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Need help getting a KTAS DO 08 type wall phone with added dial to work - wiring help needed

Started by Lee58, August 20, 2017, 10:39:03 PM

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TelePlay

Quote from: Victor Laszlo on August 21, 2017, 10:39:45 PM
Serial is the only way. I agree completely that complex and divergent are not the way. That's why I tried to get him back on track and answer the questions, one at a time, so that we would all have an idea of what's inside the phone.

Great, I agree with one "try this" at a time and then move on to the next suggestion based on results.

But I think the first question should have been, what are the Blue/Black, White/Green and Brown/Black wires attached to out side the housing? and not put blue and white on #1 and #4

The Brown/Black wire coming into the housing seems to be hand twisted onto a cloth wire attached to the hook switch (as seen in the side photos he posted, not this one annotated to show the brown wire).

I think he need to tell us where or what they are attached to at the wall. Maybe the Brown/Black wire is not attached to anything at the wall. I don't know. We didn't ask and he didn't tell us yet. Once we know what those 3 wires coming into the phone are connected to, everything posted to here is irrelevant.

This is what I mean about the Brown/Black wire.

Lee58

I am a her not a him not that it matters.
Appreciate the help.
I attached the wires per Teleplays diagram.
Now I need to attache the red and green conductor wires from the line cord.
Not sure which terminals they belong to.

Lee58

the brown and black is odd  it is soldered to a green wire

TelePlay

Quote from: Lee58 on August 21, 2017, 11:36:21 PM
I am a her not a him not that it matters.
Appreciate the help.
I attached the wires per Teleplays diagram.
Now I need to attache the red and green conductor wires from the line cord.
Not sure which terminals they belong to.

Doesn't matter. Red to White/Green and Green to Blue/Black or vice versa outside the housing.

Seems like you are saying the Blue and White wires are not attached to anything outside the housing. In that case, you could have simply attached the Red and Green conductor line cord wires directly to #1 and #4. Or solder or twist them together out side the housing (red to Blue/Black and green to White/Green).

Is the Brown/Black attached to anything outside the housing?

Also, put some electrical take around that soldered connection (Brown/Black to green cloth wire) to make sure it does not contact anything in that tight area.

Lee58

looks like the green wire that the brown black is soldered to is connected to the left of the tubular cylinder of which I do not know what it is called

rdelius

look for a diagram for KTAS DO 08 set. it has the same basic parts.Yours was modified with a dial later.The handset is at one end of the terminal strip and the line connections were uasualy the 1st and 2nd or third on the other end.that metal tubular device is an inductor.This set has a toroidial  induction coil.DSK should have diagram

TelePlay

Quote from: Lee58 on August 22, 2017, 12:02:00 AM
looks like the green wire that the brown black is soldered to is connected to the left of the tubular cylinder of which I do not know what it is called

That is the capacitor or condenser (same thing) which has a good chance of being part of the ring circuit.

One of our members in Europe may have a wiring diagram or schematic for a KTAS DO 08 telephone to help you out. May even be able to help you fix this, get it working. You are going to learn a lot of stuff figuring out what the wiring is and what it should be.

But being a European phone, I know good help for you is out there.

I attached a wiring diagram I found on the forum for a KTAS DO 08. It's not right for your phone but it gives you an idea of what's inside.

There are some additional pictures of a similar phone at this link

     http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=4640.msg101596#msg101596

Here's an image from that topic that shows the handset connections but I can't quite make out the line cord terminals



Here's a good link to a similar phone, how it was taken apart and rebuilt

     http://www.bigdoer.com/3048/old-things/ktas-d08-phone-rebuilt/

This is all a "got to start somewhere" post which shows sort of what you have and kind of like it should be wired. Better than trying to picture it in you mind. With this, someone in Europe or someone in the US who rebuilt one can help you get it working.


Lee58

Thank you I had tried both wiring suggestions from earlier posts but they did not work.
Are you suggesting I start a new post but stating it is a European phone I am needing help with?

TelePlay

Wait for a few hours. The experts in Europe are just waking up so if they can help, they should reply in the next 20 hours or so.

dsk

Hi
The layout of the terminal stip is not the most used, I have to do som guessing.  If I have guessed right the terminals 1 and 7 is to the transmitter, 2 and 3 to the receiver 5 and 6 goes to the ringer. 7 and 8 will be to the telephone line. I do not know how the dial is wired. A typical european way would be to have the pulse contacts in series with the transmitter, and the shunting wires across the line, before or after the hooksw.


It looks like we cant get enough pictures to be sure.  If you could follow the wires you could probably draw a schematic diagram.


Good luck!


dsk

Lee58

I moved the telephone wires to 7 and 8 but still no dial tone

TelePlay

Okay, that last image shows the Blue/Black, White/Green and Brown Black to from the ringer.



If this is how you found it to be wired when received or first opened



try putting the Blue/Black back on #2, the White/Green back on #8 and attach the line cord Red and Green to #7 and #8 directly as dsk suggested.



Then see what happens. No need to start moving wires around until we know where they were originally attached. When the dial was added, they used newer plastic wire. No problem with that.

It seems the assumption that the plastic blue and white wires were line cord wires when they are now seen as dial connections really sent this topic off in the wrong direction from the start. With help from dsk, time to start over, start from the beginning and if that does not fully work, we can start to trace out the existing wires before moving them around.

Lee58

Does it matter if I use top terminals or bottom terminals number 2 and 8 to attach the Bl/b or w/g?

TelePlay

With that help from dsk on where to attach the line cord, this image from another topic of the forum does indeed show the line cord attached to #7 and #8 using dsk's numbering.

The Blue/Black dial wire would go onto #7 and the White/Green to #1 using dsk's numbering diagram putting those two wired back where they were in the first picture of this topic.



The handset is attached to #7 (bridged to #6 with a metal strap), #1, #2 and #3 using dsk's numbering diagram.



Put the Blue/Black dial wire back onto #7 and the White/Green dial wire back onto #1 using dsk's numbering diagram. That puts the dial wiring back to the original terminals as shown in the first picture of this topic.

Attach the red and green from your line cord to terminals #7 and #8 using dsk's numbering diagram.

Then try the phone and tell us what works, if anything or if at all. If it doesn't, we can proceed from there.

TelePlay

Quote from: Lee58 on August 22, 2017, 01:32:47 PM
Does it matter if I use top terminals or bottom terminals number 2 and 8 to attach the Bl/b or w/g?

No, the top and bottom terminals are tied together vertically. Which ever is easier to get to is fine.

One thing we have to do is to use the number diagram (1 to 8) that dsk provided which is upside down or right side up from the one I first posted so we keep the numbering straight.

dsk's numbering has the handset wires on #1, #2, #3 and #7. Using that diagram, the dial wire Bl/b attaches to #7 and the W/g attaches to #1 and as suggested by dsk, red and green line cord wired would be attached to #7 and #8.