Guidelines for “outing” under-the-radar auctions ?

[RotarDad]

Hello - I want to revisit a an informal guideline we used to have here on the forum. 

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=2160.0

The guideline was that we forum members would be careful about posting about active EBay auctions that had low or no bids, when the item was potentially valuable.   The reason for this is pretty obvious:  some people spend quite a bit of time and effort looking for special items and hope to win them for low prices.

If these auctions are "outed", then the number of people who know about an item increases dramatically, which can result in higher prices and/or more lost auctions for those folks who initially found the items digging online.

If we can agree to avoid posting about an auction until large numbers of bidders or watchers show, or wait until an "under-the-radar" auction ends, that would be similar to the guideline we had before.

Obviously this is a gentlemen's (and ladies') type of agreement if the forum decides to follow some form of this.....

Thoughts and suggestions?

Thank you!

[jsowers]

I vote to wait until the auction ends. Then it can be freely discussed with no repercussions. That Kellogg swirl phone may be a good example of one going high after being revealed, but we'll never know for sure. I'm pretty sure I know which phone has prompted your bringing up this topic and I think that topic of outing valuable phones is a very good one to discuss. Some here have strong opinions on it, or I've seen strong opinions in the past. Nothing on eBay is invisible, so when the dust clears it may not make any difference one way or the other.

Sometimes we reveal them just by having an auction contest and I wouldn't want those to disappear. I know John (Teleplay) was warning sellers so they didn't sell the phone privately for less and I have already warned a seller tonight about that and gotten their assurance that it won't be sold until the end of the auction and they've already had two offers on it. So invisible it ain't.    It really wouldn't upset me if the phone was revealed, but then I'm not planning on bidding on this one. Those who would be upset need to let their feelings be known.

[FABphones]

After auction end is of help to bidders, although a reveal may be done by accident if a phone is spotted and one of us asks other forum members for help identifying it or with questions re authenticity for example.

When the listing for the phone which has prompted this thread ends, would someone please add it here. A screenshot of the auction listing as it stands now would make a good comparison with a screenshot of that same (unrevealed) listing after completion.

[andy1702]

I think we should talk about items immediately. The reason is there are things being listed every day that are fake, fraudulent and not what they are claimed to be. Some of us could be easily taken in by these, so it's good to out a fraud as quickly as possible. A good example on E-Bay UK would be 'classics' rotary phones which are actually cheap  tone-dialling replicas made yesterday.

It also seems a bit silly if we can't promote items we've listed ourselves.

Also, it we can talk about sensible prices the hopefully we can discourage anyone from bidding up to crazy levels.

[Fabius]

I feel that it's okay to pass on whatever is of interest to our collecting community.

[Doug Rose]

I feel that it's okay to pass on whatever is of interest to our collecting community.

I agree. What are we protecting by not sharing? ...Doug

[Babybearjs]

Interesting.... If I find something that no one wants, then I'll share it... that is AFTER I've won it.... like my brown ITT 564 that no one wanted.... and stuff like that....

[Key2871]

Well, John in the case of a very common phone such as an ITT 564, I don't think it really matters.
I think what Paul was trying to say was for auctions of old valuable phone's, such as the Kellogg swirl.

But others have brought up a good point, however it's a knife that cuts both ways. I for one can't afford minty nine percent of the auctions, therefore I don't bid. But I know there are others here who do buy on eBay. And I see the point of not advertising an auction, but at the same time how is anyone supposed to resist the urge to bid on an item they are really interested in?

I guess what I'm saying is, who here knows other members user name, especially since eBay stopped showing full user names quite a while ago. And the point of an auction is for the seller to get top dollar, and the buyer to pay the lowest.
So it goes both ways, I full understand that a buyer wants the item for the cheapest they can get.
On that same token others may not be looking for a particular item, but when some one else sees a potential high value item they are not interested in, and they post the auction to aid or alert others... Where does one draw the line?

[twocvbloke]

In my opinion, if it's under the radar, let it stay under the radar until after it has sold, otherwise you may be denying someone who can't afford the "big bucks" prices some collectables seem to go for these days, and let them reveal their bargain acquisitions if they choose to...

[Owain]

Suppose a seller has two of a Thing. He lists one, and it goes for "next to nothing". He decides it's not worth the hassle listing the second Thing and bins it instead.

Yes, buyer One got a bargain, but something interesting or rare has just been binned.

At the end of the day, if someone pays more than I can afford for an item, I hope that shows it's wanted and appreciated and will be looked after. It might even go to someone with a museum where it can be displayed nicely and lots of people enjoy it. Someone who only paid "next to nothing" might have been looking for something to make a lamp out of.

Also, if we mention a rare item, someone who really wants it but didn't know what it was called or hadn't found it has a chance to buy it that they wouldn't otherwise have had. They might still get it at a very fair price as not everything rare is valuable and not everything valuable is popular.

If someone does pay a stupidly high price then more fool them. At least if we're discussing it then hopefully most bidders will have bid a sensible amount.

Most of use will, at some point, sell some of our stuff (or our executors will) - at that time we'd want a fair price to be established. "Please don't let my wife sell my collection for what I told her I paid for it" is a phrase I've seen somewhere.

Popularising one's own auctions, without declaring an interest, is I think rather low behaviour.

[Dan/Panther]

I have long advocated that if you run across what appears to be a great eBay deal, or something you may feel is rare and it is an active auction, DO NOT POST IT TO THE FORUM.
If you are not interested in it personally, don't ruin it for those that may really want the item, and maybe will not get another opportunity to purchase that item at a bargain price.
If it's a collector, they should know what they are selling, if not a collector, then the item really means nothing to them except money. I purchased the 48-500 for $225.00 if it had been posted to the forum, I am convinced it would have reached a price I could not afford.
PLEASE, don't post active auctions. I have requested that at least 10 times over the last few years. That's why the thread about the 48-500 is titled "NOW the story can be told". It was after the auction ended.

Also when a guy makes a mistake in an auction, and someone sends a message and tells them. WRONG, Just like 'BUYER BEWARE', 'SELLER DO YOUR HOMEWORK'.

If you go to a yard sale and see an item that is a real bargain, but you don't want it, do you stand there and tell everyone what a bargain it is ?

My bottom line is this.

The seller needs to do their homework.
The buyer needs to do their homework. 

Please don't do it for them.

D/P

[Dan/Panther]

I would like to add one more observation.
Speculators will cruise hot auctions to buy items to Hoard or save for a profit. Not really collectors. I have seen at least 2-(49-500's)
go to Japan, never to be seen again.

D/P

[HarrySmith]

Do we really think discussing a phone here is going to skyrocket the price? The deep pocket buyers, like JKL & others scour eBay a lot more than we do and if they see one they want the sky is the limit. I do not think anyone here could outbid them!
Case in point MagicMo's original WE video phone.

[twocvbloke]

Suppose a seller has two of a Thing. He lists one, and it goes for "next to nothing". He decides it's not worth the hassle listing the second Thing and bins it instead.

Yes, buyer One got a bargain, but something interesting or rare has just been binned.

I've kind of experienced that in the past, watched two similar items, one goes for a low bid, the other goes unsold & doesn't get relisted, one kind message to the seller offering money for the unsold item and hey presto, another bargain had...

[Key2871]

Owane brought up an excellent point. And after some thought this was brought up in the ATCA list many years ago.
So I will oblige the wishes of the others, and not post anything that would be considered old and or valuable from the bay.