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Mirror Shine On Bakelite

Started by rp2813, February 28, 2014, 02:04:03 AM

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Matilo Telephones

Sure Doug, it looks fantastic. But using Avon (aha, first didn´t know what you meant, but you use skin cream) means we are looking at shining skin cream. If you take that off, what does it look like?

Don´t get me wrong. If you want to do it like that, I do not disagree nor do I agree. I just do it differently for reasons of my own.
Groeten,

Arwin

Check out my telephone website: http://www.matilo.eu/?lang=en

And I am on facebook too: www.facebook.com/matilosvintagetelephones

Doug Rose

It is a liquid oil. I leave it on for a day to penetrate the bakelite and wipe off the excess. To take the pictures, I wiped of all the excess today.

The Norths pictures were taken days after the SSS was removed. Bakelite, be wood base soaks in the SOS. Sometimes you need more than one application on troubled areas. Nothing will help bakelite once it orange peels. SOS works like a polish, it will not last forever, as a polish will will not either, dust and life will dull it BUT as you can see it sure brings out a wonderful shine.

I don't think the wonderful shine that Jorge got on his AE will be the same next year as it is today as life takes it toll. It will have to be dusted and re-polished. SSS will just rejuvenate it a shine and it deep feeds the bakelite. .  Just my humble opinion. ....Doug

Kidphone

Phonesrfun

So, its the stuff in the stuff that has the bulk to temporarily  fill in the pits and crevasses like applying peanut butter to a craggy piece of toast?

Will the oils and other chemicals eventually increase the erosion of the Bakelite?
-Bill G

Doug Rose

Bill...I have been using it for 35 years and have not had an issue. Still have many of the same phones I first used it on.

NO, it will not be like peanut butter on toast as I said "Nothing will help bakelite once it orange peels."

If you don't see a difference in the pictures, I would not use it. I am not selling SSS and have no vested interest. It works for me. Nothing more. Just trying to help my fellow collectors..Doug
Kidphone

HarrySmith

Doug, where is the before pictire on the Fatboy?

You are referring to Avon "Skin So Soft" correct?? That would be "SSS" not "SOS". The same stuff that is great for repellling mosquitos?
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Doug Rose

Harry...forgot to take a before a before picture....as usual. It is Avon skin so soft..."The same stuff that is great for repellling mosquitos?"....Doug
Kidphone

Matilo Telephones

Before pics or not, it is clear that the Avon SSS was not put on for nothing. The phone wouldn't be as shiny as it is now, wouldn't it?

So we are back to the start of this discussion, can such a shine be achieved by polishing alone? The answer is, mostly, no. Unless the bakelite is in excellent condition to begin with, or unless you help it shine with an additive like varnish, wax, oil, avon or whatever.

It is not impossible though. See my thread here, of a very shiny find. This phone is just a bit dusty and nothing has been done to it by me, except wiping some of the dust off with my hand:

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=10994.0

Imagine this one polished and photographed outside!
Groeten,

Arwin

Check out my telephone website: http://www.matilo.eu/?lang=en

And I am on facebook too: www.facebook.com/matilosvintagetelephones

tallguy58

When in doubt, just get this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/191084167936

Even new it's not as shiny as those other ones.
Cheers........Bill

Doug Rose

Quote from: Matilo Telephones on March 01, 2014, 06:21:07 PM
Before pics or not, it is clear that the Avon SSS was not put on for nothing. The phone wouldn't be as shiny as it is now, wouldn't it?

So we are back to the start of this discussion, can such a shine be achieved by polishing alone? The answer is, mostly, no. Unless the bakelite is in excellent condition to begin with, or unless you help it shine with an additive like varnish, wax, oil, avon or whatever.

It is not impossible though. See my thread here, of a very shiny find. This phone is just a bit dusty and nothing has been done to it by me, except wiping some of the dust off with my hand:

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=10994.0

Imagine this one polished and photographed outside!
I think you are overlooking the fine steel wool and the brasso and the hours of repetitive removing of layers of grime.

With the color phones you could see them changing color, long before SSS was added. The bakelite would get warm to the touch from the steel wool. Bakelite, being porous will absorb the Avon SSS and make it less brittle and stronger. You will see the drier damaged areas suck SSS in and leave it dry until repeated applications make the areas equal.

How do you rejuvenate the "excellent bakelite?" How do you keep it from drying out? Just asking....Doug

Kidphone

Matilo Telephones

Do the fine steel wool and Brasso make it shinier than it was to begin with? Can you provide us with pictures of this and show us how you did that?

How does it make it less brittle? Does the Avon solidify? Once applied, is it bonded with bakelite in such a way that it is no longer possible to remove it?

How did you learn that the bakelite is less brittle?

The last 2 questions I do not understand. Why rejuvinate bakelite that has a factory fresh appearance? Bakelite does not dry out. It is a resin.
Groeten,

Arwin

Check out my telephone website: http://www.matilo.eu/?lang=en

And I am on facebook too: www.facebook.com/matilosvintagetelephones

Phonesrfun

Several years ago I tried a method that had reasonable results which actually attempted to repair the fact that resin material had "washed away" from a dull, moderately rough F1 Bakelite handset.  This DID NOT restore the handset to its original state by any means, but like I said, the results were reasonable.  I don't even remember where I found the article, but I think it was written by a club member, either from TCI or ATCA.  It might have also been an antique radio forum.  I did not save any instructions.  They are pretty easy and straight forward.

Basically, it involved hand-applying 3-4 coats of tung oil varnish and buffing between each application.  Hand applying the varnish was not too difficult.  However, due to the fact that the handset is non-porous, and not wood, it takes several (2-4) days for each coat to dry.  More-so with the more coats applied.  You could plan on this process taking a week and a half to finish.

Buffing is accomplished with triple or quadruple aught (000) or (0000) steel wool, and very lightly at that.  It is very easy to buff the entire coat away.  The purpose is to get any minute bubbles or other irregularities out and make the surface as smooth as possible.  Each coat smooths over and fills in for  more and more of the missing resin.  (The old peanut butter effect).

After three or four coats, you have a much smoother surface and much harder as far as a coating is concerned than no coating at all.  It may even halt the further erosion of the resins, at least for the time being.

At this stage, you have a fairly glossy (more semi-glossy) surface.  Tung oil is not black, so a dark black color is still missing.  Also, because the tung oil is somewhat transparent, there is a little bit of a clear-coat 3-D effect when the light penetrates the coating.

To this finished product, you can apply black shoe polish for a more black and glossy end result.  Hell, you could even paint it black at that point, but a rattle-can paint job always looks like crap.  I would go with the black shoe-polish and a good buffing with a shoe-shine rag.  Use lotsa elbow grease.  Seems that no matter what, it always comes back down to elbow grease.

I think this is a reasonable approach to take on a handset that has some low-level pitting and resin erosion.  I sold the phone a long time ago that had this one and only handset procedure done to it, so I have no photos.

If someone is willing to try this, I am sure everyone would be interested in the results.

-Bill G

Doug Rose

#26
Quote from: Matilo Telephones on March 02, 2014, 01:55:56 AM
Do the fine steel wool and Brasso make it shinier than it was to begin with? Can you provide us with pictures of this and show us how you did that?

How does it make it less brittle? Does the Avon solidify? Once applied, is it bonded with bakelite in such a way that it is no longer possible to remove it?

How did you learn that the bakelite is less brittle?

The last 2 questions I do not understand. Why rejuvinate bakelite that has a factory fresh appearance? Bakelite does not dry out. It is a resin.
Matilio Telephones.....This has become an inquistion. I feel like I am on trial.  As I said, if you don't see a difference in the pictures, don't use it.

Here are the only picutres I have.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=8211.msg115712#msg115712

its a hobby....it supposed to be fun! ..Doug
Kidphone

DavePEI

#27
What works for various people works for them. If you don't like someone else''s suggestion, just don't try it.

If anyone has any other suggestions, go ahead and mention them. We may find a miracle cure. I have always wondered about coating the bakelite with fibreglass resin, but have never tried it.

I have used Doug's idea on a number of phones, and find it does work quite well. It requires re-coating with SSS  every year or so, but makes the phones display very well. It can''t perform miracles - garbage in, garbage out.

Doug finds this works for him, as do I. Others may not, but that doesn't make his suggestion any less valuable than other ideas.

I still think the best solution is to put the degraded bakelite in a time machine and send it back to the manufacturer for a free replacement :)

Dave
The Telephone Museum of Prince Edward Island:
http://www.islandregister.com/phones/museum.html
Free Admission - Call (902) 651-2762 to arrange a visit!
C*NET 1-651-0001

rp2813

#28
I appreciate the suggestions and testimonials that have been provided here and have the highest respect for the methods behind them, as they come from far more qualified and seasoned collectors than myself.

I feel bad that by launching this thread, I've managed to reinforce the notion that no good deed goes unpunished.

Thanks also for clarifying the fineness of the steel wool.  Once I get my hands on some Avon SSS I'll experiment on one of my parts phones.  That process seems faster and easier to maintain than the tung oil method, but I guess I should have specified that I'm looking to improve the finish on one of my daily driver phones, not one that's displayed on a shelf.  If either the Brasso/SSS or the tung oil treatments won't hold up under daily use, then I probably should just hunt down a properly dated handset in better shape.



Ralph
Ralph

Matilo Telephones

Ehm, perhaps I am missing something here. Why are my questions suddenly taken as an inquisition? What is so bad about them? I do not understand this at all.

Please Doug, my questions are just that, questions. You present a method here unknown to me and make statements about it. I am trying to learn what you did and what effects it had.
Groeten,

Arwin

Check out my telephone website: http://www.matilo.eu/?lang=en

And I am on facebook too: www.facebook.com/matilosvintagetelephones