12/51 Two Toned 500 set

[Doug Rose]

Janet found this last summer and thought she had a great find. Under closer examination the dates do not match and the red soft plastic shell has a tiny crack on each corner 

I am not a 500 guy, but I have never seen the handset connection like this....Doug

[poplar1]

"500", 500A, and 500B had a 311A equalizer. 500T, and later 500J, 500K had just the connecting block for the handset cord, as in your phone. See Paul's site:
http://paul-f.com/we500t.htm

Your phone was apparently converted from a 500T or 500K to a 500D, which meant replacing the 425A network with a 425B. Note the "53A" stamp on the base pan, which is the code for a two-tone red telephone set. "500DR-53A."

[paul-f]

Interesting find, Doug.

The bottom date is consistent with a 500T set.

If you look closely with light from the side, you may be able to make out the original letter under the C/D marking.

What's the date on the network?

Most T to D conversions I've seen were done before 1955. Most still had the original set date on the bottom, while some had that overpainted with the conversion date. The new C/D markings wasn't always in the same position. Apparently the marking standards were uncharacteristically loose at that time.

[Dan/Panther]

Was the coiled handset typical for 1951 ? Would the handset cord more likely be straight, and gray color ?

D/P

[Doug Rose]

Paul..... 9 54 on the network, I took the phone outside with a flash light and I cannot see under the C/D stamp.

David.....thank you for the info on the phone I did not know the 53A ment a two tone red.

I am taking form the post that this is a real two tone and not a made up after market phone.

thanks guys...both of you never disappoint....Doug

[Doug Rose]

Dan...the handset is a seven old and a later add...Doug

[Pourme]

we all learned something, tpday. Doug's find turned into something special....Also, your wife was proven right, as well. I'm sure that happens often, Doug!

[Dan/Panther]

Mrs. Rose, be kind to Doug, He's still learning.
It's a G-3 ?
What should the handset cord be ?
That's great that Paul confirms it's a factory set up, except for handset, and the network.

Dan

[unbeldi]

It is not a factory-made two-tone set.
A customer ordered a two-tone set and the set was built in the telco shop or the WECo distributing center from reconditioned parts in stock, adding a new or recent red 1955 housing. The set was remarked with the 53A stamp.

[Doug Rose]

Trust me.... Janet know who the boss is.....    and it isn't me   

[Doug Rose]

It is not a factory-made two-tone set.
A customer ordered a two-tone set and the set was built in the telco shop or the WECo distributing center from reconditioned parts in stock, adding a new or recent red 1955 housing. The set was remarked with the 53A stamp.

Karl....thanks for the clarification ...Doug

[Jim Stettler]

Was the coiled handset typical for 1951 ? Would the handset cord more likely be straight, and gray color ?

D/P

This 500T from 1951 has a straight cord.
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=16922.msg174570#msg174570

[andre_janew]

Because it most likely started out as an all black phone, I think it had a straight black handset cord at one time.  The color of the cords on two tone sets, I've noticed, usually match the color of the dial and handset.

[WEBellSystemChristian]

Great find, Doug!!

Definitely an original Two Tone 500: the only time matching dates don't really matter in the world of 500s!

I have 4 two-tone 500s, and none of them are remotely Bell concoctions.

[RotarDad]

Christian - the term "original" must be carefully applied.   If I understand this correctly, there are four types of two-tones:

1) Western Electric factory-assembled units made in '53 before color handsets and dials were available.  These were usually marked with the color code and an "A" on the bottom. Dates will closely match.
2) Refurbished units assembled during that mid-fifties time period and often also marked with the "A" - Doug's '51 is one of those.
3) Field units with swapped shells per customer request.  These are hard to prove, but some very old, unmolested sets with mid-fifties color shells might be period pieces.
4) All the others put together by hobbyists and hopeful resellers.

The value of these is pretty much in the same order, with 1) being the most desirable.    One other way to narrow down what might be original is by color - if the shell is anything other than Ivory -50, Green -51, Gray -52, or Red -53, the phone is not a WE factory two-tone.