OK its official I too have become a phone junkie. I was up til 2 am last night looking at phones. I came across these three phones and I need some help identifying them and maybe what they could be worth as I am interested in them. One is a WE 2 box phone I think, one is a AE 35 or 50 maybe and the third one I have no clue. Just wanting to know if I should run and buy them or run the other way. I figure all the experts on here can help me one way or the other. I know the wooden one has no receiver and the AE needs a different cord and lots of polish. Thanks guys for any help you can provide me.
Looks like we got another one!!
Ben
Moderator's note: Please if you make a joke such as this, please explain it so people don't take it the wrong way. It is too easy for a new user to take it as a comment about them personally... Dave
Second one is an AE 50 in it's natural habitat, a recess in the wall with a curve on the top that matches the phone! I had one just like that in my first house that was built in 1954. There is a slight chance that it could actually be an AE 35 with the newer handset that would be on an AE50. The only way to tell is to see if there are vents up and down each side which confirms that it is a 50. The AE 35 didn't have the vents and in most cases had an older style handset than the one pictured.
Everyone runs out and buys an AE 40 and/or an AE 50 and then discovers that they were also available with chrome rings on the handset. The rings are not easy to get on their own so it is quite often better to wait for a phone to come along that already has them. That said, the ideal arrangement would be to have an AE 40 and an AE 50 and it would be nice to have one decked out with all the chrome and another one the more common non chromed version so that your collection shows both variations.
The 50 in your picture does have the chrome fingerwheel (dial) and it has the number card retainer ring which is very often missing so it has some "extra's". Make certain there are no cracks in the bakelite, that seriously reduces the value.
Terry
The 3rd one looks like a GPO 311 body, but the handset isn't correct.
Quote from: WesternElectricBen on April 14, 2013, 02:35:18 PM
Looks like we got another one!!
Ben
Hook, Line, And Sinker.
D/P
Moderator's note: Please if you make a joke such as this, please explain it so people don't take it the wrong way. It is too easy for a new user to take it as a comment about them personally... Dave
Glad you found my posts amusing. I can see why most people come on as guests.
Quote from: wrangler64 on April 14, 2013, 06:54:21 PM
Glad you found my posts amusing. I can see why most people come on as guests.
Wrangler....no one finds your posts amusing. You were looking for information and everyone was trying to help. The "we got another one" is just saying you are now one of us, hopelessly addicted to collecting telephones. This is a great group of guys and gals. Welcome to the Forum ...Doug
Quote from: Doug Rose on April 14, 2013, 07:16:30 PM
Quote from: wrangler64 on April 14, 2013, 06:54:21 PM
Glad you found my posts amusing. I can see why most people come on as guests.
Wrangler....no one finds your posts amusing. You were looking for information and everyone was trying to help. The "we got another one" is just saying you are now one of us, hopelessly addicted to collecting telephones. This is a great group of guys and gals. Welcome to the Forum ...Doug
Just seconding Doug's post. It is a bit of an in joke, and too easy for a new user to misunderstand. Welcome to the Forum, and we all hope you will enjoy the time you spend here. Never be afraid to ask any question!
Dave
Quote from: wrangler64 on April 14, 2013, 01:33:42 PM
OK its official I too have become a phone junkie. I was up til 2 am last night looking at phones. I came across these three phones and I need some help identifying them and maybe what they could be worth as I am interested in them. One is a WE 2 box phone I think, one is a AE 35 or 50 maybe and the third one I have no clue. Just wanting to know if I should run and buy them or run the other way. I figure all the experts on here can help me one way or the other. I know the wooden one has no receiver and the AE needs a different cord and lots of polish. Thanks guys for any help you can provide me.
You have to be careful when buying a 2-box phone. Many of them have a wood subset (with generator, ringer and induction coil) that is old, but the rest of the wood is all new. The top box here looks like a WE 300K subset to me, with a hookswitch and receiver added. WE did make a 305 wall phone with the same footprint as the subset, but I don't see any marks on the front of the top box where an 8A transmitter mount would have been if it had been a 305.
It appears that at one time, there was a transmitter mounted on this phone. It would have been fastened to the backboard between the two boxes.
Always look at the back of any 2-box phone. If the top box doesn't have exposed terminals along the bottom, then the wires to the lower box (which contained the batteries) and to the transmitter have to be on the back of the phone. The wires would be in slots cut into the wood. Often the mostly fake 2-box phones have no wires at all going from the top box to the lower box! That's what some techs would call an "air gap."
Also, the battery box/writing shelf are not as wide as the backboard. This looks suspicious.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 14, 2013, 08:00:09 PM
You have to be careful when buying a 2-box phone. Many of them have a wood subset (with generator, ringer and induction coil) that is old, but the rest of the wood is all new. The top box here looks like a WE 300K subset to me, with a hookswitch and receiver added. WE did make a 305 wall phone with the same footprint as the subset, but I don't see any marks on the front of the top box where an 8A transmitter mount would have been if it had been a 305.
It appears that at one time, there was a transmitter mounted on this phone. It would have been fastened to the backboard between the two boxes.
Always look at the back of the phone. If the top box doesn't have exposed terminals along the bottom, then the wires to the lower box (which contained the batteries) and to the transmitter have to be on the back of the phone. The wires would be in slots cut into the wood. Often the mostly fake 2-box phones have no wires at all going from the top box to the lower box! That's what some techs would call an "air gap."
Often the case, but not always. When I bought my 1889 Bell Canada Blake phone, it had been kept for years on a cellar floor, and the backboard had dry rotted. So, I had a local cabinet maker duplicate the backboard exactly (even down to the same wood), and replaced it, but kept the rotted backboard as well so people would know it was genuine. Every other part is original, as are the wires routed on the back of the backboard.
The backboard on her phone is the same width as it the battery box as on my Bell Canada phone, so it may be NE used the same profile backboard and box on hers as well.
I would love to see a higher res photo of her phone.... Actually, note there is no transmitter - I can't see the transmitter mounting holes well enough to tell what transmitter SHOULD be on it, and could tell for sure if it were higher res. A better photo would tell for sure (even better with a back photo).
The third phone shown I believe to be European, perhaps Ericcson or Siemens. I have seen them before, and just can't put my finger on who was the maker, and many European phones were imported and used out West. Anyone more familiar with European phones able to give a better ID for it?
Dave
I need to check in some old WE catalogs, but the only 2-box phone I recall from post-1907 (when the way of opening the cabinet went from a key to a screwdriver) is the 1240. The backboard on a 1240 has a uniform width from top to bottom.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 14, 2013, 08:23:47 PM
I need to check in some old WE catalogs, but the only 2-box phone I recall from post-1907 (when the way of opening the cabinet went from a key to a screwdriver) is the 1240. The backboard on a 1240 has a uniform width from top to bottom.
That is another reason I want to see better photos. I suspect rather than WE it is NE, and I can tell if I can see it in higher res. The top box should also have markings on the side...
Alas, the photo is too small to tell with any accuracy. Wrangler is in Western Canada.
It could still be an "assembled phone". Hopefully she can post better photos of it.
Dave
hi wrangler 64,welcome to the forum and I want to welcome you by saying that you are on a forum with a good bunch of people.beleive me, from my own experience if you need help with something and post it people will always go out of there way to help and you probably get more than one point of view for any given question.my belief is that any question is a good question, remember don t be afraid to ask, sometimes the response can be overwhelming. again welcome to this forum.... take good care.... southernphoneman.
Possibly a British Ericsson which was used in Canada, particularly in the Prairie Provinces. See if a hole is located on the side for a magneto crank. Also what is the text on the two buttons?
If it is indeed the model that I am thinking of, it is configured for simplex dialing so the subscriber can dial an exchange call in the usual manner or using a magneto to signal other subscribers on their party-line.
If not, simply then it was used as a standard telephone set.
Quote from: G-Man on April 15, 2013, 01:12:16 AM
Possibly a British Ericsson which was used in Canada, particularly in the Prairie Provinces.
Looking it up, I believe you're spot on with the brand:
http://britishtelephones.com/ericsson/n1071.htm
Specifically, the N1071F (2-button, Non-Director dial), though the dial plate has been changed (presumably to suit the location, or replaced with a GPO dial (will have "OQ" on the 0) to replace a faulty one if it was imported after it was retired... :)
Though no room for a Magneto, it's an entirely automatic telephone, though the button labels are probably "Call Exchange" and "Recall", or something to that effect... :)
Quote from: G-Man on April 15, 2013, 01:12:16 AM
Possibly a British Ericsson which was used in Canada, particularly in the Prairie Provinces. See if a hole is located on the side for a magneto crank. Also what is the text on the two buttons?
So I was on the right track when I was thinking it was an Ericcson or Siemens (see my post from last night). I was pretty sure it was a British phone, many of which were used out West. So you narrowed it down further, G-Man, and I think twocvbloke narrowed it down the rest of the way! Teamwork ;)
I did check my Manitoba Telephone System Districtman's Handbook (1945), where I had thought I would find it, but it wasn't listed, but many other UK phones were!
For those who didn't realize it, out West in Canada (Manitoba, Sask., Alberta), they tended to use phones and dials imported from Britain, especially in the time following the automation of their exchanges with UK switches. So a lot of UK phones show up there, as do NE uniphones with GPO dials.
Thanks, guys!
Dave
I would not buy the 2-boxer without getting better photos and posting them here first. That phone looks very suspicious.
Quote from: Sargeguy on April 15, 2013, 07:18:28 AM
I would not buy the 2-boxer without getting better photos and posting them here first. That phone looks very suspicious.
Which is the jist of what we have been telling her... We have asked several times here and in PM's for better photos front and back of it, but she hasn't checked in since.
Dave
Quote from: twocvbloke on April 15, 2013, 03:55:01 AM
Quote from: G-Man on April 15, 2013, 01:12:16 AM
Possibly a British Ericsson which was used in Canada, particularly in the Prairie Provinces.
Looking it up, I believe you're spot on with the brand:
http://britishtelephones.com/ericsson/n1071.htm
Specifically, the N1071F (2-button, Non-Director dial), though the dial plate has been changed (presumably to suit the location, or replaced with a GPO dial (will have "OQ" on the 0) to replace a faulty one if it was imported after it was retired... :)
Though no room for a Magneto, it's an entirely automatic telephone, though the button labels are probably "Call Exchange" and "Recall", or something to that effect... :)
As shown below, there is indeed room for a magneto.
However at this point the precise model number is unknown since both the conventional dial and the magneto/dial versions used the same housing.
Once wrangler64 examines it and determines whether there is a hole or not, for a crank then we will have a clearer idea as to which model it is but either way, it is obvious that the wrong handset and cord is being used with it.
Quote from: G-Man on April 15, 2013, 09:05:41 AM
As shown below, there is indeed room for a magneto.
However at this point the precise model number is unknown since both the conventional dial and the magneto/dial versions used the same housing.
Once wrangler64 examines it and determines whether there is a hole or not, for a crank then we will have a clearer idea as to which model it is but either way, it is obvious that the wrong handset and cord is being used with it.
This would certainly make sense for the time these were used out West. It was at a point where the telcos were scrambling to automate their larger exchanges, but there still was a need for magneto calls. I think you are dead on.
This is exactly the type of phone they would have been needing at the time.
The handset must be a later addition to it.
Good work!
Dave
Sorry I jumped to conclusions. Glad I asked about the wood phone before I purchased it, may have gotten burned on it had I went ahead and bought it. Thanks for all the welcomes to the forum. I do enjoy coming here and learning about the phones. Hope everyone has a great day.
Keep in mind that we are speaking as collectors. If the wood phone is very inexpensive and you just want a wood phone to put on the wall it looks quite good. If you want as historically accuarate as possible, it probably isn't a good choice.
Terry
They were asking $130 for the phone, not sure if that's a good deal for a wall hanger or not. Would need a good anchor to hang it on the wall. ;D
In addition to the other comments it looks as if the backboard and box are made of something other than walnut. As stated, it is a later magneto box, and would be unlikely to appear on a two boxer. Most two box WE phones would have model number, patent dates, and manufacturer information stamped into the wood. I'm not so certain about later Northern Electric types, but the box in this case is Western Electric. Stamped info is not a guarantee of authenticity, as many more top boxes survived than other parts, and were re-used for years after being removed from two and three box phones. Another sign of a fake WE phone is that WE battery boxes were typically accessed by either removing the entire box from the backboard, or through the top by removing the writing shelf. To my knowledge they never opened downwards with securing latches at the sides.
Quote from: wrangler64 on April 15, 2013, 11:40:07 AM
Sorry I jumped to conclusions. Glad I asked about the wood phone before I purchased it, may have gotten burned on it had I went ahead and bought it. Thanks for all the welcomes to the forum. I do enjoy coming here and learning about the phones. Hope everyone has a great day.
I am glad you are here. I understand that you enjoy coming to this forum and please keep coming. :) ;)
If you were calling another party on your own line, you simply turned the crank on the magneto.
To make a regular exchange call, you would dial the number of the desired subscriber.
canuckphoneguy posted photos of one that he came across during a road trip last August. The crank had been removed when the converted to fully automatic service.
Here is a link to his thread- http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=7391.0
Here are the instructions to the subscribers as posted on its number card:
LIFT HANDSET AND LISTEN
IF LINE IS FREE PRESS CALL BUTTON
PARTY CALL: TURN HANDLE FOR CODE RING
CENTRAL CALL: DIAL CENTRAL NUMBER
Opps.. I accidently clipped off the first part of my reply. Here is what I intended to include-
A bit further regarding these telephones.
They were dubbed the "Alberta Special" since they were primarily used by Alberta Government Telephones for serving subscribers on very long, rural lines. Other Canadian lecs used them as well. Northern Electric and Automatic Electric also manufactured comparable sets.Quote from: G-Man on April 15, 2013, 09:38:32 PM
If you were calling another party on your own line, you simply turned the crank on the magneto.
To make a regular exchange call, you would dial the number of the desired subscriber.
canuckphoneguy posted photos of one that he came across during a road trip last August. The crank had been removed when the converted to fully automatic service.
Here is a link to his thread- http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=7391.0
Here are the instructions to the subscribers as posted on its number card:
LIFT HANDSET AND LISTEN
IF LINE IS FREE PRESS CALL BUTTON
PARTY CALL: TURN HANDLE FOR CODE RING
CENTRAL CALL: DIAL CENTRAL NUMBER
Quote from: wrangler64 on April 15, 2013, 11:40:07 AM
Sorry I jumped to conclusions. Glad I asked about the wood phone before I purchased it, may have gotten burned on it had I went ahead and bought it. Thanks for all the welcomes to the forum. I do enjoy coming here and learning about the phones. Hope everyone has a great day.
Can you provide a picture of the back of the phone, and maybe the inside of the top box?
There were no other photos. I didn't pursue the phone.