Wanted to know if anyone has any idea how old this phone is? You can see it is from Denmark. ITS about 12 LBS. Has been painted. Also Has old type a digit display on top and a push button next to digit display maybe to re set numbers. any input appreciated. I think is all Bakelite.
Danish, KTAS. Looks like a model D08.
Metal body.
1930s.
Thank you that is helpful. I might purchase this phone. could you please tell me what digits and button on top are for. If parts are needed are they easy to buy and are they expensive?
The counter on the top was a Copenhagen system of counting number of calls, each time you dialed the first digit in a number it counted. You got regular visits to read off the counter, equal to the electricity meter.
These were made between 1908 and 1930. I have the 1930 version and got the counter working :)
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=19900.msg204396#msg204396
I have tried to translate the diagram of your phone here: http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=18730.msg192926#msg192926
The button would be an earth key then? Not many other possibilities on a CB phone I guess?
These were apparently imported by the thousands some years back. A lot of them had dials added. I had a customer that had a bunch of these, some that were original and some that were not. They had some very nice models. He had me switch some parts around on a few of them. Stuff like real gold plating & silk cords were used.
SO FROM WHAT I AM READING ABOUT THIS PHONE IT WOULD TAKE A BIT OF MODIFICATION TO WORK TO WORK ON A LAME LINE
AM I CORRECT IN IN STATING THAT?
No button on these, only a blinded hole. The dial may have been changed or relabeled. It should work OK on a regular line, but not the counter.
If you're buying the phone in the picture, you might not have to do anything to it to make it work on a land line. The 2 prongs on the plug that are furthest apart are your L1 & L2. The odometer is non functional, it was used to count the calls made. If you are referring to that silver thing behind the dial as a button,it is not, it is one of the screws holding the cover on. The other one is behind the bell. The coil is under the bottom plate of the base, the 4 feet hold it on. The thick cord between the phone and the square plug has a lot of conductors in it, maybe 6 or 8.
Thanks for all the info you really help beginners with a wealth knowledge that you guys all have.
As already stated, it should work fine as is. I was really impressed with the quality and craftsmanship of these when I worked on them. The fancy gold & silk was very nice. Even the way the wires are wrapped to make a loop was impressive.
That's why the Danish phone companies stayed with them for so long. Not before the subscribers protested they issued new designs. At that time those old "conservative" phones were considered antique already in other parts of the world...
I PURCHASED THE DANISH PHONE WORKS GOOD AFTER CLEANING ALL CONTACTS ON DIAL AND SWITCH HOOK. WANTED TO SHARE SOME PHOTOS TO SEE IF IT WAS PRE WORLD WAR 2
Looks nice and original inside, which is great.
Here's my one, which still has its original paint finish. Mine appears to have been a manual set originally as the dial assembly is quite crudely (two screws and a rough hole) fixed to the top cover and not the base as yours is. There's no sign of where its 'call exchange' button would have been though and it also doesn't have a call counter.
Nice phone Tubaman. Just wondering if anyone would be able to give me some info on how to change dial card, also find a date on phone. would really like to figure out how old this could be. Any help appreciated
This model with dial from 1930s.
Trying to zoom in on the dated (?) component: 46 - 44 ??
Anything written on the rear of dial?
The ones I worked on had a snap ring holding the retainer on. Not sure about yours. Maybe a closeup of the center would help?
Quote from: HarrySmith on August 17, 2022, 02:07:36 PMThe ones I worked on had a snap ring holding the retainer on. Not sure about yours. Maybe a closeup of the center would help?
It should have a snap ring but they are often missing and just have a slightly oversized window that you prise out.
You can see it if you zoom into @dsk photo in post #7 - the join is between 9 and 0.
Thanks again to all you for all your input found where snap ring opening is. I will check for date on dial at a later time all your help has been much appreciated.
Quote from: long jumper on August 17, 2022, 11:16:31 AMNice phone Tubaman. Just wondering if anyone would be able to give me some info on how to change dial card, also find a date on phone. would really like to figure out how old this could be. Any help appreciated
Just got around to removing dial card. Would like to remove finger wheel but afraid to mess up spring tension. Any help appreciated,also where can I get dial cards for this phone
Going to try send a pic of finger wheel
You can safely remove the centre screw and take off the finger wheel without loosing the spring tension. Removing the finger stop (two small screws on back) makes it slightly easier but isn't usually necessary.
If you just want a simple 'KTAS' card then I've attached a scan I did for one of mine some years ago. It's not perfect but is ok for display purposes.
Thanks again Tubaman cleaned finger wheel and dial bezel,gave outside a good cleaning. My next project on this phone would be to try to get the counter working. I saw on previous post some wiring diagrams and components to make counter work but will need some help to figure out what to do on this phone any help appreciated
Does anyone know how to make the call counter work on this phone? If so any help appreciated.
This should work on your phone too.
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=19900.msg204396#msg204396
Opened up phone phone today before putting cover back. Accendently bumped hammer on ringer now can't get it to ring. Also noticed only one spring on Clapper,Tried to adjust screw for hammer but no luck vibrates like soft ring.Will post picture. Please help
Just opened-up my one to take a look for you. The clapper should sit against the red fibre piece, which also gives some adjustment. You can see the witness mark on your fibre piece where it was screwed down. If you've moved the screws on the ringer itself then I would put them back where they were if possible as they will not have moved by you removing the case. What's more likely is that you have bent the clapper arm slightly, and that should be easy to gently bend back.
Mine doesn't have a spring and I'm not sure it's supposed to have one. I wonder if it's been added during refurb as an anti-tinkle measure? Perhaps another member with one of these could check please.
I
First thanks to dsk for Sharing link for counter on phone to work. Haven't got any components yet. Maybe will check back when I start.Also thanks to Tubaman for Sharing photo of your phone it was helpful,someone had put a spring between Clapper and back of ringer to keep Clapper in place. I took back of ringer apart,put Clapper in place tightened pivot screws re installed works great. Some time later I will attempt to get the counter working
I am going to try to get some parts for my D08 antique phone.
I just want to know the voltage values for the resistor and the zener diode. So I can get the call counter to work. Any help would be appreciated
Skip the zener, if the capacitor is ratet at least 1.3 x the line voltage, and use this:
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=180712;image)
Sorry to be such a pain. I want to make sure before I order that it's correct. I have a 48 volt line. Going to use a 63 volt 1000uf capacitor ,a 150k ohm resistor 1watt, will this work. please let me know thanks
The specifications are OK. The wattage of resistor is far oversized but that won't hurt.
The idea of the circuit is to charge the capacitor from the line, to not draw to much current normally, or when ringing the pretty high ohm capacitor is there, at the same time the resistor enshure the circuit to not lower the speach volume. The rectifier diode is only to protect the capacitor from beeing charged with wrong polarity. The capacitor is big enough to "act as a battery or power source" for giving the counter one step pulse. All is sized by testing on my phone on both 24 and 48 V.
Thanks for all your help. I will let you all know after i get all the parts. Ok installed.
Finally installed 150k resistor and 63 volt capacitor according to diagram. Wired resistor between positive line to positive side of capacitor both resistor and capacitor on terminal J other side of capacitor terminated on - side of line. Could not break dial tone when dialing. Need some help please
Posting of a photo of the resistor in a capacitor in this circuit
I do only have the D30, but looking at the pictures and diagrams this seem not right. Sometimes the diagram we find is for a different version, but suggestion is to try like this:diagram.jpg
If you still cant go on hook, it may be the original capacitor that is shorted, try to disconnect one wire in the ringer circuit.
I have marked the 2 line wires with blue.
No luck with getting call counter to to work. Ringer still works,wiring diagram that you have shown is not what my phone has. The switchbook has 4 wires versus the 5 you have on your diagram. My phone is a 1933 model. Don't know if I can find a wiring diagrams for this phone. That would really help. Over all your pics have some other
Differences. Anyway thanks for your input
This may help:
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=18730
DO8 internal image below from this link:
https://www.bigdoer.com/3048/old-things/ktas-d08-phone-rebuilt/
The last photo that fab posted has the same amount of terminal screws 11 as my phone but from what i can see wiring is some what different. I was hoping that someone could come up with the wiring diagram for this phone. Phone works great just wanted to try to get call counter to work.if it's not to complex. I think with a wiring diagram with all your help it could be done.
Then we have to start from scratch. Are you able to get the phone working except from the counter?
When that's done we have to measure to where the counter is connected. Originally it was so hen you moved the dial out of rest position (without any hence of it was off hook or on hook) the counter did count 1 step as soon as the dial got out of rest position, but only for the first digit.
Yes phone works great.Traced out wires from counter.one wire goes to dial the other goes to terminal strip shown on photo no wire on other side I indicated with yellow line.which on other drawing was J.Red and green are incoming line. starting from top photo count down space 3,4,5,go to handset space 8 incoming line cord ties to green wire.inside 4prong jack space 9 incoming line green also on space 9 goes to handset space 10 empty other side goes to counter.space 11 incoming line red wire. I will try to post photos. I do think you were correct in you original drawing. I wonder if counter is defective?
Quote from: long jumper on September 23, 2022, 08:29:28 PMI wonder if counter is defective?
That's what I was thinking.
Have you isolated (disconnected) the counter from the circuit and used a low voltage DC source (6 volt battery?" to make it increment?
Just tried 6 volt DC no movement small shaft turns free but no movement. Going to try to open up counter or if you think 48 volts would be ok
Don't know European phones but the two voltages I've ever seen is 60-90 VAC to operate the ringer and 3-6 VDC for the talk circuit. Once the handset is lifted, AC does not travel through the dial. Maybe others know better.
From the diagrams provided, it seems the counter operates through the dial which would be talk voltage, 3-6 volts DC.
Interesting part is that the counter increments on the first number dialed and whatever is keeping the counter from increasing on the next numbers dialed is cleared for the phone's next use.
Dial pulses are the breaking and making of continuity on the low DC voltage circuit. The counter see the first number dialed. An interesting problem.
dsk, and maybe others, know the electrical circuitry best.
I am fairly new to all this but like i stated applied 6 volt DC no movement. The shaft turns freely. Can't think of anything but counter being defective.
In the wiring diagram posted by dsk,
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=26510.msg257989#msg257989
the counter circuit shows an RC circuit that has to be charged from line voltage. The capacitor is discharged through the counter when the dial is first turned and the talk circuit shunt leaves are closed.
That would indicate why the counter only works on the first number dialed. When it is discharged when dialing the first number, the "counter" capacitor will not be charged enough to operate the counter for 5 minutes.
As such, several short calls could be made without being counted as long as they are dialed in less than 5 minutes between each dialing, each of which discharges the capacitor so the 5 minute window starts over and the call is not counted.
All assumes the counter is working but we don't know how the mechanical mechanism inside the housing works.
Being in your hands, only you can try different circuits and tests.
Yes,Tried charging the capacitor for over 10 minutes but could not break dial tone when dialing.I still think counter is broke. Out of curiosity wonder how this was wired to work originally?
Quote from: long jumper on September 24, 2022, 06:25:27 PMOut of curiosity wonder how this was wired to work originally?
Yes, that would be a good thing.
Now, being and "old" counter, is it possible to remove the counter and see if it can be taken apart exposing the workings?
Removed from base plate then removed base of counter there was a coil inside but was not able to dis mantel. I think I am done. If anyone has any suggestions let me know. thanks for everyone's help
For posterity, can you post images of the counter, external and internal, from different angles?
A coil inside would indicate a solenoid type mechanism.
Yes I might try again in a few days
You might check the line polarity with respect to the capacitor's polarity
Quote from: TelePlay on September 24, 2022, 07:27:12 PMA coil inside would indicate a solenoid type mechanism.
Have you tested the coil for continuity?
Worst case is a broken wire in the winding, hard to fix.
Best case is the end of the magnet wire, over the years of changing temperatures, has broken away from its solder point. Magnet wire is coated with varnish so only the very small cross section cut end, the cross section of the wire, is soldered to the wires going to the terminals. The varnish acts like a non-conductive tube allowing the inner metal conductor to break free of its solder point creating a short. Simply refreshing the solder joint eliminates that short.
I have had a couple of old subset ringers that had that happen to them. Re-soldering, refreshing the magnet wire joint fixed the short. This may or may not apply to your counter.
I found this text in a reply posted by me in September 2018 about magnet wire soldering issues:
QuoteAs for re-soldering the magnet wire to the ringer leads, while I was given credit for the tip, the credit really goes to Jeff Lamb, ktownphoneco, who made me aware of this when I had a 600 subset type ringer that was dead. As he explained to me, to save time when first made by WE, the magnet wire was just cut and soldered to the ringer wire. To save assembly time, the sides of the magnet wire were not stripped of their varnish or enamel so that only the end cross section of the very thin wire would bond to the solder, make the joint. Over time, with temperature changes, the magnet wire within the solder joint would shrink in length and after time could cause that very small cross section of the magnet wire to break free from the solder leaving the magnet wire inside of the varnish or enamel coating tube insulating it from the solder. Re-soldering such a joint would again bond the magnet wire with the solder and the ringer wire creating a near resistance free circuit.
Sending photos of counter. Coil seems good applied 6 V DC nothing movement nothing clicking. Cannot figure out how to get this cover off without that shaft being there in the way
Will post photos
There's got to be a way to remove the shaft. Then cover would pull off. It's the only thing holding the cover on
Thanks for the counter images. I don't have a clue of what to do next.
There is magnetic hold when energized,mechanism will not let numbers move until 6 volt source is removed when using small screwdriver to advance digits. Do you think dsk would know how to remove cover or any one else?
I have never removed that cover, but one on/off pulse lets my counter add 1.
Applied 6volt DC just a light clicking.If you push the Clapper with 6 volts dc then remove power the Clapper returns and advances the digit. The coil has continuity and reads 306 ohms. The other issue is when I hook up the counter it won't break dial tone but when removing one wire from counter I can dial out. I don't want to spend 20.00 on a counter then not be able to dial out. Do you think the counter is the problem for not breaking dial tone to dialing out? When energizing Clapper doesn't pull in. Would like some input
I let capacitor charge for 5 minutes disconnected both leads from counter dialed 1 digit read 6 volts dialed 2nd digit read 6 volts. The circuit was wired as first shown with resistor & capacitor. A soon as you remove J wire off counter you can break dial tone and call out just can't figure this out if the problem is the RC circuit or if a working counter would resolve the issue
The counter coil is in spec at 300 ohms so I can't see how it can be the cause of your inability to break dial tone. There must be another wiring issue somewhere that is doing this and I'd try adding the diode in circuit as originally suggested just to rule out that being the issue, although I'm not sure why it would be.
Tried diode no luck put both wires going to counter together and was able to dial out. Go figure very puzzling to me. I won't try to get a new counter but I am tempted. Ther is a number on phone Rep.as. Would still like to find a wiring diagram for this particular phone any help appreciated.
Hope there
Someone out there that can help with this issue
I think this is the diagram you need for your phone - courtesy of TCI Library - https://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/search?q=D08
I'd start doing some checking to see if it's wired correctly.
Thanks for input Tubman. This phone is fully functional works great.so I believe it's wired correctly. I'm going through this to get counter to work.firs chance I get I will trace wires not sure what all components are. There are 2 jumpers not there and 1 wire from what I believe to be the coil going to one side of counter. A couple of questions on my sketch see photo
Tried to translate
Yes, definitely worth checking out the wiring as a phone can work on the line but not be wired as per the diagram. When you are trying to make modifications such as the additional components for the counter then any small deviation from the diagram can make all the difference.
I tried to draw the diagram in another way.
Since it was terminals with equal marking, I have numbered them from 1-12
Approximately reading with an ohm meter should be as in the table, and of-course pretty much mar may be measured.
Thanks to tubaman & dsk for all you help time and input.I will give this one last try. If it doesn't work that's it I will let you know.
Well all the wiring checks out. All the ohm readings are very close to your chart. Again cant figure out why when you disconnect the counter put both wires together one from Pulse contact the other from positive side of capacitor it wont break dial tone. I can get a working counter from phoneco. Does any one think that that the counter is the problem. It only works when you manually press Clapper the releases when you remove power but won't pull in when 6 volts DC is applied.
The counter may be mechanically faulty but I'm pretty sure it's not the reason you can't break the dial tone when the extra components are added. I'd get that part resolved before spending money on a replacement.
I agree 100%. I will double check every thing. Again I will let all of you know what happens.
Well finally got counter Clapper to work But lost a small piece that advances numbers.The other problem is still not breaking dial tone,but when dialing out on hook Clapper would advance numbers When dialing off hook can't break dial tone and Clapper won't pull in. I checked wiring again looks according to diagram and all ohm readings are close to what's on chart. Go figure
The other issue is that when dialing off hook not only can't you break dial tone Clapper Clapper won't pull in
Is the counter suppose to work off pulsing contact?
Because the way its wired it's wired to shunt contact. On photo of dial blue and brown are pulsing contacts.
I have to look at the dial on mine to see if it ias equal, I have never touched it because it is just working, but your dial is related to the GPO no 10 that you may find info about here: https://www.britishtelephones.com/dial1.htm#d10
Switched both sets of wires from pulsing contact to shunt contact no dial tone.wired back as originally wired. dialed out transmits received and rings. Put resistor capacitor back in circuit let charge 5 min dialed 1st digit counter Clapper pulled in and released as it should but did not break dial tone. I have checked every wire matches diagram. Does anyone think another component should be added somewhere else ?
Without the diode, capacitor, resistor it works, but with, it does not break dial tone when those components are in the circuit? You are sure that the resistor is 15.000 ohms? (or more) Disconnect the resistor only, and test again. (The counter will not work, but you should break the dial tone) If it breaks the dial tone try higher resistance. The charging time will probably increase but if you get it working :)
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=292451;image)
I did every thing suggested in the post counter worked fine still couldn't break dial tone. Do you think a 200k ohm resistor would make a difference?
Does anyone have any other suggestions?
Can't figure out why
When I remove the J terminal wire off of counter we can break dial tone
I put a 27k ohm resistor in series with 150k resistor was able to activate counter and break dial tone but not always able to dial a full 10 digit number. Need help to figure what other size resistor to dial full 10 digit phone numbers.
Here is a diagram of what i did to get it to break dial tone,but sometimes could not dial out full phone numbers. So its hit & miss. I think with someone's assistance we could tweak this to work
Also you have a better chance of dialing out a complete phone number right after capacitor was fully charged. But not always,if you dial out before 5 min you can dial a few numbers and then can no longer break dial tone.
Quote from: long jumper on October 07, 2022, 03:50:52 PMI put a 27k ohm resistor in series with 150k resistor was able to activate counter and break dial tone but not always able to dial a full 10 digit number. Need help to figure what other size resistor to dial full 10 digit phone numbers.
Your line is more sensitive than mine, maybe you should even try to increase the resistance value even more, maybe double it. Then the charging time of the capacitor will also increase, but you have to test out how long time it will take to charge enough to make the counter count.
Quote from: long jumper on October 07, 2022, 07:49:38 PM. . . if you dial out before 5 min you can dial a few numbers and then can no longer break dial tone.
I read through the whole topic again and id not see anything about the dial itself. Did you ever check you dial speed? Dialing a few numbers I've seen where a dial is too slow and the central office times out causing the line to go back to dial tone. The specs are 8 to 11 PPS IIRC in the US Bell System.
Once you begin to dial a number, you should not be hearing dial tone again. Upon completion, the CO will send a ring signal or busy signal or whatever until the phone is answered, on the other end, or you hang up.
A slow dial, on the edge of the CO capabilities to record and step pulses, can cause this effect you have noticed (quoted above). After dialing starts, you should not hear dial tone unless you hang up and start over so the "you can dial a few numbers and then can no longer break dial tone" statement does not make sense.
If you haven't, you can use a wall clock with a second hand to see if your dial returns from 0 in about 1 second which would be a dial speed of 10 PPS. If it takes 1.25 seconds, your dial would be running at about 8 PPS and dial speed along with the sensitivity of your central office to pulse dialing may combine to cause the dial to "time out."
Also, when dialing, the main spring is tightest, has the most energy when releasing the flinger wheel. A dial that needs cleaning and lubrication may produce acceptable pulses when first released but as the dial returns to a stop, that last few numbers with be sent to the CO at a PPS speed slower than the first few. I documented this somewhere on the forum some time ago with a graph showing the dial PPS speed as it returned from dialing 0. Even with a governor, a dial in need of cleaning will slow down over 10 digits and if you dial is slow, and your line is sensitive to dialing speed, it may be that the CO recognizes the first few pulses but not the last few due to the slow down dropping the dial out of spec.
If your dial is near 10 PPS (pulses per second), then it's something else but slow dial speed would be eliminated as a cause of your problems.
Another thing to try is to clean all of the dial leaf switch contacts, to burnish them, using a piece of paper card stock to remove any buildup of crud on the contacts (pull a piece of cardstock back and forth through the contacts a couple of times when they are closed).
The contacts themselves are coated with rare earth minerals to keep them from corroding over time so don't use anything like sandpaper or emery cloth, just clean paper card stock. Anything other than card stock will remove the rare earth minerals and allow the contacts to corrode from that point forward.
==========
The detail on dial performance follows for those who are trying to understand what I said above about dial slow down. It may or may not apply to this topic but for those who missed my post in 2018, here is a recap.
Analysis of a subject dial's speed showed it to be an average of 8.35 PS (purple line) when dialing 0, pulsing 10 times.
Plotting the time of each pulse showed that while the dial started off in spec at 8.74 PPS, the last digit pulse rate was an out of spec 7.73 PPS.
In other words, the dial started to send pulses to the CO within spec (8-11 PPS) but dropped out of spec after the 6th pulse (8.00 PPS on the graph is at the black line). The last 4 pulses were below spec and the CO would not recognize the pulses went back to dial tone or sent a time out error sound signal.
While the thin brown line shows a standard straight trend line, the thin blue shows an polynomial trend line and it shows the dial spring/governor keeping the speed loss fairly straight until about 8 PPS when the combination of spring energy and dial friction began to slow the dial speed and an increasing rate (you can see how the thin blue line begins to move away from the thin brown line).
So, a dial that has a marginal dialing spec (just above 8 PPS) to begin with can drop below the minimum dialing spec and cause the CO to no longer count the pulses, to step the system so the call can be placed.
Teleplay I agree with you 100% I do not question your expertise. Have not checked dial speed. But when dialing out on landline with out any components all calls break dial tone and are completed. That's what puzzling to me. I will try everything on your post. If I can't adjust I will send dial to Steve H. Thanks let you know
Forgot the dial works without the counter wired in. Dial is probably good. Strange problem, indeed.
I am going to still check it out as you said. DSK mentioned to try to increase resistance may help. I will let you know.
Quote from: long jumper on October 08, 2022, 02:48:04 PMI am going to still check it out as you said. DSK mentioned to try to increase resistance may help. I will let you know.
I don't know how to use one but I would think an oscilloscope would be useful in seeing what is happening to different parts of the circuit as dialing starts and fails. Any oscilloscope gurus out their that could confirm or reject my thinking?
Going to order a few different resistors. Right now I can't think of anyone that has a oscilloscope. I will let you know how it works out
I have covered my oscilloscope needs by using: Visual Analyzer from this page: https://www.sillanumsoft.org/
In telephone related connections it is most for fun. To analyze the dial pulses ++ the Audacity has helped me a lot.
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17033.msg175673#msg175673
Just wanted to let Everyone know I was able to get the phone to break dial tone after getting counter coil to pull in and release. Had a few conversations talk & receive volume fine. I still may have to get a counter if I can't repair. All that was needed to do was put a 100k ohm resistor from L1to capacitor - negative. positive side of capacitor to L2. Capacitor charges in about 2 minutes. As a side note I have always checked polarity. But for what ever reason it did not work according to diagram. Again thanks for all your input, will let you know when I get a counter fully functional
Quote from: long jumper on October 18, 2022, 09:45:17 PMAll that was needed to do was put a 100k ohm resistor from L1to capacitor - negative. positive side of capacitor to L2. Capacitor charges in about 2 minutes.
Good news!
It would be great if you can draw up the wiring diagram of your final, working, configuration and post it here just in case someone is interested in seeing or or maybe fixing a similar phone in the future.
Still something strange with that ciruit, have you tried to just give the counter a dc pulse direct to test if it works no resistors, nothing else. I can not see the hence of having a resistor in series with the counter.
The capacitor should slowly charge when the phone is on hook, but with a so small current that the exchange do not "observe that leak of current". When the capacitor is charged and you move the dial out of rest position the counter use the power from the capacitor to move one step, but the next move on the dial will not make any difference for counter because the capacitor is (almost) empty. The resistor where the current goes and charges the capacitor when the phone is on hook should be so high that the exchange does not "observe the current" but so low that the capacitor will be charged before next time you use the phone for a call. The capacitor size should be huge enough to securely be able to let the counter move 1 step, and so small that it will not take to long time to charge it. Mine is designed for a 24V system, but did also work on my Linksys ATA that gives 48V.
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=180712;image)
I tried 6 volt DC on counter it did not activate. When I used capacitor & resistor it activated counter when 1st digit was dialed, Clapper pulled in for 1/2 second then released which would have advanced digit if it was not missing part.if I can't figure out how to make part I will purchase a counter
Now you are close to fix it, and yes it should only count once each time you call out. One of our Danish members has told me that it was the way it worked, and you had to be careful when wiping off the dust of the phone because even when the phone was on hook, and you moved the dial it would count one, and you would have to pay for that.
Photo of wiring diagram. (Note) negative side of capacitor goes to terminal #10 to counter
This question goes to dsk, when these phones wired in Denmark to the telco what wiring method was used to make counter work? Also what did they charge per call?
Quote from: long jumper on October 20, 2022, 03:15:18 PMThis question goes to dsk, when these phones wired in Denmark to the telco what wiring method was used to make counter work? Also what did they charge per call?
I have just been told that the third wire was a ground connection, and it was expensive to call. Here in Norway we just payed for the time used from when the part answered. So this is not much of an answer :-[
That's ok thanks for all your help and anyone else who shared any input. That will sew it up.
Quote from: dsk on October 20, 2022, 03:29:53 PMI have just been told that the third wire was a ground connection ...
It may be of interest that here in the UK if you had a meter in your house, known as a Subscribers Private Meter, they also used an earth connection. These meters were triggered by a metering pulse being sent from the exchange, and in this example - https://www.britishtelephones.com/meter47a.htm - it is also a capacitor being charged that is used to operate the meter itself.
Very interesting, Thanks for sharing Tubaman.
Quote from: long jumper on August 15, 2022, 04:40:46 PMWanted to know if anyone has any idea how old this phone is?
Is that the bell visible on top?
Great!
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=273123;image)