how did so many vintage phones manage to survive?

[kwatter04]

I'm still fairly new to all of this, so please help me understand something: how did old phones (particularly pre-500 phones, and for the purposes of this discussion I'll focus on Ma Bell/WE) manage to escape destruction and still exist today? Let's take for example the beloved WE 302.  It was produced in the late 30's and 40's and then phased out as the 500 was introduced. These phones were rentals, and (as I understand) returned to WE as the 500's were deployed. How did some of these returned 302's escape destruction/landfill/conversion to a 5302? shouldn't the 302 have been practically made extinct by WE decades ago? Were some not returned like they should have been? did WE employees save some of the phones from being junked? any estimates on the survival rate of the 302? ahhh, so many questions!!

Kyle

[deedubya3800]

This is one of my favorites topics for discussion! Here's a thread from a while back where we talked about this very thing: http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=224

[GG]

A few things:

302s, as well as AE 40s, Kellogg 1000s, SC 1243s, and suchlike "1940s/50s" phones, were also sold to non-Bell "Independent" telcos, in large quantities, hundreds or thousands at a time. 

The WE 302s that were used by independents, did not have the "Bell System" marking on the handset, only "Western Electric" and "F1" and "Made in USA" etc., all the details of which can be found on Paul F's website.

When independent telcos were done with their stuff, i.e. obsolete types removed from service during major replacement periods, such as when AE 80s and the various 500 sets came along, the telcos would save up piles of the old stuff.  Then periodically they would sell the piles to telco supply houses, such as Bohnsack Equipment Co., who would refurbish the phones and sell them to the surplus stores, to electronics shops such as Radio Snack, to specialty phone stores such as Metropolitan Teletronics, and so on. 

That's how a huge quantity of these phones ended up on the market.  Large numbers of them were sold to the public this way, and just kept on ticking, used as "bootleg" extensions before deregulation. 

Now as for the phones used by Bell operating companies, such as 302s with the Bell System markings on the handsets: chances are these just "slipped through the cracks" in a multitude of ways.  A friendly telco technician said "sure, you can keep that one for sentimental value."  A house or store was sold and the new owner cleverly disconnected the old phone and later hooked it up.  An office building with a large PBX had its storage rooms cleaned out including a batch of NOS 302s and a pile of disconnects sitting in the PBX room.  A janitorial crew cleaned out a vacated apartment and one of the crew members kept the "abandoned" phone. 

Unlike antique cars, old phones were small enough to be squirreled away in the attic and then rediscovered later.  And they were built to last forever.  Thus the large quantities surviving to this day.

I'd find it hard to guess whether there are more Bell or non-Bell 302s in circulation now.  Bell had an enormous quantity but only a small percentage "slipped through the cracks."  The indies had a smaller quantity but all of theirs eventually ended up getting sold at retail one way or another.  Folks who are trying to assemble a more complete collection of WE equipment tend to seek out examples of both Bell and non-Bell examples of each model. 

Both of the 302s that are within arm's reach of me at this moment, have non-Bell handsets on them: Western Electric Company, F1W, Made in USA.  Yet I know I have another one around here somewhere that says Bell System on it, and a 5302 with Bell markings, and another one without.  Hmm...

[Willytx]

When my sister bought her house in 1990, the 354 was still hanging in the kitchen and the Princess phone was still in a bedroom. The seller and original owner of the early 1950s house called SBC to come get their phones, which they never did. One of my sister's friends grabbed the 354 the day she got the keys to the house. I took the 1962 Princess.

[Greg G.]

... old phones were ... built to last forever.  Thus the large quantities surviving to this day.

What GG said, especially this part.  When they were owned by Ma Bell, or at the least, they were not a user-owned device, it was to Ma Bell's interest and bottom line to make them last.  I know I sound like a stuck record, but for further reading, I recommend The Rape of Ma Bell. Here's a link to a PDF version, or you can get a hard copy for a few bucks from Amazon.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=5791.msg69838#msg69838

[Sargeguy]

As was said earlier a lot of the older equipment was abandoned by Ma Bell when it became obsolete.  Also telco employees saved old phones that interested them.  I disagree that there are more independent phones that survived.   A higher percentage survived but there were so many Bell System phones out there that more of them exist today.  Almost all of my 302s and 500s are Bell System.  With older (intact) candlesticks (pre-WW1) it seems to be about 50/50.