GPO 706 finger plate, number ring and dial ring questions

[FABphones]

I've got a Black Diakon 706 (1962).

A previous owner put a modern replica silver plastic fingerplate (yuk  ) on it which I'm removing to make it back to original.

I'm in need of photos of both the metal, and the black colour, fingerplates on a 706 phone (without dial cards), and also removed so I can see what bits I need as it's beginning to look like they have messed around with it a little more than I first thought. I'm not sure at the moment which fingerplate it would have had but this lump of silver coloured badly formed plastic has to go.

Have looked online, nothing is detailed enough. Am thinking if I can see what should be there it would help a lot for me to work out what has been removed. If anyone has photos/info that would be a great help.

Thanks.

[twocvbloke]

Although not black, my Ivory diakon 706 on my N625 has an original plastic fingerwheel, should be the same as the black one, photos of which are here:

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=19979.msg205191#msg205191

[FABphones]

Thanks, that helps a lot. Don't know why I specified black, am having one of those I can't think (type) straight days. 

So, it is a one piece fingerplate, recessed area to front for dial card, metal on reverse (attached). Plastic Opal over dial card?

I'm thinking mine should be the Black equivalent, not the metal version... But if was it a metal fingerplate 706, what version of fingerplate would that be?

Maybe I'm overthinking this..... 

[twocvbloke]

The plastic fingerplate has two metal plates, one inside where the card goes which screws onto the one on the back to provide strength given the wheel is hollow, and yes, a plastic opal over the card, the originals being a thick plastic piece akin to the lens on "jam jar" glasses, later ones being the thinner hollow version...

[andy1702]

There are four things you need to think about to get the dial right. The dial mechanism (is it a type 12 or a 21?), the finger plate, the finger wheel and the dial surround.

First question... is it definitely a 706? I know this sounds a bit of a stupid question, but it could possibly be a 'clone', made in the same factory on the same production line, but for a private company like Telephone Rentals etc rather than the GPO. If it's a clone the dial would have different specs and you would need some different parts.

Assuming it really is a GPO 706 (it will be marked on the base if it is) then the next question is does it have a dial 12 or a dial 21? I'd be very surprised if the GPO was still taking 706s with dial 12s by 1962. The first few in the late 50s had them and they are generally the ones with metal finger wheels. If it's a dial 21 then in 1962 it would have been fitted with a coloured finger wheel to match the colour of the phone. This finger wheel should have a flat metal plate on the back (usually brass) and a hole at the 3 o'clock position where you unsert a screwdriver to flick the label cover off from behind. If it doesn't have the metal on the back and the little hole then it's a modern repro and not correct.

There were also changes made to the finger plate, which fits behind the finger wheel. These are normally found in the colour to match the finger wheel with arrows printed onto them. All the print/paint should be on the BACK of the finger plate which is ancually a clear plastic moulding. If the printing is on the surface then again it's modern and not correct. The interesting thing is that 1962 was probably right at the end of the period where the finger plates were blank, without any kind of arrows. This was the design used between about 1959- early '63 (ish!). Also the feet on the bottom of the phone should probably be domedand not have the more common circular recess in the middle.

Finally the dial surround should again be clear and painted on the reverse to match the dial. It should have alpha-numeric markings and be fitted to the phone case with the aid of a large circular internal clip. The dial surrounds were never blank until around 1967 and even then many still came out (even on new 746s) with the alpha-numeric markings.

Remember: dial 12 and 21 are interchangable, but the parts are not. A finger plate and finger wheel from a dial 12 will not easily fit a dial 21 and vice versa.

[FABphones]

Thanks for taking the time to type all that out Andy, very sweet of you. It is a GPO 706, but the fingerplate is not. From what twocv says it would appear I am missing two parts plus the correct fingerplate. I have an ever growing box of odds and ends and was hoping to find a match from whatever this thread might guide me to, but alas, it is not to be.

Re the dial, this phone has another issue as one of the top screws is broken and cross threaded so as of yet I have not been able to get into it to see the innards. I don't believe it is a 12, as I have spare 12's and a 21 fingerplate, plus another still on a dial which is a 21 (FA I think) and that doesn't match either.

Can't do photos on this device but not sure they would help as it's the mystery bits I'm missing that are the issue.

Am having a bad few weeks here - of the last 9 phones in, 3 have been broken, 2 have issues, 1 the seller 'dropped'. And my spares kit doesn't have anything I need.

Isn't that just the way it goes sometimes.   

[andy1702]

If it's the finger plate you're looking for, I'd say it should be a plain black one.

The 21 finger plates are different to the 12 finger plates because the 21 is more flat to accomodate the thicker plastic finger wheels. The dial 12 finger plate has a raised bit in the middle to hold the thinner metal finger wheels further away from the plate so you can actually get your fingers in the holes to dial.
Your dial should be a 21CA although the letters in the code don't matter as they only refer to colour. So a 21FA will be fine. Just get a plain black finger plate and a black plastic finger wheel. That should be all you need.

Let us have a photo when you can. It sounds like there might be something odd going on.

[Hotline]

FabPhones, this is what you require, currently on eBay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GPO-FINGERPLATE-FOR-EARLY-TELEPHONE-706-SUITABLE-FOR-BLACK-DIAKON-MODEL-Used/142879033043
( dead link 05-27-21 )

[FABphones]

FabPhones, this is what you require, currently on eBay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GPO-FINGERPLATE-FOR-EARLY-TELEPHONE-706-SUITABLE-FOR-BLACK-DIAKON-MODEL-Used/142879033043

Thanks Hotline. I have a largish joblot box of all sorts of phone odds n ends (most of which I'll never need )  on the way and one of the things in there is one of those fingerplates.

Good to know it looks like I've got it right. 

[andy1702]

Just to clear up a bit of terminology so nobody gets confused... The part Hotline linked to is the finger WHEEL. The finger PLATE is the flat (ish) piece that sometimes has numbers or arrows printed on it that goes behind it. For the phone we're talking about I think the finger plate should be plain black with no markings. That finger wheel Hotline found is spot on!

[HarrySmith]

On this side of the pond it is finger wheel & number ring.

[Pourme]

It's like Boot vs trunk....bonnet vs hood.....

[HarrySmith]

Exactly!

[FABphones]

Just to clear up a bit of terminology so nobody gets confused... The part Hotline linked to is the finger WHEEL. The finger PLATE is the flat (ish) piece that sometimes has numbers or arrows printed on it that goes behind it. For the phone we're talking about I think the finger plate should be plain black with no markings. That finger wheel Hotline found is spot on!

Thanks guys. 

I have been known to use both terms, but there you go Andy, I've added a link for you to reference. The term 'finger plate' is used on this (excellent and informative) site, look at section 4, with a clear diagram too:

http://www.britishtelephones.com/tel%20auto%20b5125.htm

[FABphones]

Photo from above linked website.