Title: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 06:05:12 PM
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 06:05:12 PM
Hello All,
I have a brass Western Electric that was given to me by my father 40 or 50 years ago. Last night I heard a loud crashing sound in my dining room and saw my cat making a frantic exit. I knew from the sound that it couldn't be good and prepared for the worst. I walked in and saw my Candlestick phone and pieces or plastic all over the floor. I waited until this morning to survey the damage and it actually could have been much worse! The only casualty that I can find in the 143W receiver cap which was in pieces.
This brings me to my question: Can you tell from these photos of my broken cap if it was an original or a repro? I found the repro caps online pretty cheap and before I hunt down an original I was wondering if the one I had was a repro? Also did original receivers ever have no writing on the end with the cord? I would appreciated your expert advice before I start visiting violin string factories.
Phone is a 20AL with "WESTERN ELECTRIC COMPANY/PAT IN USA AUG 16 04 SEPT 13 04 JAN 26 1915" stamped on the base.
Thanks,
-WM
I have a brass Western Electric that was given to me by my father 40 or 50 years ago. Last night I heard a loud crashing sound in my dining room and saw my cat making a frantic exit. I knew from the sound that it couldn't be good and prepared for the worst. I walked in and saw my Candlestick phone and pieces or plastic all over the floor. I waited until this morning to survey the damage and it actually could have been much worse! The only casualty that I can find in the 143W receiver cap which was in pieces.
This brings me to my question: Can you tell from these photos of my broken cap if it was an original or a repro? I found the repro caps online pretty cheap and before I hunt down an original I was wondering if the one I had was a repro? Also did original receivers ever have no writing on the end with the cord? I would appreciated your expert advice before I start visiting violin string factories.
Phone is a 20AL with "WESTERN ELECTRIC COMPANY/PAT IN USA AUG 16 04 SEPT 13 04 JAN 26 1915" stamped on the base.
Thanks,
-WM
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 06:10:59 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 06:10:59 PM
From what I see, looks like shattered Bakelite so probably original. Others may know better.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: Jim Stettler on June 22, 2021, 07:03:00 PM
Post by: Jim Stettler on June 22, 2021, 07:03:00 PM
I think it is original as well.
I think the repros shatter black vs gray at the break.
JMO,
Jim
I think the repros shatter black vs gray at the break.
JMO,
Jim
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 07:27:44 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 07:27:44 PM
This is what broken Bakelite looks like (plastic breaks are smoother)
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: FABphones on June 22, 2021, 07:37:08 PM
Post by: FABphones on June 22, 2021, 07:37:08 PM
They come up on eBay regularly enough, and not expensive. Even I have managed to buy a couple outside the US.
If you still have all the pieces, they will glue together for a temporary repair.
If you still have all the pieces, they will glue together for a temporary repair.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 08:31:18 PM
Post by: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 08:31:18 PM
Reproduction . The hole in the center has sharp edges and is oversized. The lettering is too sharp. The origional cap was composition or hard rubber. These reproduction caps were of a bakelite type material ,not molded thermoplastic. I used them at COT for replacements.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 08:55:58 PM
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 08:55:58 PM
Quote from: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 08:31:18 PM
Reproduction . The hole in the center has sharp edges and is oversized. The lettering is too sharp. The origional cap was composition or hard rubber. These reproduction caps were of a bakelite type material ,not molded thermoplastic. I used them at COT for replacements.
Thanks everyone, I will post more close-ups of the break in case it is a more definitive answer to the material.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 09:58:52 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 09:58:52 PM
This may work
http://www.oldphoneshop.com/products/western-electric-candlestick-receiver-cap-143.html
Seller description: "Western Electric 143 Candlestick receiver cap. Fits all Western Electric candlestick and wood wall phone receivers. Stamped Western Electric , Patent Dec 4 1900 March 29 1901"
Verify size/threads with seller. Or maybe a member can verify it as a replacement.
(Can't attach the image from the device I am using)
< edit 06-23-21 images added >
http://www.oldphoneshop.com/products/western-electric-candlestick-receiver-cap-143.html
Seller description: "Western Electric 143 Candlestick receiver cap. Fits all Western Electric candlestick and wood wall phone receivers. Stamped Western Electric , Patent Dec 4 1900 March 29 1901"
Verify size/threads with seller. Or maybe a member can verify it as a replacement.
(Can't attach the image from the device I am using)
< edit 06-23-21 images added >
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 10:14:14 PM
Post by: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 10:14:14 PM
reproduction, same as broken one
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 10:16:42 PM
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 10:16:42 PM
Quote from: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 10:14:14 PM
reproduction, same as broken one
Is that repro replacement any different that the one that sells for $5.99 ob Ebay?
Thanks,
-WM
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:19:08 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:19:08 PM
Quote from: rdelius on June 22, 2021, 10:14:14 PM
reproduction, same as broken one
Thanks, thought so. OldPhoneWorks also has original caps but the price is $45 while this repro is $18, both plus shipping. Parts are no longer cheap.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:20:03 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:20:03 PM
Quote from: evilw on June 22, 2021, 10:16:42 PM
Is that repro replacement any different that the one that sells for $5.99 ob Ebay?
Thanks,
-WM
Link?
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 10:24:10 PM
Post by: evilw on June 22, 2021, 10:24:10 PM
Quote from: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:20:03 PM
Link?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/123947721342? (https://www.ebay.com/itm/123947721342?)
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:28:16 PM
Post by: TelePlay on June 22, 2021, 10:28:16 PM
Appears to be the same. Ships from Canada so postage is higher but Old Phone Works is usually a bit lower in price than Old Phone Shop (US seller).
My eBay search did not find the $5.95 item.
My eBay search did not find the $5.95 item.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 23, 2021, 01:41:04 PM
Post by: evilw on June 23, 2021, 01:41:04 PM
Thanks, I really don't know anything about the Candlesticks other than having owned this one that safely sat on a shelf for decades.
While on the topic, is this unmarked receiver body also a repro? The only marking I can find is the simple 75Z stamp on the element. If it is a repro, I would be better off buying a whole original receiver, so I would be looking for the correct receiver for my Candlestick. Thanks!
While on the topic, is this unmarked receiver body also a repro? The only marking I can find is the simple 75Z stamp on the element. If it is a repro, I would be better off buying a whole original receiver, so I would be looking for the correct receiver for my Candlestick. Thanks!
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: rdelius on June 23, 2021, 08:24:24 PM
Post by: rdelius on June 23, 2021, 08:24:24 PM
The guts are origional along with the shell . It should be marked where the cord hole is but repolishing might have worn them away.
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on June 23, 2021, 11:15:39 PM
Post by: evilw on June 23, 2021, 11:15:39 PM
Quote from: rdelius on June 23, 2021, 08:24:24 PM
The guts are origional along with the shell . It should be marked where the cord hole is but repolishing might have worn them away.
Thanks rdelius,
No markings and who knows if this old thing had ever been polished. lol My dad had a antique store with several rooms of phone parts. Sadly, he had been gone for 33 years.
-WM
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on July 17, 2021, 08:41:03 PM
Post by: evilw on July 17, 2021, 08:41:03 PM
Hello again,,
I was looking through one of my parts boxes and came across a marked receiver with a 143W Cap marked on the underside?
Was this before, after or would it still be accurate for my candlestick?
Thanks,
-WM
I was looking through one of my parts boxes and came across a marked receiver with a 143W Cap marked on the underside?
Was this before, after or would it still be accurate for my candlestick?
Thanks,
-WM
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: rdelius on July 17, 2021, 11:53:42 PM
Post by: rdelius on July 17, 2021, 11:53:42 PM
Use it . the cap might be somewhat later and the shell is a composition one and it might be older but all original WE
Title: Re: Cats, Candlesticks and Catastrophe!
Post by: evilw on July 18, 2021, 02:28:33 PM
Post by: evilw on July 18, 2021, 02:28:33 PM
Quote from: rdelius on July 17, 2021, 11:53:42 PM
Use it . the cap might be somewhat later and the shell is a composition one and it might be older but all original WE
Thanks rdelius, I got out my loop and the cap is actually marked 143 AW.