How Old Is My G1 Handset?

[rp2813]

I just bought a G1 handset on ebay over the weekend (my '53/'56/'57/'62 franken500 doesn't have one) and it arrived today.  It needs cleaning, has a loooooooong coiled cord (dated 1969) more appropriate for a 554 than a 500, and when I opened up the transmitter end, I found it has the molded retainer for the cord in the handset, not on the cup.  An early one!

I've read elsewhere that this type of G1 wasn't manufactured after appx 1952, I think, but I own a 7/54 500 that has a 1954 dated handset of this same type.  This latest handset I bought has no date on anything but the later plastic caps ('69).  Can anyone provide an approximate time span for production of this type of G1 before they started using the transmitter cup as the cord retainer?

This piece needs a good cleaning, but I think it will turn out looking nice after a good going over.

Thanks for any advice on production period for this one.

[Dan/Panther]

I'm not positive but your date of 1952 sounds close. I've checked Pauls site, and I don't see dates listed for the G1 handset.
D/P

Check here.
http://www.paul-f.com/we500typ.htm#Handsets
ts

[rp2813]

Here's where I found the item stating that production stopped in 1952, but I don't know how accurate the information is.

http://members.dslextreme.com/~zuperdee/telephones/500_history/we_500_history.html

[Dan/Panther]

Ralph;
The information after reading it seems reliable.
D/P

[Jester]

There are several statements made on the site in Ralph's link that I can't agree with & this is one of them.  To start with, most G-3 handsets that I have that  were made 1954-6 use the early G-1 style transmitter cup and a clear plastic retainer to hold the cord in the handset.  If the later cups were put into use at this time, there would be more of them seen in all G type handsets from this date IMO.  Also, since many of my sets are two-tone, I have several examples of G-1 around.  I can't remember a specific date on any of the handles, but all of them have the hook molded inside the transmitter end of the handset.

[Dan/Panther]

Stephen;
What statement are you referring to ?
I don't see anything stating; "this is a fact", only speculation.
D/P
Here is a photo of an all matching number 57-500 with the early style G1 Handset.
You can't see it well in the first photo but the second shows '57 molded into the handset receiver cup.
So it appears that the date of 1953 is a little early.


There are several statements made on this site that I can't agree with & this is one of them.
Seems like a rather harsh way to put it.

[rp2813]

I don't think the guy on that site is claiming that everything he states is absolute fact.  He requests corrections from anyone who has better information.  But, that's exactly why I question his date of 1952, especially since I've got a 1954-dated handset that has the molded cord retainer in it.

I also think the site hasn't been updated in a long time, so even if people have more accurate info, the content isn't being updated and/or corrected with it.

I would think that Paul F's site has the most reliable information, but there are no hard dates regarding this issue on his site either.

[Dennis Markham]

Dan, I think Stephen was referring to that Time-Line site, not the Forum.

[Jester]

I apologize for the confusion caused by the wording I chose above.  I was referring to the website in Ralph's link and have since modified the offending sentence in the posting above to reflect that.  I will also acknowledge that there are statements made by the person who assembled that timeline that are obviously speculative, and the writer is looking for verification.  The statement regarding G-1 handsets using the hooked transmitter cups after 1952 was not worded in a way to suggest that information was guessed at--it was plainly stated.  D/P actually provided the best argument to this being true with the above picture showing a "57" stamped inside the handle.

[Dan]

That is the "youngest" early style G-1 I have ever seen , Dan/P. I wonder if there are any newer ones out there? I would say no. Thanks for the picture.

[Dan/Panther]

Stephen;
Like they say, "MY Bad", just a second, I type better with both my feet on the floor instead of one in my mouth..
I go to the post office today and pick up a 5302 and it has a  G-3 handset we speak of., pictures below.
The face of it also has the "F" stamped into it. I've recently seen another post about he "F" cap, and is VERY flimsy.
It also has an "H" embossed on the receiver cap, and both have very tiny holes. The handset body is stamped 64 inside the receiver cap.
I opened up the set, and to my surprise it was very clean inside, dated 4-53.
Can anyone I.D. the insignia on the bottom, the phone is Marked Western Electric.
D/P

[rp2813]

That is a nice 5302.  The one I recently acquired is the same, with GF handset and F1 transmitter and HA1 receiver, and F and H marking on the respective caps.  To me, 5302's equipped like this are the most shining example of a phone that is entirely 302 beneath its bakelite and plastic casings masquerading as a 500, and that is what I really like about them, along with their slightly smaller footprint that can help in some placement situations.  They are the ultimate example of Ma Bell's practice of redeployment or adaptive re-use for perfectly good existing equipment in their inventory, and the vast majority of subscribers who received them were none the wiser.  I think the 5302's is a great story.

[Jim Stettler]

A quick summation of some of the points raised so far.
I think Paul's site used to have a 52-53 referance. I did tell him about the "57 prongs in the past

I remember when zuperdee was creating this site. He did try to be thorough and he hasn't updated it for a long time.

Most prong handsets are early.

However '57 seems to be a re-introduction date for them, I have 2 of these handsets, neither came with a phone.

My take on the '57 prong handsets is that the molds had been retired, and then brought back into production, I think the "57 prong handsets were probably used on odd-ball (low-production ) sets. Dan's  handset is on a 500, is his an exception , or the rule. It could be the molds were reintoduced to help meet demand. I think the "57 prong handsets are an exception.

After the prong handsets were clear 2-peice cups, the standard non-cord cup and a crosspiece. shortly later they went to the one piece cup. I have an 1980's? ITT? set that has a "modern"(post mod)  2 piece cup to retain the HW handset.

Dan, There is a thread about 5302 that addresses the issue of your stuck element. There is an adaptor piece that should stay in the handle. I think Dennis posted some really good photos and it was Larry with the same problem ( I am going off the top of my head).



Regarding Zuperdee. If the e-mail link is active, advise him of any other info you have.  If you start e-mailing updated info he will probably pop back into the hobby. Vern P may have a good e-mail address for Zuperdee


Zuperdee has never claimed his info as fact, he is trying to find the facts, so any info would help his cause. Zuperdee is in his 20's (I beleive), and he would probably join this forum when he has time for telephones.

I am in a "busy mode" so I apologize for not researching these comments better. As I said, I am going off the top of my head.

I can try to research some follow up next week.
Jim

[Jester]

Can anyone I.D. the insignia on the bottom, the phone is Marked Western Electric.
D/P

Nice find, D/P.  That's the first example I've seen of a G/F handset using the G-3 handle.  I have seen that mark on 5302's before.  I have no idea what it means, but would guess that an independent telco could have used a mark like that to ID their phones.  The first time I saw one, the base of the phone had been thickly coated in fresh black paint & the mark was applied before the paint had dried, so it left an impression in the fresh paint job.

[Jim Stettler]

Can anyone I.D. the insignia on the bottom, the phone is Marked Western Electric.
D/P

Nice find, D/P.  That's the first example I've seen of a G/F handset using the G-3 handle.  I have seen that mark on 5302's before.  I have no idea what it means, but would guess that an independent telco could have used a mark like that to ID their phones.  The first time I saw one, the base of the phone had been thickly coated in fresh black paint & the mark was applied before the paint had dried, so it left an impression in the fresh paint job.

I have seen this mark before, I have heard it is from a rebuilder, I think it might be from a WE "Contract" rebuilder. Just my guess.
Jim