No, not a name for some one off punk band, literal lamps used underground. In this case carbide lamps!
So the lantern bug has evolved yet again. After some reading up on mining equipment and the like for the early 1900s, I slowly became fascinated with the subject as a whole. It was not much of a mental jump to then think "oh wow, carbide headlamps are neat...." and sure enough they can be easily found online at what I think are decent prices....so off we go...
Without getting too heavy on the science etc, a crash course on carbide lamps:
In the late 1800s, most mining was done by the light of little oil lamps. These were are a far cry from a lantern, usually being a small tin pot (look like a mini watering can) with a wick poking out. Pined to hats, these open oily flames lit the way, but as you can imagine, were far from ideal.
In 1892, a means was found to commercially produce calcium carbide (CaC2) from lime, and by 1896, in home and portable calcium carbide lighting was becoming available in France. By 1900, the first carbide mining lamp was patented in the US. Most largely use the same design principle; two sealed chambers, top one filled with water and the lower with calcium carbide. A small valve allows water to drip down onto the carbide. The reaction created produces heat and acetylene gas. This gas is piped to a small jet where it can be lit, much like a small blow torch.....on your head.....
Now this particular example of carbide lamp is quite common. AutoLite, made by Universal Lamp Co, were in some form of production from 1901 to 1960 when batteries and a corporate buy-out ended production. This particular lamp is from about 1930s or so, no exact date markings have been found (yet).
Being shipped to me from Pittsburgh PA, coal mine central, it shows the time spent underground in the form of many many dents and bends. Does it work? Likely a "no" in that dept, but it is complete! Here are the as received pictures. Little lampy will not be in this state for long however. I aim to restore this to a point where it is fully functional, I already have a nice pick....might get the urge to mine.... ;D
The clip on the back is intended to slide into a clip on a miner's cap, and that is a sparker wheel in the reflector for lighting the lamp up. Accounts vary, but most claim these can run for 2-1/2 to 4 hours on a single "loading" depending on use. For scale the reflector is about 4 inches across.
Just watched a video on youtube of a science teacher restoring a carbide lamp that belonged to his great grandfather and lighting it for the first time since around 1938, has some good scientific stuff in there (both in how it works and how to clean the insides out):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyFTijbsZzo
YEAH, sounds like fun to have a blowtorch on your head!
Even more fun if they're used down coal mines where there's gas leaking into the mines... :o
Its amazing that it took the era of the LEDs to get away from these little things.
So far so good, got the whole thing apart and started cleaning it. Really not a lot to these in terms of parts. All brass with only a simple felt filter and a rubber gasket. It is in need of some help though, a learning curve to be sure, but being all brass and soldered together, this falls right into the plumbing dept....
The reflector is dented/cracked, gasket is well dried out, and it looks like the lower chamber hasn't been cleaned in about 70 years....
So far I was able to get the sparker working again thanks to a gutted bic lighter. The water control valve was a bit on the leaky side, so I heated and re-soldered the nub that forms the seal, and so far it seems to work. Gave the reflector a quick solder repair on the crack to hold it for now, haven't tried to straighten it yet.
A work in progress, but there is progress!
This is great stuff - I'm learning a lot! Thanks twocv for posting the video link. So great when these can restored to working condition.
Stopped at a gold mine yesterday (a very large, dumpy and smelly antique mall) that keeps stocking more and more items because the stuff they have is 4x over priced and never sell. Lots of stuff to look and in a glass cabinet, spotted this interesting carbide lamp, first I've ever seen in the wild (at an antique mall) attached to the helmet/cap. Had no price on it so the owner took it up front and called the seller while I looked for other stuff. Before she took it out of the cabinet, I grabbed this photo through the glass window. The helmet was made of fiberglass, very light in weight.
On leaving, I asked and the owner said "two twenty five" and my shocked question was "two dollars and twenty five cents?" thinking that was a deal, way below the $50 I was expecting. Owner gave me a funny look and said, no, $225. Way above my choke point so let the seller buyer it back from me. They sell on eBay as shown for ~$50 give or take $10.
Posting this here as an FYI of how they were used.
There's a similar shop in Durham that is like that, full of junk but with some interesting pieces, but totally overpriced, I found a few GPO 746 phones in there in pretty ratty condition, they wanted up to £40 a piece for them, they even had (probably still do!) a BTMC "Kettle" telephone in there for a price so high I just ignored it, it's sad that people try selling these things for extortionate prices, only to end up looking like a hoarder with their pile on public display... :-\
Finding a new gasket (that goes between the two chambers to keep the gas in) turned out to be quite easy. A quick tour of Lowes plumbing aisle gave me a few options to try.
On a negative note, now that the lower chamber has been getting cleaned up, there are several stress cracks on the sidewall. It honestly looks like the lower chamber was stressed from within (think water freezing in a copper pipe). I doubt this was caused by gas being produced too fast as I doubt it would hold back the level of pressure needed. I think instead the lack of cleaning allowed all the carbide residue to build up, hold moisture and swell up.
So far it seems like these aren't fatal, but I will try a few coats of POR-15 to be safe. Other option would be to carefully Vee out the cracks a bit and melt in silver-solder as a repair, or both!
You could get to clean brass in the inside using a dremel wire brush or scour pad and then last down a wide area of solder on the inside as thick as you please and then cover it with POR. My brass fuel tank lantern had the same stress "cracks" or marks but I could not get inside the tank, just used POR. But a lantern fuel tank does not come under pressure so the POR worked fine.
Those round brass chambers and tanks get the marks just from age, expansion and contraction due to temperature changes. The lantern people told me the went so far as to taking a lantern apart so a flat, round piece of brass could be soldered into the inside of the outer chimney to give needed support to that vital area of lantern physical operation. They also said that repair was almost too much for them to handle.
So, for your chamber, I'd think "painting" the inside with solder and POT, two coats, would be more than enough. And e stress cracks that show on the outside would just be added character. My Dietz has vehicle stress cracks in both the tank and chimney and the POR worked well in the tank.
You can see the vehicle age cracks in the chimney and various stress cracks in the tank in the picture.
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=16191.0;attach=145315;image)
Carbide lamps were sold at our local hardware store when I was a youngster, and I had to have one. they were remarkable in the amount of light they gave off, I kept it and as I got older it was put to another use in applying a flat black finish to rifle sights for match shooting. And there is always that satisfying POP when the gas lights. :D
Quote from: TelePlay on October 07, 2017, 10:05:18 AM
You could get to clean brass in the inside using a dremel wire brush or scour pad and then last down a wide area of solder on the inside as thick as you please and then cover it with POR. My brass fuel tank lantern had the same stress "cracks" or marks but I could not get inside the tank, just used POR. But a lantern fuel tank does not come under pressure so the POR worked fine.
Those round brass chambers and tanks get the marks just from age, expansion and contraction due to temperature changes. The lantern people told me the went so far as to taking a lantern apart so a flat, round piece of brass could be soldered into the inside of the outer chimney to give needed support to that vital area of lantern physical operation. They also said that repair was almost too much for them to handle.
So, for your chamber, I'd think "painting" the inside with solder and POT, two coats, would be more than enough. And e stress cracks that show on the outside would just be added character. My Dietz has vehicle stress cracks in both the tank and chimney and the POR worked well in the tank.
You can see the vehicle age cracks in the chimney and various stress cracks in the tank in the picture.
After soaking the tank (filled with vinegar) for two days, the deposits were finally soft enough to break out with a thumb nail. Once clean, it was revealed that someone long before me had went and soldered some spots on the inside as well. The brass itself is actually a lot thicker than I first figured and only a few small hairline cracks are visible inside. The tank did pass both a water test and a low pressure air test. For now I will stick to several coats of POR-15 as a safety margin.
This head-lamp of course will be tested very thoroughly, more so than my lanterns given the nature of its light source.
The top half is largely complete in terms of repairs (didn't need much). Cosmetically I want to keep it in its beat-up as found state as much as possible. I could easily polish it up and take out some dents, but then it would loose its character. I already feel bad for taking a lot of the patina down on the lower half to check the integrity.
As an FYI: acetone is the best leak checker. It is very thin and it will flow through the smallest of holes or cracks wetting the outside and after dumping it out, it dries quickly and may even take some oils that may have been on the surface with it. Only needs one or two tablespoons, or one ounce for a test of a large tank. Just don't get it on anything plastic.
I did learn the hard way that pressure testing a tank can actually create leakes by blowing out weak spots. POR fixed it but it was a lesson well learned. It was a water pressure test.
I have seen "plumbers" blow apart older expansion tanks and valves pressure testing at needlessly high pressures, fun to watch.
The POR coating is going much easier than I expected. Being such a small tank, a spoonful is more than a enough for a good coat. As the flat sections of the tank are the weak spots that show stress, I simply coat the whole inside, drain the majority of the excess, and simply lay the tank on its side with the area in question facing down. The POR that is left pools and cures over that section.
I dont want to count my chickens before they hatch, but it may be time to order some carbide crystals. 8)
Here is a good "to the point" article (PDF) that goes over the basic operation of one of these styles of lights and how they can be used as personal heat sources if needed. Not a history lesson, but outlines the day to day use these things used to perform.
http://guysdropper.com/pdf/how_to_use_a_carbide_lamp.pdf
A small hint: In the youtube demo, the guy kept using a torch to light it. To use the sparker, Turh on the water/gas, then put your palm over the reflector then strike it with the palm. that keeps a little gas over the striker for better ignition.
Fun to know that some other folks on the forum are interested in Carbide Lamps.
I believe I searched the forum not long ago for "carbide" and didn't find any hits. (Thanks John (TelePlay) for the response to let me know about this thread!)
We first went caving in 1984 with a friend's carbide lamps (Autolights, I assume) and picked up our first carbide lamp around that time. Although our collection is not very large, it is fun to keep an eye out for lamps as we look for telephones!
It happens that we recently found out that that first carbide lamp we picked up is quite rare and is really the only one in our collection that is "rare". We also found out that even the books we picked up to learn about carbide lamps are now "collectable"!
Having gone caving (spelunking) a couple times with a carbide lamp on my helmet or in my hand I have to say that although I love very simple old machines (carbide lamps, old phones, old motorcycles) an electric light is certainly more convenient! But when you are following closely behind someone in a tight crawl-way in a cave...a "carbide assist" (created by getting your light very close to their back end) can get them moving more quickly!
Attached is a photo of the carbide lamps on the shelf behind me as I type.
Nick
Quote from: Nick in Manitou on October 16, 2017, 11:49:38 PMBut when you are following closely behind someone in a tight crawl-way in a cave...a "carbide assist" (created by getting your light very close to their back end) can get them moving more quickly!
Just hope that they hadn't had beans for breakfast... ;D
Bloke,
Beans for breakfast can be a problem in general in a tight crawl-way in a cave...carbide or no carbide! But the carbide could add an additional dimension to it!
That's a nice little collection! Is that a blow lamp in front of the carbide can?
I had to look up the term, "Blow Lamp". Interesting! ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blow_torch )
No, all the lamps on that shelf are carbide lamps.
The strange gray one between the camera and the blue and white carbide can is the first lamp we picked up, a very early Baldwin lamp. I believe it dates from the first decade of the 1900s.
Nick
I guess i used that term for lack of a better one. It looks like just a orifice jet with no reflector. A blow lamp is a little alcohol fueled torch used in jewelry making.
Ran across this while looking for something else.
There are a couple of those solar brand lamps on Ebay .
I like the Miner's Cap! I want one! I guess there was not a concern over being too bright at 16-18 candlepower.
Looking around at the carbide lamps and accessories, a number of sellers had calcium carbide itself, including one seller from Germany that was touting it as rodent repellent. Now, how does that work?!
Quote from: 19and41 on October 18, 2017, 06:44:40 PM
Looking around at the carbide lamps and accessories, a number of sellers had calcium carbide itself, including one seller from Germany that was touting it as rodent repellent. Now, how does that work?!
I can picture that. A rodent enjoys a full meal of it, washes it down with a water based beverage and lights up an after dinner smoke . . .
Cheapest on eBay that includes shipping (other than local pickup) $29 a pound, probably cheaper by the pound if you buy a larger container.
Union Carbide was the big carbide manufacturer back in the day.
Look at the eBay sellers handle, I knew this stuff was used for carbide cannons when I was much younger - always wanted one but by parents thought otherwise.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CALCIUM-CARBIDE-PEA-grade-lamp-miners-1-pound-16-ounces-can-/322346183768
19and41,
The Baldwin lamp in front of the carbide container is very similar to the one shown in the third advertisement TelePlay posted. It looks to be identical to the Model 28 except that it is not nickel plated. The reflector was probably originally tin plated but is not very reflective at this point.
I have not purchased carbide for quite a while, but the best source I could find 20 30(!) years ago was the local caving community. Some folks would purchase a larger drum of it and sell it a very reasonable prices to others in the group. Of course now very few cavers are using carbide for lots of reasons, so it may be harder to find locally.
Nick
Here are a few more ads that got caught up in my search for kerosene lantern ads. Seems bicycles in 1900ish used them as well as miners.
And a few more . . .
On your 1917 page, it shows 2 Delta lights. They made those about 10 miles from where I grew up. For those of you who had or wanted to have a headlight on your bike, Delta made jet age looking units to mount on the handlebars.
Quote from: 19and41 on October 19, 2017, 04:34:34 PM
On your 1917 page, it shows 2 Delta lights. They made those about 10 miles from where I grew up. For those of you who had or wanted to have a headlight on your bike, Delta made jet age looking units to mount on the handlebars.
Must have been the cross over time period where battery lamps were competing with the carbide stuff.
I was surprised to read the "Brilliant Search Light" text on the lower left corner of this 1915 ad saying the carbide lamp would "throw" a light up to 200 yards and the small generator would work for 8 hours. Don't know what they mean by "throw." Could mean seen 200 yards away or illuminates the surface 200 yards away.
I have several 3000 lumen T6 LED flashlights (18650 4.2V battery) that can be seen for miles but I doubt would illuminate a surface at 200 yards. Just tried it outdoors and it barely lit up trees 100 yards out, nothing more. 200 yards for a small flame must mean can be seen up to 200 yards away.
Quote from: TelePlay on October 19, 2017, 04:19:10 PM
Here are a few more ads that got caught up in my search for kerosene lantern ads. Seems bicycles in 1900ish used them as well as miners.
Careful now, that's exactly what I was doing and a week after the fact an ebay bid was placed...resulting in a carbide lamp arriving at my door. The Lamp Bug evolves! ;D
Nick: Nice collection you have there! I assume the large on the shelf are hand lamps or lamps for more general illumination other than head lamps? Also,do you light any of them up?
Been busy last week, too much going on with the change of the seasons. However will be swinging through PA next week, might be an opportunity to pick up another lamp ;)
Al,
Yes although one could actually put a large reflector on a lamp mounted on a cap or helmet, I believe that the larger reflectors were mostly used on lamps carried in the hand. I have attached a photo of a cap lamp with a large reflector on it and I think it would be scraping on the roof of the tunnel a lot!
I have also attached a few photos of the Justrite lamps with the large reflectors on them. These lamps are equipped with a hook and also with folding hand loops so that they can be used either on the hat or in the hand. The reflectors could be swapped out for smaller ones depending on what the user wanted.
Also shown are a couple angles of an AutoLite showing the hook and the stabilizing wire. The blade mount (or flat hook) and the round hook were both common for years, so a lot of the headgear was designed to accept either.
Now, I am posting a photo of a lamp I know nothing about.
We picked it up because of our interest in mining lamps but don't know for sure if it is a miner's lamp or not. It has quite a fat wick in the "spout" and we assume that it burned lard-oil. The long handle makes me guess that it was intended for being carried for a notable distance...perhaps an attempt to keep the flame/smoke/soot away from the user's hand/arm? Does anyone here know what it is? I have found no makers marks on it.
It measures about 16" from spout to the end of the handle.
The person at the shop thought it might be railroad related, but I have no information one way or the other.
Thanks,
Nick
Is that a hollow handle? If so, might it be a lighter for boilers? Put it in through the access door on a rod?
The handle is hollow, so that is a possibility!
Quote from: Nick in Manitou on October 23, 2017, 11:12:51 AM
The handle is hollow, so that is a possibility!
Quite possible. That style of wicked lamp has been around for several thousand years with the Egyptians using clay lamps and olive oil. Here is a miner's cap lamp with hooks rather than the long handle.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-G-Anton-Coal-Miner-Teapot-Helmet-Lamp-w-Shield-Markings-/362138699941
The fuel font has too small of a diameter to be a stable table wick lamp such as this original style lamp.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Clay-Lamp-Home-Decors-Aladdin-Oil-Lamp-20-wicks-Free-Home-made-Separate-Lid-/272436932997
Very nice lamps 8)
The more I read into carbide lamps and other mining equipment, the more variety I find. I figure these lamps were personally bought by the miners and as a result carried a lot of pride with them. Some I have seen are quite ornate, others plain to the point of looking home made. Equally fascinating are the real early candle holders. Imagine having a candle pinned to your hat or overalls to see by! Tough men in those days for sure.
Some early mining lamps were also of the style of that hollow handle "pitcher" style lamp you have there. Small versions were used on caps before carbide could be massed produced. Not much better than a candle but progress. ;D
After over a year, I finally got around to buying some carbide and testing out the old Autolite head lamp. First attempt was a bit touch and go. The gasket I had used between the two halves leaked quite a bit which made for some excitement :o
After some adjustments and a better fitting seal, the lamp works very well. With a smaller flame it ran for about three hours on a single fueling. It did need more water after two hours however. Testing it against my '50s era Big Beam 6v flashlight I was surprised to see the carbide lamp could easily out shine the battery light.
Regular Member Post (http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=20151.msg206412#msg206412)
Nice, very nice. And nothing like a bit of stray acetylene around a flame to get the adrenaline going . . . ::)
Now that you have a life time supply of carbide, you can pick up another dozen or so of similar lamps for that collection . . .
Nothing like bringing old tech back to life.