I'm looking for the original schematic and any documentation related to this one or the series its from.... I want to wire it as a secraterial answering unit that works with a 1A1/1A2 system. I need to wire it so it has the lockout feature on the switches. (so if 2 or more switches are in the same position, only 1 works..) It has 4 multipole switches and they all have 3 positions.... up, middle, and down. I've got the lights wired, and the A-lead... but still am trying to figure out the tip and ring part of the circuit...

If the position in which the key handle is upright (perpendicular to the panel) is the 3rd or 1st rather than middle position it probably is a functional clone of the WECo 100-type Key Equipment key box, perhaps in the TCI library.  But it's not a WECo item, perhaps AE, hard to see due to limited JPG resolution. 

I was not aware of any other company cloning the 100 Type Key Equipments.  This system has nothing to do with 1A, 1A1 nor 1A2 and is not compatible with it nor even its successor, 101.  It used completely different relay equipment for signal lamp control and holding. The wiring however is normally chained so only one line can be selected at a time.  This requires the keys to have break contacts (transfer contact sets).  The 1st (upright) position for 100 is off, 2nd is TALK and 3rd (furthest from perpendicular) is HOLD.

If the keys are as I described and the material is not in the TCI library I have it and can scan it at some time.

[Babybearjs]

Thank you for the info. I found a part number on one of the keys, Y16. don't know if this helps at all, but its a start. the leaf assembly has the following setup. in the "Up" position, I guess what you referred to as Position 1, 2 NO contact make. in the middle position 2 SPDT along with a second SPDT switch make contact. in the Down position the SPDT witches make in the opposite contacts. I managed to get the unit wired for the lights and an A-Lead Circuit along with the tip and ring part of the unit... I'm still discovering the contacts and how to wire them.... I have to add some more wires to the switches to complete the testing.... I had the unit partially working at one point, but stopped as it didn't work the way I had envisioned. so I put it wawy for another day.... today.... I guess....

[Alex G. Bell]

Thank you for the info. I found a part number on one of the keys, Y16. don't know if this helps at all, but its a start. the leaf assembly has the following setup. in the "Up" position, I guess what you referred to as Position 1, 2 NO contact make. in the middle position 2 SPDT along with a second SPDT switch make contact. in the Down position the SPDT witches make in the opposite contacts. I managed to get the unit wired for the lights and an A-Lead Circuit along with the tip and ring part of the unit... I'm still discovering the contacts and how to wire them.... I have to add some more wires to the switches to complete the testing.... I had the unit partially working at one point, but stopped as it didn't work the way I had envisioned. so I put it wawy for another day.... today.... I guess....

You're welcome.  Unfortunately Y16 means nothing until the mfr is IDed and probably not even then.  Even if you post higher res. photos of outside and inside it's unlikely that will lead to anything useful other than IDing the mfr but that won't help much since docs are probably unavailable anywhere.

I don't really understand your description of the contact operation.  You need to compare the key contact config. and operation with those of the 100-type Key Equipment.  Have you found those docs on TCI as I suggested?

[Babybearjs]

the 100 series key equipment would be the right category, though the manufacturer may be AE. as I said at the beginning, I got this from Phoneco. and if you've ever done business with them, they really don't know anything about some of the stuff they sell... key equipment especially. I'm still working on the switch box and found that I have to daisy chain the switches in such a way as have a lockout feature so only 1 dial tone is heard at a time....the other tell tale sign it is a AE unit is the marking on the base... I have a Line + line - HL (hold lamp) and a HY marking for each phone line..  so because I've messed with the old AE secraterial answering units... the terminal marking are the same for the phone line.... WE used T/R and AE used +/- for the phone line.... the TCI Library does not have anything on the AE 100 series switch boxes....(if that even is the right name for their version of the switch boxes....)

[Alex G. Bell]

the 100 series key equipment would be the right category, though the manufacturer may be AE. as I said at the beginning, I got this from Phoneco. and if you've ever done business with them, they really don't know anything about some of the stuff they sell... key equipment especially.

I'm still working on the switch box and found that I have to daisy chain the switches in such a way as have a lockout feature so only 1 dial tone is heard at a time....the other tell tale sign it is a AE unit is the marking on the base... I have a Line + line - HL (hold lamp) and a HY marking for each phone line..  so because I've messed with the old AE secraterial answering units... the terminal marking are the same for the phone line.... WE used T/R and AE used +/- for the phone line....

the TCI Library does not have anything on the AE 100 series switch boxes....(if that even is the right name for their version of the switch boxes....)

I'm well familiar with the intricacies of dealing with Phoneco.

Of course you have to daisy chain the keys.  Yes the + & - could be AE but for that matter could be anything but WECo.

The TCI library info on WECo 100-type would be applicable to any key box with the same key contact configurations but OTOH even if the AE docs were there for their equivalent system (assuming it really is AE: a close up of the keys would help resolve that.) AE docs would have the same limits with respect to applicability to 1A/1A1/1A2 because the 3rd HOLD position on each key holds the line directly and it cannot be released from hold by another station answering as it was in 1A and later and even the earlier residential so-called "PBX" which was actually a key system too.

So what I am saying here is that to use a key box where (uniquely) the line key remains in the hold position throughout the hold condition with 1A2 KSU equipment you are in uncharted territory.  1A2 expects the hold initiation condition to be transient, not persistent throughout the duration of the hold condition.  Even 101 Type Key Equipment used a momentary condition to initiate the hold condition.  If you want another 1A2 station to be able to re-answer a call placed on hold by this key box you will have to "differentiate" the edge: that is, use some additional circuit to cause the hold condition initiated by operating the key to the last position apply only a momentary hold signal to the KTU.  A pair of relays could accomplish this, perhaps a pair for all lines, perhaps a pair per line.  Perhaps a pre-charged capacitor and a single relay could too.