My first Payphone

[wds]

Recently purchased this payphone, my first, and I'm trying to figure out what I have here.  I know I'm missing the upper housing lock and key, and the coin box and cover plate.  I tried locating one on Ebay, but there seems to be many different types and I don't want to buy the wrong parts.  Any suggestions? 

I drop coins in the slots, and they all drop to the coin return tray.  The dime makes a nice chime, the quarter makes kind of a deeper gong noise, the nickel doesn't seem to make a noise and only goes part way down - I have to press the coin release button to get it to drop to the coin tray.  Should all three coins be making that chime noise?  The upper housing is dated 1973, the rest of the phone is 1963.

I would like to restore it back to original as possible and try to understand this one before I buy any more.

[WesternElectricBen]

Nice one,

I cannot answer your key question, but I'm pretty sure you need to drop down two nickles before it will make noise, as it was set up for a 10 cents phone call.

Also, if it was converted or left the way it was when it was removed (or whatever) the coins will either go to the box or the return.

Ben

[Dennis Markham]

Dave, it looks like a nice phone.  I'm no expert on the pay stations but have recently learned a few things about various models.  With regard to the nickel, I believe they were designed to hold the first nickel until the second was deposited, then they both fall.  Also if the phone is on hook when the first nickel is dropped it would drop into the coin return.  See if depositing two nickels will cause them to both drop.  The quarter is striking a coiled piece of metal, giving it the gong sound.  The dime should strike the bell twice on the path to the coin box, giving it the "ding-ding" sound.  The operator could tell by sound how much money was being deposited.  I think there has been some discussion about that somewhere in this section.

(Looks like Ben answered the nickel question while I was typing)

~Dennis

[mentalstampede]

That phone appears to be a Western Electric 233G. 

As far as the coin-gong for the nickel slot goes, Dennis is correct and your phone is behaving normally.  These phones have a mechanical gate in the coin track that holds the first nickel until a second one is deposited; the second nickel releases both coins allowing them to fall into the coin hopper.  This is in order to enforce a 10cent local call.

After the phone connects and has dial tone, an electromagnet in the coin track energizes and holds the nickel gate open to allow nickels deposited individually to strike the gong if the operator requests a deposit.

This model of phone is what is refered to as a "pre-pay" phone, meaning that the user was required to deposit money before dialing. The way this worked is as follows:  User lifts handset and deposits ten cents.  Once the second nickel is deposited, the coins fall into the hopper and engage the coin trigger, which completes the circuit and connects the phone. User may deposit a single dime or a single quarter instead of nickels; in which case the coins fall directly into the coin hopper and engage the coin trigger. At this point, the user should have received dialtone, and is able to place his or her call. The coins are retained in the hopper by the coin relay until the call is completed or the attempt abandoned. 

Once the call is connects and the handset is replaced on the hookswitch, the relay releases the coins and they fall into the coin box.  If the call did not connect (busy or no answer), the coins are returned instead of dropping into the coin box.

One other point: This model of phone contains no internal network, so if you plan on using it to make calls, you need to either acquire a subset to use with it or mount a network somewhere inside the body of the phone.

[poplar1]

The upper housing originally had a 10-G or 10-H lock. However, an Automatic Electric 29-S or Northern Electric 21-B will also work. Some prefer the AE because the keys don't have such a deep cut. (The deep cut sometimes causes the keys to break off.)

The vault door had either a 14-type or 30-type lock. These are individually keyed. While a Northern vault door lock will work, the AE 10-L will not fit.

The 233G always had a G-type handset--never an F-type. This is an "improvement" made by sellers hoping to make the phone look older, or for some other unfathomable reason.

The wires connecting the upper housing to the lower housing are not needed since there are transfer contacts that connect once the phone is reassembled. Also, a 685A subset was always installed with a 233G; it contains a 425- network and a C4A ringer.

[wds]

You're right about the nickel!  I dropped two this time and got that nice chime, then both dropped into the return slot.  I wondered about the extra wires.  I couldn't see any point to the wires, unless they were there to make the handset work - which is does.  First order of business is to correct the wiring.  Thanks for the part numbers on the lock and and vault.  Unfortunately, most of the vaults for sale on Ebay don't have part numbers, so I will have to familiarize myself so I can identify them by the picture.  Is there a vendor that sells the correct parts for a reasonable price so I don't have to go through ebay?

[mentalstampede]

Old phone works shows vault doors and vault locks in stock:
http://www.oldphoneworks.com/product.php?productid=19457&cat=343&page=1

They appear to be out of stock on appropriate upper housing locks though.

You can try Phoneco as well.

http://phonecoinc.com/category.asp?map=1&hhrl=home&group=main&gorl=group&category=Paypart

[mentalstampede]

Here's a schematic diagram for a 234, which should be electrically identical to your phone.  This is the diagram I found most helpful when restoring my own payphone.

[poplar1]

WE door takes a 14-type lock (14C etc). But a later 30-type (30C etc) will fit.
NE door takes a ?? or a later 22-QC. The 30-type and 22-type were used on single slot phones but are backward compatible.

Since NE and WE are very similar, you can interchange any of the above.

AE door takes a 10-L lock.

If you are patient, you should be able to find a door and lock for $40-$50 and a 29-S or 21B lock and key for $30-$40. For some reason, 10-G and 10-H locks are difficult to find.

[Dennis Markham]

Dave, I have purchased pay phone parts for this type of phone from Mike Davis.  His eBay handle is mvtel.  He is friendly and willing to help if you exchange e-mails.

Here is his eBay link:

http://www.ebay.com/usr/mvtel

He always has pay phone stuff for sale.  If you don't see what you need, shoot him off an e-mail. 
mvtel@verizon.net

~Dennis

[wds]

Thanks for contact.  I've looked at a couple vendors sites for parts, and they want more for the parts than I paid for the phone.  I can see this is going to be a (fun) challenge.  I'm going to watch for a 635 subset, but if I can't find one for a reasonable price, I'll buy a 500 for about $5 and improvise. 

[mentalstampede]

A 685A is what you need, not a 635.

Me, I improvised on mine: http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=11331.msg121915#msg121915

The 425 network out of a 500 is a breeze to fit in the housing.  The ringer is a bit large.  If I was gonna do it again, I'd use a B1A ringer from a 302.

[WesternElectricBen]

In my similar payphone, I'm running a 687A subset. The number doesn't really seem to matter, unless it could be there is a freq. ringer or missing 500 series parts.

Ben

[wds]

I meant 685 - typo error.

[WesternElectricBen]

WDS, I'm guessing you understand how to wire this, because of your extensive phone knowledge. I did find a 531, although I'm not sure if it will work, as there are no inside pics. Link: http://tinyurl.com/ohlotn8

But, for people newly interested in payphones, it's really a model 500 (phone part) with a coin assembly. That's why a network is necessary, b/c they use to use coin lines which were controlled by operators. (please correct me if I'm wrong about anything.)

Ben