New To Old Phones

[Nuke]

Greetings -

Trying to rig up an old 202 phone to a wooden 297g subset (ringer box). Apparently this subset went with an old candlestick phone at one time. Got the phone to work (receive/dial) but the ringer bells don't ring. The relay seems to activate and buzzes on incoming call. When I bought the subset I thought the seller mentioned something about bypassing something in the box in order to get the ringer to work. Any ideas would be welcome.

[Phonesrfun]

Nuke:

Welcome to the forum.  Can you post some pictures of the inside wiring of each; the 202 and the subset?

[Wallphone]

Where can you find info on a 297 subset?
Dougpav

[Wallphone]

OK, I got a little further. On page 71 of the latest edition of Old-Time Telephones by Ralph O. Meyer is a 295 subset. It has a #20 induction coil in it. Now all we have to do is find out what a #20 coil is. It is probably just a booster coil.
Dougpav

[Phonesrfun]

It's a sidetone booster.  Take a look at page 114.

I am unfamiliar with a 297 too.  I wanted to see the pictures, because the relay part was what I was wondering about.

[Nuke]

Hello again -

This is a 202 phone. I think I read somewhere on the net that someone rewired a 297 g subset to behave like a 295 subset. There is a schematic in the box.  

[Phonesrfun]

Hello again -

This is a 202 phone.

I saw my typo and revised my post.

[bingster]

There may have been a slight wiring change from 295 to 297, but they should have the same components.  Try making your wiring conform to this, EXCEPT for the black ringer wire, which should, if I'm not mistaken, be connected to L1.



From there, the mounting cords conductors are connected: Yellow to L2, Green to 4, and Red to 2.  If you have a black mounting cord conductor, tape it off, as there's nowhere to connect it with this subset.  If you receive too much sidetone, try reversing the red and yellow connections.

[Nuke]

Here is what the box looks like. The red and green wires on the bottom are L1 and L2. Red to L1. The middle screw terminal between them is ground. I have nothing connected to it but it has an internal connection. The black wire is from the phone. It has 4 wires. Red, green and yellow are connected. I left the black wire from it disconnected. The phone works ok. Except the ringer doesn't ring but the relay buzzes like it is ringing. Maybe I should see if I could post the schematic in the box. That would help describe how everything is hooked together.

[Nuke]

Alright. Here is another picture. You should be able to enlarge it if you double click on it.

[Phonesrfun]

This is do-able.

This subset is very much like a 295, except that it has the relay that is installed ahead of the ringer for polarity party line ringing.  The ringer itself looks like the standard ringer, so that is a good thing. 

The problem is that the relay and one side of the ringer appear to be hard wired in the circuit, which means that in order to rewire this to be the same as a 295, it will involve some desoldering, moving and resoldering of some wires, rather than just unscrewing some from one post and moving them to another.

How do you feel about changing the physical wiring, and how good are you at soldering?

[Nuke]

Hi - I don't have a problem with rewiring and am pretty good with a soldering iron. The guy I bought it from said I needed to mod it to ring with the 202. (I assume that I would have to mod it to ring with, say a candlestick, anyway.)

[Phonesrfun]

Hi back:

The subset will do its ringing whether there is a candlestick, or a 202 or no phone at all connected to it. 

Your oval base "D" mount will be wired as a 102 with this subset, since the subset was made before the time of antisidetone subsets.  The difference between a 102 and a 202 is not whether the base was round or oval, but rather whether they are wired as sidetone or antisidetone.  Your desk set has four wires coming from it meaning that it was wired to be used in an antisidetone situation and therefore was intended to be a 202.  Without the black wire connected you have a 102.  The black wire coming from the desk set will not be used and will need to be taped and stored, or connected to an unused terminal post.

I will take a look at the wiring and we can go from there on making the changes.  For now, can you confirm that the red ringer wire is soldered onto the relay, and that a slate wire from the relay connects to post #3 on the induction coil?

[Nuke]

Using an ohmmeter, there is continuity between the red wire on the relay and the GND screw post. Also, there is continuity between slate wires and # 3.


So it looks like we are trying to bypass the relay?  I think it also has a Type 8A 1000 Ohm ringer that also has a 3000 Ohm coil. Does that coil need to be disabled?

[Phonesrfun]

Let's try it with the relay in the circuit first.  A connection that would possibly work, depending on the total relay resistance would be to hook the red relay wire (X) to L1 and hook the black ringer wire (Z ) to L2  This is not shown as an option in the diagram, but may work.  If that does not work or doesn't worl well enough, you will have to bypass the relay, and I would also use a second capacitor, in addition to the one built into the subset.

The single capacitor circuit was fine for candlesticks, but a dial handset phone gets too much of a pop in the receiver when the dial comes to a rest using a single capacitor. 

I was out of pocket the last couple of days, and tomorrow at work promises to be a busy one, but hopefully we can get you up and running soon.