Kellogg Fiddleback with dial

[wds]

Just purchased this fiddleback.  The dial seems original to the phone, not added.  Does anyone know if these would have been issued with dials new from the factory?   Model # on the back is 5193.  Number on the label is 3380K.

[Sargeguy]

I think the fiddleback was obsolete by the time dials came along.  How big is the hole?

[wds]

Hole is a hair under 3".

[G-Man]

Diagram looks like it was printed by a refurbisher such as TRS.

They may have sold them to desperate telcos during the Depression or WWII.

[Sargeguy]

Ouch.  If it were me I would try to restore it.  I love fiddlebacks.  The shelf is three pieces of wood.  The front part is the trickiest to replicate and that is still intact, the other two pieces would be relatively simple if you could find a router bit that matched the edge.  Or better yet find an entirely new shelf.  I was able to find one for a Western Electric 301A I restored, so it might be worth a shot.

[Doug Rose]

Hole is a hair under 3".

Dave...I think the dial was an after add. That being said, I think the phone has style with it. The diagrams shows a dial, so it was sold that way. Does it work? I'd clean it up and display it proudly. Not everything fits into an exact mold. A lot was done to telephones after they left the factory....Doug

[wds]

I definitely like it with the dial.  A little different than my other fiddlebacks, and it still has some historical significance with the added dial.  It's in really nice shape, so it's a keeper. 

[Jim Stettler]

I suspect a war shortage set. I would leave it as it is.
JMO,
Jim

[wds]

It would be nice to know a date for the refurb.  Poor mans phone I suspect.

[poplar1]

No dial sets are shown in Kellogg's 1943 War Time Catalog#300  for rebuilt sets.

http://www.strombergcarlsontelephone.com/kellogg/kellogg_main.htm

However, diagram does not look like T.R.&S.


http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=7473.0

By the way, the non-dial version of this fiddleback as well as dial desk stands, grabaphones, and metal wall phones are included in the 1926 Kellogg Catalog #7. So the fiddleback was not necessarily obsolete by the time Kellogg was manufacturing dial phones. However, the phones shown in the 1926 catalog had the small Kellogg dial, not the 3" AE dial on this set.

[G-Man]

As I stated earlier,

Diagram looks like it was printed by a refurbisher such as TRS.
They may have sold them to desperate telcos during the Depression or WWII.

The diagram certainly looks similar to those pasted in a dozen or so of the instruments in our collection, which were refurbished by Dan and his crew, but that is not the point; it could have been printed by any of the other dozens of refurbishers that were in business at the time.

Through the years diagrams pasted in Dan Mac(kenzie) rebuilds varied greatly but as I said it looks like it was printed by a refurbisher such as TRS.

The best way to date it might be to attempt to determine the date of the dial but even that is not a sure thing.

[rdelius]

Diagram looks like AE-Autelco.Look for a circled AR stamped somewhere.Is dial AE or a Kellogg copy of an AE?.During the wwll years there was a shortage of civilian telephone sets so old obsolete parts and junk would have been refurbished

[G-Man]

Diagram looks like AE-Autelco.Look for a circled AR stamped somewhere.Is dial AE or a Kellogg copy of an AE?.During the wwll years there was a shortage of civilian telephone sets so old obsolete parts and junk would have been refurbished

I would have expected them to have their full name printed on the label to remind the telco who to place future orders with though it could very well have been refurbished by Autelco since they, along with Stromberg Carlson, Kellogg and others had refurbishing departments during the Depression and World War Two.

However, as part of the refurbishing process, generally they also replaced the transmitters and receivers of their competitors with a bulldog style that was made by them. I would have expected for one of the larger manufacturers to also replace the induction coil and convert the circuit to AST.

It would appear as if this set probably was not refurbished during WWII but more likely during the Great Depression.         

[G-Man]

Additional...

It is stamped XR and not AR. Also take a look at the schematic; the symbol for the dial is different from what was used by A.E.

Again, identifying and dating the dial may help.       

[poplar1]

Kellogg in the 1943 Wartime Catalog offers different options for rebuilding customers' phones. They could be refurbished with  "standard" transmitter, "non-positional" (bulldog) transmitter, or updated with a handset. The price of course varied by which option was chosen.