Ashtray phone won't dial out or ring.

Greg G. · November 26, 2011, 04:16:42 PM

So far the seller was correct, it doesn't dial out or ring, but will receive calls. The ringer is wired correctly (C1 and L1), and as far as I can tell, so is everything else. The dial is made by Telephonics Corporation, appears to have a manufacture date of 8-60.

Kenny C · November 26, 2011, 04:53:43 PM

Isn't there supposed to be a jumper between one set of those screws on the dial? I know I had to put one on my Kellogg 15G. I'm not sure which but I'm sure somebody knows.

LarryInMichigan · November 26, 2011, 07:34:58 PM

That dial was made for the Army Signal Corps. it is essentially the same as an AE dial, but with an extra pair of contacts which open when the dial is away from its rest position, like the WE dials had. My FTR dials have the same configuration. I assume that these dials were made that way so that they would work in circuits which required both WE and non-WE type dials. For this phone, the outer two contacts (on the left in the picture) will probably not be used.

What happens when you try to dial? Does the dial ever break dial tone? Does the dial turn at the proper speed? Do the pulsing contacts appear to be moving far enough apart from each other but not too far? If they are moving too far apart, you can rectify the situation by bending the thicker metal piece next to them outward very slightly. I had to do this on a couple of dials which were not working.

Does the ringer move or vibrate at all? If not, the first thing to do is to measure the resistance across it to make sure that the coils or wires are not broken. You could also connect it to a magneto and see if that makes it ring. If it looks good, the condenser may be the problem. You can try connecting the ringer to another phone.

Larry

Greg G. · November 26, 2011, 08:08:40 PM

Quote from: LarryInMichigan on November 26, 2011, 07:34:58 PM
That dial was made for the Army Signal Corps. it is essentially the same as an AE dial, but with an extra pair of contacts which open when the dial is away from its rest position, like the WE dials had. My FTR dials have the same configuration. I assume that these dials were made that way so that they would work in circuits which required both WE and non-WE type dials. For this phone, the outer two contacts (on the left in the picture) will probably not be used.

What happens when you try to dial? Does the dial ever break dial tone? Does the dial turn at the proper speed? Do the pulsing contacts appear to be moving far enough apart from each other but not too far? If they are moving too far apart, you can rectify the situation by bending the thicker metal piece next to them outward very slightly. I had to do this on a couple of dials which were not working.

Does the ringer move or vibrate at all? If not, the first thing to do is to measure the resistance across it to make sure that the coils or wires are not broken. You could also connect it to a magneto and see if that makes it ring. If it looks good, the condenser may be the problem. You can try connecting the ringer to another phone.

Larry

Get a dial tone, dial breaks tone, turns ok, but all I get is a busy signal as soon as the first digit is dialed. Ringer does not move or vibrate at all. I've got a device from Radio Shack to measure voltage with, but you'll have to guide me on how to use it

LarryInMichigan · November 26, 2011, 08:54:17 PM

Disconnect the two ringer leads, turn the knob on your meter to the "20K" Ohm position, and touch the two meter probes to the two ringer leads. What is the meter reading?

Larry

Greg G. · November 26, 2011, 10:41:48 PM

Quote from: LarryInMichigan on November 26, 2011, 08:54:17 PM
Disconnect the two ringer leads, turn the knob on your meter to the "20K" Ohm position, and touch the two meter probes to the two ringer leads. What is the meter reading?

Larry

2.96

LarryInMichigan · November 26, 2011, 10:52:36 PM

Quote from: Brinybay on November 26, 2011, 10:41:48 PM
Quote from: LarryInMichigan on November 26, 2011, 08:54:17 PM
Disconnect the two ringer leads, turn the knob on your meter to the "20K" Ohm position, and touch the two meter probes to the two ringer leads. What is the meter reading?

Larry

2.96

That sounds reasonable. If the ringer were bad, you would not measure any resistance. It is possible that the ringer condenser (capacitor) is bad. Make sure that the electrical contacts are all clean. If cleaning the contacts doesn't help, try connecting the ringer in a different phone. You can always buy a capacitor at Radio Shack. I do not know what the capacitance should be, but it is probably about .47 μF.

Larry

Greg G. · November 28, 2011, 03:34:32 PM

Hooked the ringer up to a known working 302. Got it to function by loosening that little screw in the back, but one minor detail - it ain't got no gongs! So now I'm in the market for a pair of gongs for a K-925. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLp5Y8BN3HM

Now, that just leaves the fact that it doesn't dial out.

LarryInMichigan · November 28, 2011, 03:44:38 PM

Quotebut one minor detail - it ain't got no gongs!

Perhaps they blew away on your drive home. That would mean that they were gong with the wind

I expect that it should not be difficult to find replacement gongs, especially with all the unwanted frequency ringers around.

Can you try temporarily try connecting a different dial in place of this one to verify that the problem is in the dial?

Larry

Greg G. · November 28, 2011, 03:53:17 PM

Quote from: LarryInMichigan on November 28, 2011, 03:44:38 PM
Quotebut one minor detail - it ain't got no gongs!

Perhaps they blew away on your drive home. That would mean that they were gong with the wind

I expect that it should not be difficult to find replacement gongs, especially with all the unwanted frequency ringers around.

Can you try temporarily try connecting a different dial in place of this one to verify that the problem is in the dial?

Larry

If I can do that w/o taking the dial completely out again. One thing I really HATE about this phone is the way the dial is mounted. It was a real PITA to get it back in!

Will any old pair of gongs do? I'm sure I have some here somewhere, I always salvage them from frequency ringers and toss the rest.

Greg G. · November 28, 2011, 04:11:16 PM

The answer to my own question regarding the gongs is no, the gongs in this one are apparently smaller than the ones I've salvaged out of WE's and AE's. Here's a size comparison:

LarryInMichigan · November 28, 2011, 04:21:53 PM

The gongs from the Kellogg Masterphones are pretty small. Someone must have some spares.

You should be able to try out another dial without physically removing this one. Just disconnect the two wires from the pulsing contacts.

Larry

Phonesrfun · November 28, 2011, 04:50:56 PM

Try Steve Hilsz for the gongs. I seem to recall I once got a whole ashtray ringer from him. I think those ringers are one of a kind. I doubt you will find any run of the mill gongs that will fit.

Greg G. · November 28, 2011, 08:50:28 PM

Quote from: LarryInMichigan on November 28, 2011, 04:21:53 PM
The gongs from the Kellogg Masterphones are pretty small. Someone must have some spares.

You should be able to try out another dial without physically removing this one. Just disconnect the two wires from the pulsing contacts.

Larry

There are 4 wires connected to the dial, I'm not sure which two are the pulsing contacts, I'll need guidance on that too. I have a 5H, a 4H, and some 9s I can use to test with.

LarryInMichigan · November 28, 2011, 09:12:16 PM

The pulsing contacts are the ones which are normally touching each other but move apart and together multiple times as the dial returns. In your dial picture earlier this thread, they are connected to the two terminals nearest the bottom of the picture. On a WE #4 or #5 dial, the pulsing contacts are connected to terminals "BK" and "Y".

Larry

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Ashtray phone won't dial out or ring.