News:

"The phone is a remarkably complex, simple device,
and very rarely ever needs repairs, once you fix them." - Dan/Panther

Main Menu

WE #5F Dial Curved Finger Stop.

Started by Russ Kirk, June 22, 2010, 08:22:48 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Russ Kirk

My Switchboard sits next to my computer desk.  I am packing up my phones in preparation for moving to Southern California. The other day I was taking a break from packing and I was looking at the dial of my switchboard and noticed something I have never seen.  

The WE 551 switchboard has a #5F dial and finger stop is curved or contoured to better fit a finger.

So,  I looked at my documentation on dials and did not find anything on this fitted finger stop.  Maybe I missed it,  but can anyone provide any information?  I have never seek this on any other desk set or telephone.

Undoubtedly, someone here knows much more than me and can provide an answer.

Thanks

Russ.....

- Russ Kirk
ATCA & TCI

HarrySmith

I will have to check the dial on my 555, I do not recall the shape. I have not seen that shape on any WE phones.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Jim Stettler

Russ,
I have only seen that fingerstop on switchboard dials. They didn't use them on all switchboard dials, but my understanding is that was the "official use". Steve Hilsz probably has a good opinion on this fingerstop.

Many Switchboard dials are 20pps vs 10pps


ISTR there was discussion on the listservers about these fingerstops a couple of years ago.

Jim
You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

Jim Stettler

My 555 switchboard does not have the curved fingerstop.

I used to have a dial w/ switchboard mount that did have the curve. I had another 20pps dial w/ curved stop. It was in need of rebuild. I was told that the 20 pps and stop was for a switchboard.

I would think the curved stop is a lot more ergonomic.
Jim
You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

Dennis Markham

I have a 5E dial that I bought at one of the phone shows.  I spent so much time picking out one with a nice dial plate (the seller had a box full of #5 dials for $20 each) that I didn't notice the 5E designation or the curved finger stop.  I later learned, after posting the question to the phone club list that the 5E is a switch board dial and it spins at 20 pulses per second instead of the common 10 pps for the telephones.  I contacted Steve Hilsz about it and he gave me a wiring scheme that will allow it to work in a 302 or whatever phone I decide to put it in.  However it still sits on my desk like a paperweight.  

If anyone is interested in this dial it's yours for what I paid...$20.

LarryInMichigan

Dennis,

I may be interested in your dial.  I might be going out your direction in the next few weeks.


Larry

Dennis Markham

OK Larry.  Just give me heads-up so I can make sure to be here....and sweep the dust under the rug.

Russ Kirk

Thanks for the info on the fingerstop.  It certainly is a unique item to point out in my collection, albeit minor.   

I was thinking that the dial was spinning way too fast and maybe it needed repairs.  Now I know the 20 PPS is a normal function.  I guess it helped the operators to dial and transfer calls quicker. 

The slave drivers are everywhere!  Work work work!

Thanks again!

Russ........
- Russ Kirk
ATCA & TCI

paul-f

#8
Quote from: Russkirk on June 22, 2010, 08:22:48 PM
My Switchboard sits next to my computer desk.  I am packing up my phones in preparation for moving to Southern California. The other day I was taking a break from packing and I was looking at the dial of my switchboard and noticed something I have never seen. 

The WE 551 switchboard has a #5F dial and finger stop is curved or contoured to better fit a finger.

So,  I looked at my documentation on dials and did not find anything on this fitted finger stop.  Maybe I missed it,  but can anyone provide any information?  I have never seek this on any other desk set or telephone.

Undoubtedly, someone here knows much more than me and can provide an answer.


Here's a step-by-step list of one way to find out a bit about the 5F dial using the on-line resources.

1.  Consult the TCI Library
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/index.htm ( dead - 6/11/18 )

2. Select the WE C Series BSPs (due to the vintage of the 5F dial)
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/C_Series/fancyindex.php ( dead - 6/11/18 )

3. Use the browser Control-F to search for "dial" and select this BSP:
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/C_Series/C18.005.00-i4-Station-Dials-Rotary-Type.PDF ( dead - 6/11/18 )

  c-series-i-m-sets/c00-c29-index-general-apparatus-wiring/3225-c18-005-00-i4-station-dials-rotary-type-tl  -->  PDF copy attached below

4. Read through the BSP until you find a reference in table B, Use of 5-type dials.  Done.

The same general process should work if you select the 501 division (for later BSPs), but there is a problem -- the 5-type dials aren't referenced in the title on that page.  Here's what happened to me.

1.  Consult the TCI Library
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/index.htm

2. Select the WE 501 Division BSPs
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/501Division/fancyindex.php

3. Use the browser Control-F to search for "dial" -- couldn't find the #5 dial.

4. Select the Division index.  There are currently 3 available.  I picked the 1968 issue:
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/501Division/501-000-000-i68-Index.pdf

5. Read through the index looking for the #5 dial.  What? Not found!  Let's look at the BSP that covers the #6 dial and see it that helps -- 501-162-102.  (Sure would be nice if the documents were text-searchable.   Room for improvement.)

6. Go back to the Division index (step 4). and select the BSP by number. (Notice there's no description in the directory -- more room for improvement!)
  http://www.telephonecollectors.org/DocumentLibrary/BSPs/501Division/501-162-100.pdf

7. Oh look!  The BSP Title also contains the #5 dial!  What luck!

8. Read through the BSP.  We find that most info on the #5 dial has been removed by issue 7, so we need to find an earlier issue that may still have the info.  If we can't find one on-line, it may be worth asking on the forum or club lists.  While we're here, we can look at the uses for the 6F dial, as we learned above that it replaced the 5F.

I hope this helps make the existing tools a bit more useful.

By now, everyone's probably ready to shell out the $2,000 for the paper BSPs!

By the way, if you had the paper files, you'd still have to find the right BSP -- also using an index to reference the BSP number.  Then you'd have to hope that the BSPs were filed in order, that you have the desired BSP and that the proper issue containing the info you want is in your paper copy.  Good luck with that, too!

In this case, the paper index also doesn't have the reference to the #5 dial that's in the BSP title!  The same error is in all three Division indexes posted in the TCI library.  The Bell System missed out on correcting that one.

The message is that no matter how much info you have, chances are it won't be enough. Be tenacious.

We have to do the best possible job with the tools at hand.  When you encounter situations like this and discover opportunites for improvement, don't be shy about sending tactful, specific suggestions to the site manager.  Before you hit send, remember that this is a hobby and think how you'd react if you were in their shoes and got your message.  Also, contributing scans and photos will help make the libraries more useful faster. 

   
Visit: paul-f.com         WE  500  Design_Line

.

Dan/Panther

Russ;
Where about are you moving to in California ?
BTW, Your switchboard operator, is a real Dog.
D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

Jim Stettler

#10
In addition to Pauls thread:

I like to check Paul F's site to see which BSP he referances. It makes for a good starting point.
Remco has a lot of BSP info on his Document repository.

     http://sc.infc.info/  ( dead link 6/12/18 )

If you scan any telephone related documents Remco will host them.

If you quote BSP references it is nice if you include the BSP Name, Number, and issue date. (and maybe an online link if there is one)

Jim
You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

HarrySmith

Just checked my board, it has a plain finger stop on the dial, no curve.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

JorgeAmely

This dial, with the curvy finger stop, flew under the radar, probably because the seller thought it was an American Automatic Electric dial. It smells to WE 5x from here.

220629922985

or

http://cgi.ebay.com/220629922985

Jorge

Dennis Markham

That's a 5E....switchboard dial.  I think you're right, Jorge.  It did fly under the radar.


JorgeAmely

Dennis:

Check this group of four. More curved finger stops! The newest one of the lot is a 6x dated 1969!

Jorge