Another question about wiring. I am looking to wire my we233g to a network and ringer from a 500 set.It had a network attached to the coin shoot that I removed.I have looked at the wire diagrams but can not make heads or tails of it.I need to know proper places for wires and which 5 go to subset etc, and there placement to the stack switch and hand set.
Sorry for the drawn out question but when you see the mess insde you will know. http://s1070.photobucket.com/albums/u486/1coors/
I have the connections at home, and I can send them on a little later tonight. The one big question is whether you are going to wire this as an extension phone or are you going to build or buy a coin phone simulator/controller? The simulator/controller is a device that you hook the pay phone up to which will take and/or return coins based on whether the call goes through or not.
Since you say that it had a network connected to the coin chute, I take it your phone is missing the coin relay. If you have no coin relay, you can't put a simulator on it.
So, I take it, you are going to just want it to function as an extension phone?
Thanks for the reply Bill.Yes for the time being I am just using as an extension phone. Some time down the road (when I can find a coin hopper and relay) I might concider a controller.
Thanks Dan
I forgot I have a meeting to go to tonight. I am on the west coast, and Pacific Time. I will be back about 8:30 or 9pm tonight my time.
I can then dig out the diagram for you.
OK, assuming you are using a 500 set as a network, make sure all the hookswitch contacts for the old 500 have been disconnected from the 425 network inside the 500 base.
The network inside the 500 base will be labeled 425 and then a dash letter, I.E. 425-B, E or some other suffix. I will refer to that network as a 425.
Line cord wires:
Connect the red line cord wire to L2 of the 425 network, and the green line cord wire to L1 (Same connections as a model 500 phone.
Ringer wires:
Connect the red ringer wire to L2 on the 425; connect the black ringer wire to L1 on the 425; connect the slate ringer wire to K on the 425, and connect the slate/red ringer wire to A on the 425. This is the same wiring that the original 500 has too.
Place a short jumper wire between L1 on the 425 and C on the 425.
Payphone handset (Assumes this is a G handset with 4 wires...Black, Red, White, White)
Red handset wire and one White handset wire to TR on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing. (Either white wire will do)
Black handset wire to T on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Other white handset wire will go to terminal GN on the payphone hookswitch.
Connections between the subset (500 model phone with 425 network) (5 wires)
Wire 1 between L2 on the 425 network and terminal Y on the payphone hookswitch
Wire 2 between RR on the 425 network and terminal R on the payphone hookswitch
Wire 3 between R on the 425 network and TR on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Wire 4 between B on the 425 network and T on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Wire 5 between GN on the 425 network and terminal W on the payphone hookswitch.
Make sure there is a jumper between terminals BBX and BB on the payphone hookswitch
That should do it. All this assumes, of course, that nobody has messed around with the dial wiring, or the configuration of the transfer contact points between the upper and lower housing. If that is the case, then there will be more work involved.
Also, when replacing the upper housing, always do so with the phone off hook, otherwise the flimsy little brass tab that controls the bent coin release can get bent and break off.
Good luck.
Thanks Bill
That makes alot more sense, only thing different in my phone is the upper terminal strip is missing. So which wires would be coming up to it for the wires to join to from the hand set?
Sorry for all the questions.
Any old terminal strip will do. You only need two terminals, so a cheapie from Radio Shack will do just fine.
To one terminal you will connect the red and one white from the handset, and the other you connect the black from the handset. Please see my post from yesterday that lays this all out.
The connection that has the black handset wire becomes terminal "T" and will have Wire number 4 connected to it. The connection that has the red and white handset wire will become terminal TR and will have wire number 3 connected to it. Again, refer to yesterday's post.
I had one other thought about the model 500 phone you are planning on using for a subset. If it is an older type that has some of the hookswitch wires soldered to the 425 network terminals, then I should give you some additional instructions on how to deal with that situation. Let me know.
Sorry I misunderstood those connections, The donor phone was a 1979 model.
Thanks again will let you know how it went.
I have it wired up and seems to work fine
Thanks for your help Bill
Hi,
I've just rewired my ne233QF according to this and it work but I'm getting really low volume from the phone. Is that something to di with the wires or perhaps a bad subset or receiver.
I suppose everything is possible.
Could be almost anything. Can you post a picture of the inside of the phone with te wiring?
Hi will a 685A do the job or is there a reason for using a telephone ? I have no idea what a network is or does. Dennis
685A is the right one for a 233G or 234G pay phone.
The network is the part with terminals on top labeled L2, G, L1, K, A, F, RR, C, GN, B, R.
When a 685A is not available, it is possible to use the network and ringer from a 500 set to make the same circuit. Of course, it looks better to have a 685A with a cover.
O.K. I,ll reword, I'm pretty sure where the network is in the phone, I would like to know what it does or how it helps the phone work and why it is needed? I'm trying to learn. Dennis
A network is the electronic guts of a phone. It allows for connecting the handset to the line and properly splits the transmitting voltage from the receiving voltage. The 233 payphone did not come with a network inside. Many people have put mini networks inside payphones and sold them on line and sold them in other places. If yours is a 233G and has a network, then it is probably one that someone else has put in after the fact. What kind of network does your payphone have in it? If it has one already, then a 685 subset won't be necessary, although the 685 subset also has a ringer.
Do you have a photo of the inside of your payphone?
To answer your earlier question, why hook a payphone up to a 500 phone:
The 500 is a readily available phone at a relatively low cost. The 685A subset contains exactly the same network and ringer as the model 500. The 685 subset is not as available, and subsequently, they don't come up on e-bay or other places nearly as often, and when they do, they almost always cost more. The ready solution is to use a 500 phone as a subset.
If you have looked inside a WE 500 phone, the network is the square metal box with a plastic cover that has a dozen or more terminal connectors on the top.
The network has an induction coil, a couple of resistors, a couple of varistors, and some capacitors. The network not only matches the phone's transmitter and receiver (handset) to the line, but also provides for automatic line level compensation for voltage variances in the line, which are a function of how far the phone is located from the central office. This made it so that whether someone was located down the block from a central office or accross town, the voice levels and sevice experience would be the same for all customers.
The model 500 network technology was designed in the late 1940's. At the time, the network was a breakthrough in technology. Prior to that, phones just had a simpler induction coil and one capacitor for the voice circuit and one for the ringer. Due to the large size of the components, it was not until 1937 when the 302 came out that Western Electric put all the parts in the phone body. Prior to that, all phones such as the 102, 202 and candlesticks needed a separate subset for the coil, capacitor and ringer.
Even when the 500 came out and the 233 was designed to use the network technology, the network parts were still somewhat large, and would not easily fit in the existing pay phone case. Rather than redesigning the case, Western Electric and AE, the two makers of pay phones decided to use subsets. You can get a feel for why this is by looking at a 500 and seeing that between the size of the ringer and the network itself, there really is not any room inside the 233.
Even when people now put mini networks inside the pay phones, they will usually remove the coin relay and put the network in the spot where the relay once was.
Cheers
Bill, I also have 233 g WE that I am converting for home use. I am using the 425e network and a ringerbox that is mounted in a payphone booth. I followed your wiring layout and it helped very much. I still have only a couple issues. 1. I am not sure where the ringer wires go to the external ringer. There is a green and a red coming out of the ringer box. I presently have the green and red wires attached to the L-1 and L-2 on the 425 as you stated to do. I still have two wires left, a black and a clear wire to be attached somewhere from the 4 wire cord main line. Everything else is connected. 2. I only get a dial tone if I press and hold in the 4 prong metal connector that is located on the right side of the inside housing where you get the connection when re-attaching the phone back on the housing. Also, After doing so, I also get a dial tone when I rotate the dial and hold it? Wierd. I haven't a clue but any HELP would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Gary
Gary, in the wire going from the subset to the wall jack, you need only red and green wires.
You need 5 or 6 conductors from the subset to the pay phone.
Do you have a lock in the upper housing to hold the phone together? If not, you are having to push in on the upper housing because the contacts in the upper housing are not sufficiently connecting to the contacts in the upper housing.
I don't have a lock but I push the upper housing in all the way very firmly, TIGHT and still same issue.
I understood you to say that you do get a dial tone when pushing on the right side of the upper housing OR when you turn the dial--is that correct?
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 03:00:08 PM
I understood you to say that you do get a dial tone when pushing on the right side of the upper housing OR when you turn the dial--is that correct?
Only with the housing off will I get a dial tone by pushing and holding in the 4 prongs. When I connect the housing back on, I get no dial tone and the housing is completely pushed back and tight??? But, If I move the dial tone like I am dialing and hold it after rotating the dial slightly, I get a dial tone??? That is when the phone is completely put back together.
I know it sounds confusing. I get the dial tone when I push and hold the 4 prong with my fingers with the housing off. When I put the front housing on, I do not get any dial tone. Housing is pushed back firmly and tight. With saying that, when the phone is all put together, I get no dial tone. But, If I move the dial and hold it, I get a dial tone and when I let off the dial, there is no dial tone????? That may have explained it better. Sorry for the confusion.
Do you have 6 conductors from the phone to the subset and 2 from the subset to the wall? Originally, the booth would have had two 4-conductor wires between them, but only 6 of the 8 wires were used:
1st 4-conductor wire:
red from R in subset to TR terminal at top of the backplate in phone
green from GN in subset to W terminal (part of the hookswitch contacts and transfer contacts)
black from B in subset to T terminal at top of backplate
yellow from RR in subset to R terminal (hookswitch/transfer assembly)
2nd 4-conductor wire:
green from L2 on terminal strip of subset (not L2 on the 425 network) to L at top of backplate
red from L1 on terminal strip of subset (not L1 on the network) to Y terminal (hookswitch/xfer)
yellow--not used
black--not used
Here are the relevant connection diagrams:
233G
http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/document-repository/doc_details/2274-coin-collectors-we230685a-tl
685A wired to a 233G:
http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/document-repository/doc_details/2270-subscriber-s-sets-we685ad-tl
Make sure that there is a jumper (short brown wire) from L2 on the terminal strip of subset (not L2 on the network) to C on the network. (The brown wire may be on Terminal 2 before it is moved.)
Make sure that there is no jumper (short blue wire) from L1 on the terminal strip of the subset to RR on the network.
The outside line (green and red) connects to L and Y inside the phone. You can instead connect the outside line to the subset using L2 and L1 of the terminal strip (not L2 and L1 on the network).
Thank you. I think we are getting closer. I only have a T, TR, and L on my top terminal. There is presently no wires connected to L. I have 6 conductors from phone to the net 425e and 2 from 425e to wall. I may be needing a subset as all I have is the 425e network and the exterior phone box. There is 1 through 6 connectors in the phone box.
There should be connections from B on the network to T on the terminal strip at the top, and from R on the network to TR as discussed above. The handset needs to be connected also: One white wire to TR, Black to TR and red to T. (The other white handset wire connects to GN on the hookswitch.)
The 425E can be used even if it is not part of the subset. In that case, if you don't have a terminal strip near the network, you would connect the outside line to L1 and L2 on the network, run a short wire from L2 on the network to C, and connect the wire coming from Y in the phone to L1 on the network instead of L1 on the terminal strip of the subset. The L terminal doesn't have to be used if you have the outside line going directly to the subset.
I am following but if I hook up the wire from Y in the phone to the L-1 on the network it has no dial tone. If I connect the Y in the phone to L-2 on the network, I get a dial tone but only when I push on the 4 prongs and hold. Everything is hooked up but I have no subset? Do I need to purchase a WE 500 Rotary and hack the subset out of it? Thank you so much!!!!! I am much closer than I ever was!!!!
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:33:22 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:37:33 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:39:18 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:38:52 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:37:33 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:43:13 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:39:18 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:38:52 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:37:33 PM
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 08:31:18 PM
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 07:14:38 PM
L1 and L2 on the network---and L1 and L2 on the terminal strip--- are all just connecting points. It doesn't matter which ones you use to connect the outside line (from AT&T or whatever) so long as you also use the same terminals for both the outside iine AND the red wire from Y in the phone to L1 and a jumper wire from C to L2. Is that what you have?
There should also be a short wire between BB and BBX.
Do you have test leads with aligator clamps on each end? (Or two pieces of wire.) If so, you can temporarily put the upper housing (the part with the dial and coin slots) aside. Then connect one lead between W and BB terminals on the backplate, and another between SL and R.
Are all of the connections according to the diagram? Maybe you could post some photos of the inside of the phone and we might see something that isn't right.
SEE PICS
should be a wire from T in upper part of phone to B on the network.
Did you change handset cords? One is armored 4-conductor and other one is black 3-conductor.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 08:52:02 PM
should be a wire from T in upper part of phone to B on the network.
yes, there is a wire from B on network to T on top terminal. It so black so prob hared to see.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 08:59:44 PM
Did you change handset cords? One is armored 4-conductor and other one is black 3-conductor.
yes. 4 wires. I have the yellow going to the ground, green & black going to the TR, and red to the T. I JUST CAN'T FIGURE THIS OUT!!!! Why do I get a dial tone when I press the 4 prong connectors in and hold when upper housing is not on but when I put it on, no dial tone?? Strange.
I'm not familiar with those colors for a handset. The receiver wires should go to GN on the hookswitch and TR at the top. The transmitter should go to T and TR at the top.
GN stands for Green, not Ground. Originally, there was a ground connection to G on the coin relay, but your phone no longer has a coin relay. In any case, ground is not needed for use on modern lines.
When you push the transfer contacts together, you are shorting something out. The reason I suggested temporarily using the two wires from BB to W and SL to R is that this might have a similar effect. Removing the upper housing and running the temporary jumpers suggested should indicate whether there are any problems with the upper housing
I can't see the dial cord connections to the terminal strip in the upper housing, but they may have been moved around. From top to bottom they should be White dial wire to W, Yellow to Y, Green to BB, Red to R and Black at the bottom.
What is the yellow wire connected to BBX just above the coin vault?
EDIT: The terminal above the coin vault is BKX. BBX is on the hookswitch terminals.
There isn't any yellow wire connected to the BBX. It just looks that way in the pic. On the inside housing it is: 2 yellow wires to W, 1 red wire to Y, black and green wire to BB and 1 red wire to R and 1 brown to BBX. I will try the jumpers and let you know. T H A N K Y O U for your time!!
Sorry, I meant BKX not BBX.
I placed the temp. jumper cables as you stated and I get a perfect dial tone when I pick up the receiver. Is that good or bad? l.o.l.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 28, 2013, 10:56:01 PM
Sorry, I meant BKX not BBX.
The BKX only has the one brown wire connected to it.
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 11:12:57 PM
I placed the temp. jumper cables as you stated and I get a perfect dial tone when I pick up the receiver. Is that good or bad? l.o.l.
That's good. Probably means one of the following:
1. Dial cord not connected to the correct terminals on the terminal plate near the bottom of the upper housing
2. Open contacts on dial--when the dial is at rest, there should be continuity between BB and W contacts on the dial, and between Y and BK contacts on the dial.
3. Poor contact between the transfer springs on the baseplate and the contacts in the upper housing.
Thank you so much!!! We got this far. Not sure really what to do now but it looks like you narrowed it down to 3 things. Thank you again so much!!
Did you check the colors of the wires in the dial cord to make sure they are on the right terminals?
After that, try removing one of the two temporary jumpers, then replace the upper housing.
Then put that jumper back and remove the other jumper, and again replace the upper housing.
Quote from: BO on April 28, 2013, 11:54:00 PM
Thank you so much!!! We got this far. Not sure really what to do now but it looks like you narrowed it down to 3 things. Thank you again so much!!
Well, with the Upper housing back on complete, there is no dial tone until you rotate the dial slightly and hold it??? It must be with the upper housing somewhere like you said.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 29, 2013, 12:02:29 AM
Did you check the colors of the wires in the dial cord to make sure they are on the right terminals?
After that, try removing one of the two temporary jumpers, then replace the upper housing.
Then put that jumper back and remove the other jumper, and again replace the upper housing.
yes, the one jumper BB to W had no dial tone. The other jumper did. The color code and amount of wires are not as you had listed for the dialer in the upper housing? They are as follows: 2 yellow wires going to the W, 1 red wire going to the Y, 1 green and black going to the BB, 1 red going to the R and 1 brown going to the BKX.
O.k. Some success. I re-wired the upper housing wires to your color codes and I now have a dial tone when the the housing is connected to the phone. You have been such a great help. I have had this phone for 2 years and just now am I making the effort to get it working that is with your help. Bad news. I can't dial out or in. The dial seems to be working but after dialing a number, it doesn't do anything. I wonder what is left!!!!!!??? Could it be the new 4 conductor armored handset wires that may not be wired correctly? I would think it would dial out now? Thank you.
Any last chance things to check before giving up? I so much wanted to get this phone active. l.o.l. Thank you for everything. Gary
Check all the other wires to make sure they are connected to the right terminals. Use either the diagrams or the list in a previous post.
Looks like there would not be a wire connected to BKX screw on the backplate since the relay is missing. Try swapping the red and black dial cord wires in the upper housing so that the red dial wire is now on the BKX terminal in the upper housing and the black dial wire is on R terminal in the upper housing.
Quote from: poplar1 on April 29, 2013, 10:07:42 AM
Check all the other wires to make sure they are connected to the right terminals. Use either the diagrams or the list in a previous post.
Looks like there would not be a wire connected to BKX screw on the backplate since the relay is missing. Try swapping the red and black dial cord wires in the upper housing so that the red dial wire is now on the BKX terminal in the upper housing and the black dial wire is on R terminal in the upper housing.
BINGO!!!!!!!!! It dials out and excepts calls. Thank you. Now, when I attach the phone in the booth, how do I connect the green and red wires from the phone box to the network? I am so thankful for your help and time!!!!!!! Without your help, I would have NEVER got it working.
Is your ringer box labeled 687A or 685A? The 687A does not have a network but there should be a small capacitor and a ringer. You would connect the black ringer wire to the green incoming line and the red ringer wire to the red incoming line... The capacitor would connect to the other two ringer wires. (slate and red/slate).
In other words, the ringer circuit is connected directly to the line, just like an extension phone. If there is a capacitor inside the ringer box, then you are all set.
If you don't see a capacitor in the ringer box, you can always use A and K on the network instead. You would then have 4 wires to the ringer box instead of 2.
Poplar1, All good!!!!! Up and running!!!!! Very pleased. Could not have done it without your expertise and patience!!! I appreciate all your TIME dealing with this amateur. I will get you a pic soon as I will be mounting the phone in the booth soon. Thanks for all your help!!!!
Thanks to Poplar1, I have a working 233 G WE 3 Slot Payphone working. I am posting 2 pic's. It was quite an education and it was much appreciated. Great Forum. I have tryed to get help from many people over a two year span and no one wanted to take the time to help. Minutes after I posted my question, Help was there. I can't thank you enough. Special thanks to Poplar1. I picked up the 233 G for $75.00 two years ago and the booth just a year ago on a Williams pinball trade. Not the rich and the famous, but, just good old Vintage past that you can't put a price on. Got to love it.
Nice job! Looks great in the booth! I like how it is in original used condition, not looking brand new. How about a dial card??
Good job Poplar1 !
Terry
Quote from: HarrySmith on April 29, 2013, 09:43:49 PM
Nice job! Looks great in the booth! I like how it is in original used condition, not looking brand new. How about a dial card??
Not sure how to put one in? I have one.
Nice set-up. I don't have room inside for a superman type booth.
Your booth appears to be a cold weather climate booth.
I have a Stainless Steel "sea side" superman style booth.
I still need to decide where to put it at the new place. I am leaning towards the back yard, I was able to get a nice round lighted sign for it at the KS show a couple of weeks ago. I am thinking the sign could work well for a "party " light in the yard.
Jim
My booth was installed on the Texas coast. A collector friend in OK bought it and hauled it to Tulsa. A few years later he hauled it to Salina KS for me to buy and I hauled it home to CO.
I
I currently have a 684BA subset that I want to connect to a 233G. I understood that this was possible; however, I do not see how to translate the instructions for the 425 network to the 684BA connections. The 101 network that is inside does not have the RR or B terminal as described for the 425 network. The terminal connections in the 684BA are GN, R, L2Y and C on the transformer and E, GND, K and BK on the terminal block.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
dmz
dmz:
You received some advice on the TCI listserve on this topic that I might give you further information on. The person who replied said that using 684 subset on a 233G was like putting the wrong engine in a car. I believe that person was trying to be technically correct.
You then asked if there was no way to connect your payphone to a 684. The short answer is yes, and let me tell you more. The 233G payphone has a G1 handset which contains more sensitive elements than the F1 handset. Basically, the 684 was designed for the less sensitive handset and does not have some of the automatic volume control (equalization) that the 685 has. By connecting your 233G to a 684 subset, you will experience a little louder than normal volume in the receiver. That's about it. It certainly won't hurt anything to connect it to a 684. All you really need is a magic decoder ring to translate all the connections and that is not only possible, but I have the diagram somewhere.
This is really exactly the same discussion about connecting a G1 handset to a 5302, rather than an F1 handset.
Anyway, I will try to find my notes on it, but if I can't I am sure Dave (Poplar1) has that information up his sleeve too.
You did not mention anything about collecting or returning coins. If the payphone has a functioning coin relay still in it, a simulator can be purchased that will simulate the action for collecting and returning coins, but those simulators are not necessary if you just want to use the payphone as an extension.
Update:
Here is the wiring:
1. Make sure there is a jumper wire between BBX and BB on the hookswitch
2. If your phone has a coin relay, disconnect the coin relay wire that goes to SL on the hookswitch
3. Move the handset transmitter wire from the terminal strip "T" to hookswitch "Y"
4. Connect one side of the line to L1 in the subset
5. Connect the other side of the line to L2 Y in the subset
Run inside wire that has at least 4 conductors between the pay phone and the subset as follows: (Color of wires is not Important)
1. Connect Hookswitch R in the 233G to terminal L2 Y in the subset
2. Connect hookswitch Y in the 233G to terminal BK in the subset
3. Connect terminal TR in the 233G to terminal R in the subset
4. Connect hookswitch W in the 233G to terminal GN in the subset
The handset in the 233G should be connected as follows:
1. Red transmitter wire to terminal Y on the hookswitch (See above)
2. Black transmitter wire to terminal "TR" on the terminal strip at the top of the housing
3. One of the white receiver wires also to terminal "TR" on the terminal strip
4. The other white receiver wire to Hookswitch terminal GN
Make sure that the wiring you just did does not interfere with the operation of the hookswitch when you put the upper housing back on.
The ringer in the subset should already be wired for bridged ringing, but in case not wire the ringer as follows:
Red ringer wire to L1
Black ringer wire to K
Slate capacitor wire to K
Yellow capacitor wire to L2 Y
Try that and it should work.
Bill,
Wired up as indicated. Was able to get dialtone on the handset, ring in and answer with audio path. However, I was not able to dial. When the dial was operated the result was just continued dialtone. Not sure but I suspect that something is not wired correctly with respect to the dial.
David
If your phone still has the coin relay, and connected that could be your problem. Did you disconnect the slate wire of the coin relay from the SL terminal on the hookswitch? See item #2 of the instructions.
In old actual operation, the coin relay intentionally kept the dial from working until coins were deposited in the coin hopper. Depositing coins would open the switch and allow dialing. Unless you buy a simulator for operating the collect/return function of the coin relay, you need to disconnect that feature.
Check that out and let me know if you are still having problems.
Butch, try this:
Quote from: Phonesrfun on March 07, 2012, 12:23:43 AM
OK, assuming you are using a 500 set as a network, make sure all the hookswitch contacts for the old 500 have been disconnected from the 425 network inside the 500 base.
The network inside the 500 base will be labeled 425 and then a dash letter, I.E. 425-B, E or some other suffix. I will refer to that network as a 425.
Line cord wires:
Connect the red line cord wire to L2 of the 425 network, and the green line cord wire to L1 (Same connections as a model 500 phone.
Ringer wires:
Connect the red ringer wire to L2 on the 425; connect the black ringer wire to L1 on the 425; connect the slate ringer wire to K on the 425, and connect the slate/red ringer wire to A on the 425. This is the same wiring that the original 500 has too.
Place a short jumper wire between L1 on the 425 and C on the 425.
Payphone handset (Assumes this is a G handset with 4 wires...Black, Red, White, White)
Red handset wire and one White handset wire to TR on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing. (Either white wire will do)
Black handset wire to T on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Other white handset wire will go to terminal GN on the payphone hookswitch.
Connections between the subset (500 model phone with 425 network) (5 wires)
Wire 1 between L2 on the 425 network and terminal Y on the payphone hookswitch
Wire 2 between RR on the 425 network and terminal R on the payphone hookswitch
Wire 3 between R on the 425 network and TR on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Wire 4 between B on the 425 network and T on the black terminal strip at the top of the lower housing
Wire 5 between GN on the 425 network and terminal W on the payphone hookswitch.
Make sure there is a jumper between terminals BBX and BB on the payphone hookswitch
That should do it. All this assumes, of course, that nobody has messed around with the dial wiring, or the configuration of the transfer contact points between the upper and lower housing. If that is the case, then there will be more work involved.
Also, when replacing the upper housing, always do so with the phone off hook, otherwise the flimsy little brass tab that controls the bent coin release can get bent and break off.
Good luck.
Quote from: Phonesrfun on March 07, 2012, 12:14:11 PMI had one other thought about the model 500 phone you are planning on using for a subset. If it is an older type that has some of the hookswitch wires soldered to the 425 network terminals, then I should give you some additional instructions on how to deal with that situation. Let me know.
I did not see a follow-up comment from Bill (Phonesrfun) about the older 425 networks with soldered wires attached to some terminals. I did use one of these older networks (a 425B dated 1-57) with my own 233G, and all I did was to unsolder each of the hookswitch wires (five total) and then the network worked fine with my phone following the Bell wiring diagrams. On these older networks, terminal C does not have a screw connection, so I did have to solder a new wire to it that goes to the external L2 terminal as shown in the diagrams.
Please, don't remove any of the relays! Enjoy your find!
Mike