Please educate me on this "Trimline"

[countryman]

Siemens imported these WE Trimline phones to Germany in 1980-1984. They were rented out by the Bundespost as "Manhattan" phones, while the official name was DFeAp 370. Siemens sold them as "Miniset 100" on the private market. The sales price was around 160 Deutsche Mark, which would be ~80 € or 94$ US today but back then serious money for sure. The rental fee also was more than double of a standard phone.
There are not too many around here, possibly for that reason. Compact phones caught on not before 1985 after the soap opera "Dallas" appeared on German TV screens. Has the show been mentioned in the "Old phones in movies and TV" thread yet? Siemens brought a touchtone set with just this name, Dallas, in 1985 and no longer imported trimlines.

What would be the original model name of this "Manhattan" phone on the US market?
Funny how Siemens avoided the modular plug that it originally was designed for, and cobbled in it's own cords, using specially made filling pieces. The recall key was wired as a ground button apparently, by turning it around it acts as a flash key (breaking the line as long as pressed). Was this feature original to the phone or a Siemens modification?

I found the phone for under 20 € in an auction, it seems unused, just was dusty.

[LarryInMichigan]

Those are rather common here in the USA and generally sell for cheap.  They always came with color matching cords with large connectors on the ends.  Your German version seems to have some differences, so I would guess that it was made for export and not for the US market.

Larry

[Key2871]

I've seen dozens of trimline taken apart, but never have I seen any with frames such as the first few.
Those are definitely different than those I've seen here in the US. Made by WE, ITT, or SC.

[poplar1]

It does have a Western Electric 575E ringer capacitor. I can't read the date code stamped in the receiver.

Can you show the bottom of the phone?

[HarrySmith]

Agreed, I thought the same thing, very different construction although the flexible circuit looks the same. The date on the cap looks like 8-8?, the wire is covering the last digit but since the other date stamp is 9-80 I am gonna guess August 1980 for the cap.

[Key2871]

Yes the flexible circuit board looks familiar. As do some components.
But seeing the dial set into a frame that then gets installed in the handset, and of course the spring cord connection.

And the 575E cap in the base looks to have a date of 2-86 or something close to that but all the other parts seem to be the usual

I understand that Western may want to change some things in sets that aren't maintained in the US.
So I'm thinking this explains those changes.
It's very interesting to see a WE set in a different country, with a vastly different interior than those available in this country.

[poplar1]

"X854D NET", "WE", and "9-80" are stamped on the network.

Does the dial have a LED?

EDIT: Also, the "clock" typically used by WE shows 1980 date in the base housing.

[MMikeJBenN27]

The original name was indeed "Trimline".  What looks different on your version is the cords.  Most of our's had a dial face with both letters and numbers, but some were numbers only like this one.  Other than that, it looks the same to me.  There are still companies making this type of phone in Asia, but it is cheaply made, with a plastic base plate.  Seems like those companies love plastic and cheapness.

Mike

[countryman]

The capacitor has 8-81 on it, and that's the youngest date I could find.  The German literature says the cords and the transmitter were mounted in the Siemens factory in Bocholt. I'd guess the filling pieces to cover where the modular sockets should sit also were, but not sure. There also "should be" a Siemens code on it, but I can't see that.
Seemingly the phone was customized for Siemens and by Siemens but basically is a US model.
Yes the dial is lit by a green LED.
Do I get that right that this type of Trimline originally has a larger version of modular plugs, not the standard RJ-11?

[poplar1]

Do I get that right that this type of Trimline originally has a larger version of modular plugs, not the standard RJ-11?

The bases for desk Trimlines were coded AD1, AD2, and AD3:

AD1 had large (wide) modular ended cords for the handset cord (both ends) and mounting cord (set end only -- the connection to wall block was with spade tips on end of cord).

AD2 kept the same large modular plugs for the handset cord. The mounting cord (line cord) had mini-modular plugs on both ends -- the same type ends used now.

AD3 had standard mini-modular cords on both base and handset ends.

Hope this is correct. Someone correct me if it is not.

"10IN80" = Indianapolis factory, October 1980. Residential phones were usually developed in Indianapolis, then produced in either Indianapolis or Shreveport.

[Key2871]

Some AD2 were partial modular with the adapters that went into the fat socket to accept the H4DU handset cords and D4BU line cords using the jack that slid into the the slot that remain when the fat base cord part was removed.

It's possible that the sets I saw labeled AD2 were not corrected with the sticker that went over markings on the bases to indicate they were actually AD3.
There was a time early on there were sets that had stickers that covered the AD2 designation some did not.
The box they were shipped in were marked AD3.

But as I said that's pretty cool even though it's supposed to be Seimens it's no doubt a Western Electric with exception of transmitter and handset base cord jacks.
Does it have the P1A ringer in it? Or was that also replaced with a local Siemens ringer.

[Jim Stettler]

The bases for desk Trimlines were coded AD1, AD2, and AD3:

AD1 had large (wide) modular ended cords for the handset cord (both ends) and mounting cord (set end only -- the connection to wall block was with spade tips on end of cord).

AD2 kept the same large modular plugs for the handset cord. The mounting cord (line cord) had mini-modular plugs on both ends -- the same type ends used now.

AD3 had standard mini-modular cords on both base and handset ends.

Hope this is correct. Someone correct me if it is not.

"10IN80" = Indianapolis factory, October 1980. Residential phones were usually developed in Indianapolis, then produced in either Indianapolis or Shreveport.

I will add some observations.
Early fat mod sets were incandescent . these were counterparts to the round button sets.
These had a color matching flash button on the handset. The dial center also had bell or WE info.

The most common min-mod adaptor is clear and flush mounted. Early adaptors were color matched and stuck out of the handset.
Later rebuilds of the fat mod sets had LED dials and the mod adaptor was part of the board. This is early 1980's.

The made IC based trimlines in round button. They made these in the late 60's along with tuned touchpads. They made these in 10 and 12 button models.   I have a clear 12 button IC based handset from 1968. 2220B-1
It is either early or proto/engineering set . Some other IC based trimlines are shown in the same message.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=2534.msg204916#msg204916

I have found a variety of different IC based rebuilt sets from around 1975 onward. There were lots of variations of Faraday cages to protect the IC. I think that is why they used the metal faceplate . There is also a variety of the flex boards on the IC sets.
The earliest IC's were clear later IC's were   grey or black, ISTR that gray was earlier than black.. I think the color of the IC indicates a different IC.
Inside the handset they insulated the solder points with a brush on material and the used a variety of plastic covers to create a Faraday cage.

The square  button sets seem to use the same tech throughout with the exception of the boards getting simpler as time went on.
The dial counterpart sets  were the same.

The later min-mod sets had a translucent white flash button like this set.

I have never found any reference to the fat mod sets ever being MD. I think they were still produced at the breakup.

I have been told that many of the metal plate round button sets still have the color mask underneath.


I have a large stash of round button sets that I need to open.

Just a few un-organized ramblings regarding WE trimlines.
Jim

I also have a non-US wall/desk rotary housed 11 button trimline type set (in poor condition). It makes me think of the Spainish Gondola
type trimline.
The trimlines are packed away at the moment.

[Jim Stettler]

The bases for desk Trimlines were coded AD1, AD2, and AD3:

AD1 had large (wide) modular ended cords for the handset cord (both ends) and mounting cord (set end only -- the connection to wall block was with spade tips on end of cord).

AD2 kept the same large modular plugs for the handset cord. The mounting cord (line cord) had mini-modular plugs on both ends -- the same type ends used now.

AD3 had standard mini-modular cords on both base and handset ends.

There were other trimline bases as well.
The noteworthy and elevator phone come to mind.
Paul F,shows some others on his site.
http://paul-f.com/weTrimline.html

I consider the trimline the first disposa-phone.
If the handset didn't work, the installer swapped it and sent it to WE for testing and rebuild.
It is worth noting that the trimline came as a handset and a separate base.
The handset could be rotary or TT, Bases include desk, wall and the noteworthy among others.
A brand new install could easily have mismatched dates, unless it was a non-promoted color.
None promo colors were special order and were more likely to have matching dates
IMHO the coolest trimlines are early round button sets with paper touchpad masks.

JMO,
Jim

[paul-f]

I'd like to hear more about the reversing recall key shown in the fourth photo.

I don't believe that was included in the US models (wiring option not shown in the BSPs I consulted).

[Jim Stettler]

I'd like to hear more about the reversing recall key shown in the fourth photo.

I don't believe that was included in the US models (wiring option not shown in the BSPs I consulted).

Would a  reversing recall be a callback option ?
I assumed  that button was for hook-switch flash.
Jim