Found Two 1500s and One 2500 WE's in an Antique Store

[TelePlay]

G1 handle (2-61), receiver (3-60), and dial (2-67, R12-67, R1-68) have all been replaced at some point. And yet, there is only the one 10-65 date on the base plate.

Long mounting cord was typically installed at the customer's location. Can you check the dates on the  cord restraints? Sometimes they are a good indicator of last time phone was rebuilt.

Handset cord restraint is 67.

Line cord restraints are not stamped. However, it's not really a line cord. Isn't this really a long handset cord? I didn't catch it at first when in a rush to take pictures and get dates but the "line cord" looks like a reversed  handset cord with a special restraint attached to what was once the handset end and the base end had a handset restraint. They put a heavy rubber tubing around the long wires after the restraint and laid it along the network.

Or am I wrong on that. Did they make line cords that way?

Based on the dates, it seems they took a '65 base (network, bottom stamp and ringer) and built that into a 1500D in 1967 using a '61 G1 handset. Any other scenarios come to mind? Was this a product of a refurb shop (rebuilt) or is this what they did to make these in the production shops? Or something else?

[HarrySmith]

The ire colors in the line cord indicate it is just that. I have seen a few with that extra little tube on them. Makes a very neat installation.

[WEBellSystemChristian]

Those cords are indeed line cords. The 'tubes' on the ends of them don't even fit into the restraint arch in the transmitter cups in G3s. I had a really, really long one like that in red that had deep cuts all over it, so I cut it up, and they make really good 3 conductor handset/receiver cords.

[poplar1]

You may have to loosen the ringer mount screw to inspect the cord restraint on that end of the mounting cord for a date and cord code. The first letter of WE/NE cord codes indicates the principal use:

                          D -- Desk Stand Cord. Also includes hand set and
                                 telephone set mounting cords and switch cords
                          used between the switchhook contact spring assembly
                          and the base of desk stands.
                          H -- Hand Set Cord.
                          L -- Operator's Telephone Set Cord.
                          M -- Miscellaneous Cord.
                          R -- Receiver Cord.
                          T -- Transmitter Cord.
                          W -- Test Cord

                          Source: BSP Section C36.101 Issue 9, 4-15-41

Illinois Bell may have had their own shops where they refurbished some phones, rather than paying Western Electric's high prices. More info is needed on their procedures. The refurb dates on other phones with the Illinois Bell Property stamp do appear different from phones from other areas.

The 67 date on the handset cord is a close match to  the 1-68 date on the dial. One possibility is that the dial was refurbished by WE, and the phone was then refurbished by Illinois Bell, using a new handset cord ordered from WE,  and other used parts on hand.

[TelePlay]

The line cord restraint had a loop lug so just removed it from the ringer mounting bolt. The code on the bottom of the restraint is D4BP (4 conductor black? =  . . .4B . . . ). It looks strange to me with the rubber grommet usually seen on handsets and the long wires usually seen in the base running to the network. There is a slot in the metal base for a "standard" restraint, but not needed with this set up.

Took the dial off and more "R" numbers found.

Took a picture of the housing date stamp. It seems the housing was made in January 1965, right? So the metal base, the ringer, the network and the housing are '65. Would that mean they put an older headset on at production in '65 to use up stock?

How much trouble did they have with the early 10 button TT dials. This one is about 2 years newer and required a lot of "fixes" or were they just upgrading the older equipment to meet newer standards that came into being as the technology advanced?

So, is it safe to say I have a '65 1500 with a replaced dial and interesting line cord?

[jsowers]

The reason the line cord wires are long on the inside is it's a 4-conductor cord, which could be used for a 2-line phone with a terminal strip under the dial, or a 500U or something else. It requires extra length conductors to reach that strip. It's not that unusual. Those heavy-duty cords were fitted to a lot of 500s and 2500s from the late 1960s on. They were probably less prone to kink up. But for display purposes they're not much of an advantage since they coil up to a really large circle of wire. They held up well, took a lot of abuse and you don't see many with splits in the cord.

[poplar1]

The second character of the cord code is indeed the number of conductors. The final letters (or single letter) are arbitrary,  assigned to distinguish different type cords. Color would be indicated by a suffix, such as -3 for black, -53 for red, etc., though that wouldn't be indicated on the restraint, just on the packaging. (D4BP-3 or maybe -03)

It seems unlikely that they would have "new" 1960 T-1 transmitter units or 1961 G-1 handles still in stock in the Western Electric factory in 1965. But when a phone was rebuilt at the service center, or even repaired in the field, then dates could be all over the map. That's why you see plastic 302s reissued with E1E handsets sometimes, or 4H dials. Some have suggested that G1s were still being supplied in 1965 on new black 500s and maybe even on new black 1500s, but not  black Princess sets. Still, I believe that your G1 handle is dated 1961; if so, that particluar G1 handle would not have been originally your set. Still, it apparently has been there for 37 years.

As for the dials, even rotary dials returning to the field had to be lubricated in the WE shops at certain intervals. Bill (retired WE) said that if a worker failed to stamp the L and date on a dial after lubricating, then he would get written up, because it meant that if the dial was again reissued, it could be lubricated again unnecessarily. So perhaps they were equally diligent about putting Touch-Tone dials through numerous tests, then stamping the date of service. Anecdotally, I can add that when we first got Touch-Tone in 1972, and swapped the white 500D for a remanufactured  green 1500D 2500D leased set, they had to replace the set twice within the first few months.