Help with Amphenol Connectors for 1A1/1A2 Key Phones

[RotarDad]

I am trying to figure out which adapter I need to connect a multi-line WE565 to a modular phone jack.  Can someone tell me if this Amphenol connector is male or female?  I think I need a 258A or 258B adapter to convert the lines to modular, but I have yet to see a good pic of the adapter's connector to verify it will fit the 565's connector.  From what I've read, the 258A and B have male connectors.  Thanks very much for the help!

[twocvbloke]

If it has a sticky-outy bit in the plug, it's usually male, if it has a hole or a slot in the plug (well, socket really), it's usually female...

[ESalter]

Connectors are sometimes confusing.  They are marked by the gender of the actual contacts, not the connector housing.  Lots of times one side of a connector will have male pins in a female housing, and the other side will be the opposite.  I want to say they're described like that 100% of the time, but it's probably more like 99% of the time.

---Eric

[paul]

That looks male to me. I remember the modular adapters going on the amphenol cables coming out of the wall, letting single line sets be plugged in, so that leads me to say the key phone would have a male as well.

[RotarDad]

I'm gathering that the plug on the phone is male, but that most of the adapters such as the 258A and B are male also.  I think I found a reference on the internet to to a 258AF which was female.  I haven't found one for sale yet - perhaps this is an uncommon item?  A gender changer was also mentioned - which would connect the phone to a 258A or B.  I'll keep looking - my goal was to make it easy to get a 565 running with my home line and my Panasonic 616.  Thanks for all the input! 

[AE_Collector]

That is a male Amphenol pictured and every Key set I have seen has a Male connector. All cabling we put in for key systems had female connectors and we also used R66 blocks which had a female Amphenol in them brought out to 66 punchdowns.

If you could get some female Amphenols and a tool to punch wire into the correct pins on them you could then add a phone jack to the end of the wire to make an "Adapter".

I have some small handheld blocks that you put an Ampenol on to punch the wires into it. I also have the bit to do the punching which fits intothe Dracon type of 66 tool. If you see your self doing much of this I can put a kit together for you though I don't know if I have a lot of Female Amphenols around. I need to take a look for them.

Terry

[TelePlay]

- my goal was to make it easy to get a 565 running with my home line and my Panasonic 616.

First, aren't most female DB50 connectors wall, rack or chassis mounted leaving the line cord to be the male connector?

Second, I went through this a few months ago and found that wiring a 565 through the 25 pair connector did not work with a standard POTS line. The 565 I used had the line cord cut off about 6 inches from the phone so did not have the connector but did have every one of the 25 pair wires available to a POTS (616) connection. The 565 I had was wired to work with a 1A2 key system and without being attached to all that circuity, I could not get the phone to work as a standard phone. I ended up removing all of the wiring (sorry 565 fans) and rewired it as a standard 500 to work on line 1. Lot of guys tried to help me with the wiring but following the in and out connections on the 25 pairs showed me that a lot of stuff goes on in the 1A2 with respect to line selection, ringing, correct lamp function (solid on, slow blinking, fast blinking) and placing a call on hold that I could not get around to have the phone work as a 500 without major rewiring. I needed it for a stage play so I had to create a 10 VAC power supply to light the lamp under the Line 1 button and run that power down the black/yellow wires of the line cord, and used a separate switch in the tech booth to light the lamp when appropriate as a 1 second cycle blink and solid on using a 555 circuit. I have looked at 616s but those are not 1A2 system with all they have to make a 565 fully functional. The switchers can correct me if this is wrong but that is what I found out and how I got my 565 to work on a POTS line, or a 616 line, by using L1 and L2. The lamp under the button will not work without a 1A2 to the best of my limited knowledge.

Here's a link to a 25 pair wiring guide and several 25 pair cables. I know the wiring guide is elsewhere on this forum, or in the TCI library, and those can be used to figure out which wires are used do what in a 565.

http://tinyurl.com/chta5ll

The 565 wiring diagram from the TCI library shows how the 25 pair are connected to a 1A2 system to make the 565 work.

Finally, this should probably be moved into the switching section of this forum.

[RotarDad]

Thanks for all the tech support!  It sounds like my plan to simply connect a 565 to a modular adaptor won't work.  My plan was to have 2 lines active (one for my outside line and one line on my in-house 616) and just have the buttons activate the lines.  I thought I could move the ringer wires directly to one line so just that line would ring.  I understand the lights and other functions wouldn't work, but it sounds like even the standard lines may not work without the proper system equipment.

[TelePlay]

It may be possible to do it that but it's beyond my knowledge level. The key system guys on this forum should be able to help you with which pairs to use in the connector and the ringer wiring inside the phone to make it work that way. I'm sure others have done that before, I just can't find it on the forum right now.

[G-Man]

A 565 will work on pots lines without any modifications! When a power-failure is experienced the key equipment is not able to function and the key phones behind it can dial-out and receive calls without it.

In any event a proper adapter will allow individual lines to be connected directly to each line button. Of course you will not have status lamps, be able to put the line on hold, etc, but you will be able to use it like any other standard pots telephone.

While you can connect the internal ringer to one of the incoming lines, you may need to have an external ringer for each additional line.

When I have time I will look through my ATT catalogs for the correct adapter.

The other solution would be to connect the way Terry has suggested or to obtain a stub of 25-pair cable with the proper connector attached. Then wire the appropriate tip/ring pairs to your Panasonic/pots lines.

[G-Man]

I have colorized tip and ring of the cable conductors in the attached TCI 565 wiring diagram to make it easier to distinguish which wires you will need to connect for pots service.

The colors of the conductors for each line are as follows:

Line 1 – Blue/White - White/Blue (BL-W/W-BL)
Line 2 – Brown/White – White/Brown (BR-W/W-Br)
Line 3 – Orange/Red – Red/Orange (O-R/R-O)
Line 4 – Slate/Red – Red/Slate (S-R/R-S)
Line 5 – Green/Black – Black Green (G-BK/BK-G)

[RotarDad]

Thanks G-Man for the detailed info!  So far the only female adapter I can find online is the one pictured below, which is called a "3M Voicedata Universal Plug with High Profile Hood Amphenol Connector (Female)".

http://www.ebay.com/itm/350586308812

I can't see how the wires connect on the back - any ideas?  I'm guessing the numbers on the schematic are the pin-outs for the Amphenol: for example R = pin 1 and T = pin 26 for line 1.  For my purposes, I only need to connect two pair, so it shouldn't be too bad, and I don't really want to change much inside the 565.

[TelePlay]

This thread may be helpful. Finally found it.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=6685.0

This link has many amp connectors available.

http://tinyurl.com/64zamtn

[poplar1]

If you have access to a commercial building telephone room, there may be some abandoned RJ-21Xs. These are 66-type 50-pair blocks with an orange cover that opens up. Up to 25 Central Office lines can connect to these. On the side is a female amphenol jack. You can plug the 565  into this jack then punch down whatever leads you need. (If you punch down the wires on the left, you will need bridging clips to connect the left and right sides of the block.)

[AE_Collector]

From my experience it is unusual to find "Amp Adapters" as we called them in other than Male Plugs to RJ Jack. That Female one is a good find. The reason is that the main use for these adapters was when removing 1A2 type keyphones and reusing the existing cable for either single line phones directly off of a PBX or electronic key sets and/or digital PBX phones. Any time a new modular corded phone needing 1, 2 or 3 pairs was being installed where a 1A2 phone had just been removed. Thus the Amp Adapter ais lmost always a Male Amphenol plug.

If Female Amphenol plugs with an RJ plug built in such as the one shown can easily and inexpensively be found they are ideal to fire up a 1A2 set. As to which leads are connected inside, it is anyone's guess. The Amp Adapers we used to get at work initially were 4 conductor RJ Jacks connected to the first and second pair of the cable. The leads were soldered to the Amphenol Plug so not easy to rearrange.

Then we got a different type with 3 pair RJ jacks and they were not factory connected to the Amphenol so tha twe could put them on whichever pair(s) we want ed to. But as I said, these were always Male Plugs to connect with the In place wiring that had Female Amphenols.

I too agree that a Key Phone should work without flashing lights, hold function or ringer by just connecting to the correct Tip & Ring Pair of the set cord for the line key you want to use. BUT, much more fun to get the KSU to opearte things properly and 1A2 KSU's are one thing that I find EASY to find still.

Going to move this to Switching / Key Systems / 1A1 & 1A2 area

Terry