Confused ... straight line vs bias ringer

[xtal_01]

I have recently purchased a Kellogg 1000 phone.

I had it explained to me on another forum that I need either a straight line or bias ringer, preferably with high impedance to work on todays phone system.

I don't know the impedance but I was told it is a straight line ringer.

I understand (had it explained to me the difference in harmonic and other ringers) are but then I get confused.

I "think" what I am being told is that a bias ringer has a spring pushing it to one side and that a straight line one doesn't .... so does the clapper just sit between the bells?

And so what does this mean?  Will I hear rings when it shouldn't if I have a straight line ringer?

Or do I want a straight line ringer?

Just still a bit confused about all this.  I want this old phone to work correctly on todays phone system.  I bet my phone  over the internet so I have a Dial Gizmo coming to take care of the pulse dialing issue.

What is the difference ... what does it mean ... and what do I want?

Thanks so much .... Mike

[rdelius]

ST line ringers at least in USA and some other countries have a bias spring. This prevents ring tap with other extension telephones are dialed or taken on of  off hook.Freq ringers are stiff and respond to one ringing frequency

[TelePlay]

Can you post a picture of the ring you have in the Kellogg like this for starters. The ringer on the left is a frequency and the one on the right is a Straight Line ringer (had a pivot point at the bottom and not a metal reed like the ringer on the left).

The ringer on the right does not have and never had a bias sprint to keep it "quiet" and as such, when installed, did "tinkle a bit - it's a very old ringer.



With a picture, someone will be able to help you.

[TelePlay]

This is a different style ringer with a bias spring (there any many different versions of bias springs but it shows the point).

[xtal_01]

In the Kellogg 1000 ( I will not get mine till next week to see what it looks like), why do they list a SA (straight line) and BA (bias) ringer?

I see the difference in your pictures and it makes sense but in the Kellogg 1000, does this mean the SA will "tingle" once in a while?

Should I replace it with a BA?

Thanks .... Mike

[HarrySmith]

As Robby stated earlier all straight line ringers have a bias spring. Frequency ringers do not. A frequency ringer only rings on a certain frequency and most will not work on todays phone lines. I would recommend wait until you get the phone, take a picture of the ringer and post it here. We will be able to identify it and advise you at that point on what you have or what you need.

[xtal_01]

Great, that is what I will do.

I know I must sound dumb as dirt to you guys you understand phones but maybe I am asking the wrong question.

I completely understand about harmonic (or frequency) ringers .... makes sense.

My question maybe should be:  If a straight line ringer has a bias spring and a bias ringer has a bias spring then what is the difference?  Say for Kellogg a part number 120-BA and a 123-SA?  Both are none frequency rings.  Both are high impedance.  If the SA has a bias spring and the the BA has a bias spring then what is the difference?

Sorry .... just dumb as dirt it seems when it come to this subject.

Thanks again ..... Mike

[TelePlay]

From the TCI Library, one document for the Kellogg 1000 Masterphone states two types of straight line ringers, biased (with a spring) and the SA-SB-SC ringers.

The attached pdf pages, two of them for that document, discusses bias spring adjustment and the fact that there is not such adjustment on the three, SA, SB and SC straight line ringers. This may or may not match what you will see when you get the phone. Seems the SA, SB and SC tinkled and nothing could be done about it.


     

[HarrySmith]

I learned something today also. I was not aware that any sraight line ringers were made without bias springs. I wonder why they did that? Must of gotten complaints about bell tinkle with them. Maybe they were meant for households with only one phone?

[TelePlay]

From another Kellogg Catalog, here is what they say about Bx biased versus Sx straight line ringers.

The "x"in the ?x designates resistance of the ringer.

[TelePlay]

I learned something today also. I was not aware that any sraight line ringers were made without bias springs. I wonder why they did that? Must of gotten complaints about bell tinkle with them. Maybe they were meant for households with only one phone?

It seems Kellogg is calling a biased ringer that which we normally think of, or refer to as a straight line ringer (with a bias spring). That image I posted above says "Straight Line Ringers-for magneto, bridged or divided ringing where bell tapping is not objectionable, and where maxi­mum sensitivity to a broad range of ringing frequencies is desired."

Yes, complaints may have had a lot to do with newer ringers having springs.

[xtal_01]

Sooooooo ....

It the bias rings make sense now!  They have a bias spring and are adjustable to prevent "tinkling".

One last question .... do the Kellogg SA (straight line) ringers have any bias (just not adjustable like the BA units) or do they have no bias?

You guys are awesome!

I hate to be a pain .... just could not figure out why there were BA and SA ringers   .... knew there had to be a good reason!

Thanks again ..... Mike

[TelePlay]

I would guess no, there won't be anything holding the clapper arm to one side, to keep it from moving under various conditions and tinkling.

A picture of your ringer will tell all. All posted so far is informational and guesstimating.

Depending on how strong the ringer is in your phone, if it needs a bias to keep from tinkling, and you don't mind making a home brew adjustment, a weak spring could be installed to prevent the tinkle - a non standard fix but it would stop the tinkle once the tension was "just right."

This straight line ringer tinkles when the receiver is placed on hook. A nostalgic sound to some.

[xtal_01]

I was hoping some had both a BA and an SA ringer in there possesion and could take a look or maybe post  pictures of each so we could see for sure if SA's had bias (just not adjustable) or not. 

Or someone who works on Kellogg 1000's who know the difference could post the answer.

Thanks so very much again .... Mike

[HarrySmith]

John, I was thinking the same thing, adding a spring would be a simple matter if needed.