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Info to eBay sellers

Started by HarrySmith, June 22, 2010, 03:34:08 PM

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HarrySmith

I don't know if this would apply to anyone here but it is something that has been on my mind. It is not about any one auction but about all auctions. Sometimes there are sellers on eBay that do not know what they have and do not attempt any research on the item. This applies quite frequently to phones, to them it is just an old phone and it is pretty much useless because they cannot plug it in and use it. They usually provide only 1 picture and very little description, something like "old green dial telephone", and start the auction really low, $5-$10. This is a good thing for us collectors who are on a budget! What I am getting at is sometime while the auction is still active the seller will add to the description "I was just told by a knowledgeable collector that this phone is.......". I have been watching or bidding on phones and at this point the seller has ended the auction and relisted the phone at a much higher price or suddenly a $9.00 phone that has had no interest other than me for 4 days will receive numerous other bids! I know part of our mission is to educate the general public on these wonderful pieces of technical wizardry but can't it wait until after someone gets a good deal on a rare phone? I myself have sent sellers many questions on phones but I try to keep them general in case they get posted in the auction, which they usually do. I will also send a message to a seller if he has the wrong info on his phone so someone is not misled, this is usually appreciated but I have also received answers such as "mind your own business and don't bid on it"! What I am asking here is ,if it is at all possible, for us not to tell these people what it is if they don't know! Imagine what would have happened with the prototype Dan just got if someone had told the seller "what you have there is a valuable, rare 1948 prototype 500 telephone which may be one of a kind and is priceless". The price would have skyrocketed! Just my thoughts on this as it recently happened that I missed out on a good deal in just this manner. I hope my little rant does not upset anyone, I am just throwing it out for discussion and to hear other peoples opinions.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Russ Kirk

#1
I cannot agree with you more.  Telephone collecting knowledge is great if it is shared within our community,  but not when you want to buy something cheap.  

I understand those nice people that want  to "help" others,  but in the end it will only drive all our costs artificially high.   There are those people that send sellers messages on the true value so they won't stop the auction and do a private sale.  IMHO both of those are not the choice many would choose.  

A good example is just like when recently one person got that rare blue mushroom phone,  no one faulted them for not telling the seller that had a gold mine.  NO,  the buyer quietly got it for forty bucks, ran out the door, sped down the street and had a great tale to tell.  Hooray for him!

eBay auctions should be the same as buying in a store or flea market.

If sellers choose not to take the proper time to research items -  it is their choice and perhaps their loss.  I for one, when I'm selling on eBay,  do extensive research.  

Case in point; a while back I got some Boy Scout patches from my late father.  Junk to me,  but after a few hours research I determined they were truly rare items.  I properly identified them on eBay and netted over $4000 for only 7 patches.


Russ......



- Russ Kirk
ATCA & TCI

Dennis Markham

Harry, we did talk about "Mr Helpful" before and have mentioned his/her name several times.  Here's one of the earlier threads.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=1042.0

You're on the same page........

Dan/Panther

deja vu, all over again.
D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

mariepr

Indict me as a "Ms. Helpful" who has at times emailed naive sellers about the value of their listing.  From how I interpret the original thread in this topic, sellers who don't make any effort to research their offering have no kit coming to them if it ultimately sells below market value.  Fair enough.  But what of buyers who email sellers with totally false information?  One specific case was a stick with #2AB dial that the seller was told was a repro but would he consider a $100 buy it now "for parts"? 

The other component to this argument is the plea for a Buy-it-Now when it was not initially offered.  I'm supposed to have some consideration for fellow collectors by keeping mum on the value of phones sold by naive sellers.  But where's the reciprocal consideration?  Are buyers not shutting out fellow collectors by negotiating an early end to the auction?  Just about all of us have been on the wrong end of that situation.  You think you have until Saturday night to bid but - poof!  Member X has called the seller and negotiated an abrupt end two days early.

Jim Stettler

Here is how I handle Ebay. This is the way I do it. Everyone has their own ways.

I don't offer up info. If I think someone will try to get the auction to end early, I will place a bid to make it harder to close.

I also try to hold my questions until close to the end of the auction, since some sellers post the questions and answers.


I typically don't post open auctions on the listservers or forum. If it is an item I am not trying to win, I may privately advise another collector who I think has interest. I have gotten the same consideration from other collectors.

I think I have lost a few nice pieces because the open auction was "outed" on the list. I spend a lot of time doing specific searches. It is really annoying when someone points out a cool item on day 9 of a 10 day auction and I have had a loaded snipe since 4 hours after listing. Typically this is because they stumbled upon it.

I don't make offers to get the auction to end early, however I have been burned because someone else did. I will ask about the reserve price and about 1/2 the time they will tell me.


I no longer share my search secrets, because once someone else knows, it is no longer secret and they will eventually tell someone else


I almost always snipe everything. I use a cheap service called auctionsniper.
(I almost didn't share the snipe point)

I started sniping when it appeared some  buyers would watch my bidding for items of interest. (This doesn't work anymore since ebay went with hidden handles.)
This is how I ebay. You can ebay however you want.
JMO,
JIM
You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

Dan/Panther

It is very easy to find a ball park figure for the value of an item On ebay. If the seller is to lazy to do 5 minutes research, they deserve to get burned.
It goes both way when a sellers asks $100 for a common modular set.

D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

HarrySmith

My point exactly, if someone can't be bothered to do a little research on an item then they get what they deserve. My wife & I research every item we sell on eBay. I believe the more information you can provide the better, and it has paid off, we have sold items for more money when there were others, exactly the same for a lot less than ours, the only difference was we had a thorough description and lots of pictures,

As to people lying to a seller in an attempt to get an item cheap, I guess there will always be thieves and liars out there and fools for them to prey on. The thought of doing something like that never even entered my mind.

When bidding on eBay I have my own preferences which include putting in the first bid early and putting in my final bid late. I have won more than one auction for the starting bid of 99 cents. I have also lost an item for $1.05 because I did not get back in time to put in another bid. I do not trust the sniper programs I have looked at so I don't use them, if I lose there will be another opportunity.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

jsowers

I totally agree with Jim on every single point. Well said, Jim.

I have in the past told one seller she was selling a dial-in-handset prototype when she knew nothing about what she had, in order to thwart what I call vultures. The people who make low-ball offers to end the auction early, or make it a Buy-it-Now and take advantage of the seller not knowing the value. They literally buy the best phones out from under us. That is so unfair! Yes, it has happened more times than I can count. A couple of times I was actually able to convince the seller not to sell to a vulture and the phone got re-listed.

A week ago I asked a question about a beige 554 that the seller said was soft plastic and "old beige." I also offered some advice, and it was not taken well. I advised them that the 7-hole handset and cord were not original to the phone and the color of the phone was light beige, because the housing was made in 8-58. I had a bid in the sniper and when I looked the next day, they had banned me from bidding on the phone!! They didn't get any other bids on their Frankenphone, which made me smile a little. They banned the only person in the world who was interested in their phone. So some sellers do not welcome outside information.
Jonathan

Greg G.

Quote from: HarrySmith on June 22, 2010, 03:34:08 PM
Sometimes there are sellers on eBay that do not know what they have and do not attempt any research on the item. ...

What I am getting at is sometime while the auction is still active the seller will add to the description "I was just told by a knowledgeable collector that this phone is.......".

... at this point the seller has ended the auction and relisted the phone at a much higher price or suddenly a $9.00 phone that has had no interest other than me for 4 days will receive numerous other bids!

That's the ol' "Mr. Helpful" you're referring to.  He's been mentioned a few times in this forum because others (including myself) have experienced the same frustration regarding his "helpful" information to sellers.  Not even sure if it's a single person who does that, but there was a pattern that was similar on several auctions. 

But yes, correcting wrong information is one thing, but a bargain is a bargain.  I too look for the bargains and outright "steals".  The question I most often ask the uninformed is regarding the bottom.  They often don't post a picture of it, so I ask them to either post one or describe the condition and markings on the bottom.  Not too long ago, I acquired a stash of phones from a local seller on CL.  I gave him the asking price and wasn't about to tell him that the collection was worth much more, and I see nothing wrong with that.  The guy was even a retired phone installer.  If somebody saw the same ad on CL and informed them prior that they could get much more for even just one of the phones and he jacked up the price accordingly, I'd have been very upset!
The idea that a four-year degree is the only path to worthwhile knowledge is insane.
- Mike Row
e

Dan/Panther

I agree also 100% with Jim. I was on pins and needles for 5 days on the 48-500 prototype, scared to death someone would post a question to the forum asking what it was.
Like Jim, I spend Hours searching obscure titles for gems, and do not appreciate someone posting far all to see. If you want the hard finds, look for them.
D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

Jim Stettler

Retired phone guys typically think the phones aren't worth much. Also on group purchases if you make your offer based on how much cash you think will make them happy, they will probably go for it.

I estimate my offer on the # and type of phones, I then will round it up or down depending on what amount I think they will take.
You can tell some folks will counter you anyway, So make your offer $135 vs $150. They will counter $150, you think for a minute or two and say "sounds fair enough".

Hand them the cash, your card and shake hands and thank them.

They will tell there phone buddies  what a fool you were for paying high on those old phones, and you will be excited at the bargain you just got. You may even get a call from their buddy that wants to sell you some more old phones.
Pretty much a win-win all around.
JMO,
Jim

You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

Just4Phones


HarrySmith

#13
Yes! That is exactly what I was talking about! Somebody could have gotten a nice phone for $15.00. Now after Mr. Helpful chimed in it will probably go sky high!

Another example: did someone here get this 5302?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250654446584&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT ( dead link 04-13-21 )

I saw this days ago and waited until the last day before I asked my 2 usual questions; Is there any lettering or numbers stamped on the bottom and how many holes in the earpiece? The seller responded with enough info to determine it is a 1957 5302. I already knew the "F" handset would have 6 holes. I almost bid but I just purchased some 5302's so I did not really need it. I was about to post it here so someone could get a good deal on a nice phone as it had no bids with hours to go. Then it got a bid so I did not post it. I figured maybe someone here was the bidder.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Just4Phones

This one made me chuckle.  $700.00?  Yellow soft plastic 500's may be rare but  ::)


http://tinyurl.com/2eeeq7v