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Was there a maroon WE 500?

Started by Greg G., April 13, 2012, 12:31:39 AM

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Dan/Panther

#15
Adam;
I purchased the S/C first and didn't like the way it was built, so I purchased the ITT after seeing photos in the auction of the inside. Both phones in the thread were dated 1973, so I was comparing that particular model. My only point was if you wanted a close copy of the WE 500 in Orange, Lime, or Brown. I felt the ITT was the better of the two from the examples I had acquired. If S/C cheapened their design  sooner then ITT did, then date for date, I would still say the ITT would most likely retain the WE 500 configuration longer into it's genealogy. Later on into the 80's I'm sure the playing field leveled. But I would guess early on into the cloning of the 500, My guess is ITT made a better phone DATE for Date.
That was my thinking, but if you as a better informed source feel differently I would have to say listen to Adam he is the better informed.
I preferred the ITT because it better lent itself to straight exchange of ITT components to WE internal components, as I wanted The color of the ITT or S/C but the quality of the WE. I just couldn't do that Date for Date with the S/C.
I also agree that the original WE 500 are the only ones I put true value in. But the Orange and Lime green really look cool on the shelf. They also get the most remarks, Sorry WE you blew that one.

D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

Adam

Quote from: Dan/Panther on April 14, 2012, 01:21:51 PM
I purchased the S/C first and didn't like the way it was built

Having worked with the ITT sets for so many years, I guess the printed-circuit press-on contacts type network doesn't phase me any more.  I consider it no less "quality" than the original boxed, potted network, just more "modern".  Even WE eventually changed the style of their network, and left the potting behind, although they did retain screw terminals, thank heaven. But I can see why someone who is looking for something a little more like the traditional WE style would feel differently about the printed-circuit network.

Quote
My only point was if you wanted a close copy of the WE 500 in Orange, Lime, or Brown. I felt the ITT was the better of the two from the examples I had acquired.

Yes, it certainly is.  I was just trying to offer my experience that perhaps if you're looking for a Western Electric clone phone, S/C sets are not necessarily bad (and neither are ITT).  If you're looking for the traditional style innards, it might be hit and miss with sets of either manufacture from the 70's.

It's great that we can all share our experiences and then base our buying of new old sets on what we've learned here!
Adam Forrest
Los Angeles Telephone - A proud part of the global C*Net System
C*Net 1-383-4820

Dan/Panther

It's always better to hear from  the techs that worked on them in the field.
D/P

The More People I meet, The More I Love, and MISS My Dog.  Dan Robinson

TelePlay

Back to the color question.

Paul-f's web site does not show a color code for Maroon.

http://www.paul-f.com/wecolors.htm

Anyone have a WE color code for Maroon?

Also, the same code, -54, is designated as both Brown and Mahogany Brown. Are those just two names for the same color (-54) or is there a difference and if so, how does one know if they have a Brown or a Mahogany Brown WE 500?

jsowers

Quote from: TelePlay on April 14, 2012, 09:08:06 PM
Back to the color question.

Paul-f's web site does not show a color code for Maroon.

http://www.paul-f.com/wecolors.htm

Anyone have a WE color code for Maroon?

Also, the same code, -54, is designated as both Brown and Mahogany Brown. Are those just two names for the same color (-54) or is there a difference and if so, how does one know if they have a Brown or a Mahogany Brown WE 500?

Brown 500s were made from 1954-57 and into about 1960 in keysets. They also made a few 554s, but only a few. It was called several different names by the different Bell companies in their advertising, but brown was the most common name for it. It was never very popular and looked black in dim light because it was so dark. Calling it Mahogany Brown differentiates it from the brown that came much later, offered by SC and ITT in the 70s and 80s and in WE Trimlines and Design Line phones.

There are several ways to tell if you have brown soft plastic. It had matching thick brown cords (the handset cord could be either straight or coiled), and an open center fingerwheel on the outside. On the inside you will find a date stamped housing and the color code of -54 on the back of the dial.

As far as maroon goes, I don't think 500 sets ever came in maroon, and definitely not in the 1950s, which is when the phone Briny posted was made. I wish him the greatest luck getting the phone. If he gets it, then we'll know, as Paul Harvey used to say, the rest of the story.
Jonathan

paul-f

Quote from: TelePlay on April 14, 2012, 09:08:06 PM

the same code, -54, is designated as both Brown and Mahogany Brown. Are those just two names for the same color (-54) ...


Yes.  The color code was used for manufacturing, inventory control and ordering purposes.  AFAIK each code referred to one specific color.  BSPs and marketing literature used a variety of names for the same colors.

Just because there is no maroon color code in the chart doesn't mean it doesn't exist.  We may just not have found it yet.  In the case of maroon, we've seen no reference for any WE product yet.

There are WE 500 sets that have been made as tests or for special order that have not been included in the charts.

For example, orange sets were reported supplied to Howard Johnsons.  I am currently researching a -113 (textured brown) 500 set.

For cases like the topic subject set, it's helpful to ask the seller to report any code on the bottom plate and back of the dial -- two places where color codes were occasionally stamped.
   http://www.paul-f.com/we500typ.htm#CaseMarking
Visit: paul-f.com         WE  500  Design_Line

.

TelePlay

Thanks for the info. That helps a lot.

And, I really like you site. You've done a great job pulling all of that stuff together, and making it grow.

Greg G.

Quote from: paul-f on April 14, 2012, 11:03:32 PM
For cases like the topic subject set, it's helpful to ask the seller to report any code on the bottom plate and back of the dial -- two places where color codes were occasionally stamped.
   http://www.paul-f.com/we500typ.htm#CaseMarking


I've asked them to send me a picture of the bottom, haven't heard back yet.
The idea that a four-year degree is the only path to worthwhile knowledge is insane.
- Mike Row
e

Greg G.

#23
Quote from: jsowers on April 14, 2012, 10:44:43 PM
Back to the color question.

Brown 500s were made from 1954-57 and into about 1960 in keysets.

So far, so good, made in 10-55.  They didn't get a shot of the underside of the dial and I didn't want to pester them too much.  It still looks kinda "maroon", but I can easily see brown also.

The idea that a four-year degree is the only path to worthwhile knowledge is insane.
- Mike Row
e

Adam

Truthfully, I can't see maroon in these pics at all.  On my iMac they're dark brown all the way.  I think anyone who sees maroon may need to adjust their monitor.
Adam Forrest
Los Angeles Telephone - A proud part of the global C*Net System
C*Net 1-383-4820

Dan

It is a brown WE 500. I have one close to this.
"Imagine how weird telephones would look if our ears weren't so close to our mouths." - Steven Wright