F1 style handset with no markings?

[Partyline4]

What does it mean when there is a F1 style handset with no markings on it?

Where could it have come from?

[andre_janew]

If it has no markings, what makes you think it is an F-1?  Do you have a picture of it that you can post?

[baldopeacock]

Probably went to an independent is my guess.

I have seen several color F1 handsets with the logo apparently ground and polished off.   Again, independent telco was my guess.

[unbeldi]

An F1 handset manufactured by Western Electric for use outside the Bell System had the following marking, without the mentioning of the Bell System:

Western Electric Company
             U.S.A.
              F1W

Parts designated for sale outside the System, had the suffix "W".

A few other companies made handset very similar to WECo's.
I think Connecticut Telephone was one of them.

It is possible that the logo got rubbed off by polishing. One finds this particularly on the groove-less brown Bakelite handset that were used on the colored, painted 302s.

A picture would help to identify your piece.

[Partyline4]

Here's the handset.

I agree with independent Telco theory.

It looks like it was ground off.

[unbeldi]

The logo is recessed into a rectangular area, so the entire handle would have to be ground down. Could it be filled in with with some kind of resin?  When I enhance the image it looks like this:

[Partyline4]

Here's the listings that I was scoping out.

1.) www.ebay.com/itm/301544116774

2.) www.ebay.com/itm/291392270123

His price is on the high side...

Isn't it?

#1 has a 4H dial. The body is marked "AB1". I read about those after looking at the auction. Are they desirable? With no ringer, and an independent handset, I just don't know.

#2 has a F1W handset like was mentioned earlier in the thread.

[unbeldi]

How do you know it has a No.4 dial.   The number face plate is from a time after 1954 (without Z).

The first one is from Canada, at least the base is by Northern Electric.  The 101 induction coils has that tab showing through the bottom. The AB1 housing means it did have an induction coil, just no ringer and instead had a special mount for a frequency ringer to installed by the independent telephone company.   The AA1 had no 'guts' at all.

Both of these are in far too poor shape to demand the price they are asking.  I would not spend more than $25 on each of these, and the one with the cracks I would ignore, there are too many available without cracks.

[Partyline4]

I noticed that 4H's have a more curved finger stop.

4H:

5H:


Is that false? If so , let me know!


How else are you supposed to know other than looking on the back?

I say that because I've read instances of people knowing exactly what a dial is and they only have a front view picture.

The 5H's finger stop is a little more straight towards the end.

Just something I noticed....

[Kenton K]

The curved older style finger transitioned to a bent fingermstop in the early 40s, well into the 5h dial production. 5h dial started production in 1937 ( or is it 1936, I forget).

It is true that (almost) all 4h dials have the curved finger stop, not all curved stops are 4h.

Ken

[poplar1]

Northern Electric 5H dials never had the short finger stops. Since the base is NE, the dial may very well be NE also.
The handset was probably marked Bell System, and the logo was probably obliterated by one of the refurbishers such as Beco, and not by an independent  telephone company.

Western Electric switched from the long, curved finger stops on 5H dials  sometime after 6-44 and by 3-46.
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=11422.msg125729#msg125729

[WEBellSystemChristian]

It's possible that 4Hs could have had a finger stop changed out at some point with a 5H stop, but I would say that a sure thing to tell of a dial is a 4H is to look at the stop.

[HarrySmith]

I remember (slightly) a very very long discussion on unmarked handsets some years back. I think it was on the lists and it never did reach a definite conclusion. Many photos of many handsets were posted. Some were obviously ground and some looked untouched. I did a quick search but could not find it.

[poplar1]

Other than a third type finger stop on early (1930-1931?) 4H dials, I can't tell the difference in a 1933-1938 4H dial and a 1936-1944 dial just by looking at the finger stop. Here are two metal 302s--1938 and 1940--with original 5H dials:

[Partyline4]

Thanks everyone for clearing that up!

I really appreciate it!

I'm finding that it's really hard to find a good deal online. 

I've had worse luck at antique stores in recent days.

They all want RETAIL!