Western Electric 20B Stick

[Doug Rose]

I open the stick and one of the transmitter wires is off. Terminals marked 1 and  4 on the shaft, 2 and 3 along the bottom. Receiver works. These have to be repro cord, but they are great. thanks...Doug

[poplar1]

Doug, the 20B originally had an "uninsulated transmitter" with only one transmitter wire, that went through the back of the transmitter bell (cup) to connect to the transmitter. The "return" for the transmitter was the phone itself. That's why there is only one hole in the rack for the transmitter wire -- rather than two -- and only two terminals on the hookswitch -- rather than three.

If a newer "insulated" transmitter such as a 323 was installed later, you had to install a piece of wire from one of the transmitter terminals to the frame of the transmitter, to make it equivalent to the "uninsulated" transmitter.

[poplar1]

See drawing showing 229 transmitter with only one wire:
http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/browse/doc_details/2146-desk-stands-229-tl

[Doug Rose]

thanks David....I'll check it out in the morning. Are the cords repros? I know the green transmitter one is, but the handset and the base look great, but are just to good to believe they are not new.

Jan and I are on vacation, just got back from the movies,  Saw Sully....it was superb!!...Doug

[poplar1]

Can you provide more pictures of the cords?
Here are some authentic cords, apparently for a 20-B or similar, made by Northern Electric in 1965. I don't know why they were making them that late, unless they were for the Bell Canada museum, which closed sometime before 1972 (in Montréal).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Vintage-Northern-Electric-409-Telephone-Cords-NOS-Green-Cloth-60-Candlestick-/311707106258

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-Vintage-Northern-Electric-408-Telephone-Cords-NOS-Green-Cloth-27-Candlestick-/311707098968

[poplar1]

Found it! The diagram on the right shows the correct way to connect an insulated transmitter (323 or 329) to replace the original 229 uninsulated transmitter on a 20-B.  (TCI Library)
http://telephonecollectors.info/index.php/document-repository/doc_details/2166-desk-stands-323-tl

                                On Desk Stands Having One Trans. Cord

                                            Use a piece of #22 gauge
                                            bare copper wire to ground
                                            transmitter by connecting
                                            center terminal and bridge.
                                            Fasten screws securely.


So, it is possible that whoever replaced the transmitter didn't realize that only one wire was needed.

[Doug Rose]

Can you provide more pictures of the cords?
Here are some authentic cords, apparently for a 20-B or similar, made by Northern Electric in 1965. I don't know why they were making them that late, unless they were for the Bell Canada museum, which closed sometime before 1972 (in Montréal).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Vintage-Northern-Electric-409-Telephone-Cords-NOS-Green-Cloth-60-Candlestick-/311707106258

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-Vintage-Northern-Electric-408-Telephone-Cords-NOS-Green-Cloth-27-Candlestick-/311707098968

I Bid on both sets and ....lost....They look identical .....maybe they are real!....Doug

[ESalter]

Doug, in your photos the cords look "fuzzy", which is a common characteristic of reproduction cords.  An easy way to tell would be the style and age of the spade and pin terminals on the ends of your cords.

---Eric

[Doug Rose]

thanks Eric.....still not sure as the pins and the spades look great and I agree are usually a dead give away. Look at the pics David posted of the Northern cords that went last week on eBay. See the band with 65 on them. Mine have the same band. Usually I can pic out repros a mile away....still on the fence....Doug

[poplar1]

The cords do appear to be the same as the Northern Electric 408 and 409 cords that just sold. Maybe call them reissues (1965) rather than repros?

Is your 20-B  WE or NE? Does it appear to have nickel plate under the black paint?

Did the seller say where he got the phone, or have any other phone items that might suggest its origin?
I might have bought it just to get the cords.

[Doug Rose]

David....you amaze me, cords are real dated II 65. Transmitter is a 337, both cords to tranmitter look real.

Jan found this at Brimfield in September, seller had no information.

Its a 337 so where are my connections for the transmitter, so different from any other sticks I have tried to wire. The green cord is already terminated, looking for the other connection

Fun and frustrating at the same time.

David....you are the man....Doug

[Doug Rose]

GOT IT!!!

[poplar1]

When used with a 20-B or 20-S, the 337 transmitter used only one wire to connect to terminal 2, where the yellow desk stand cord connects.
(Reply #5 above if you have the oldest messages first):

http://telephonecollectors.info/index.php/document-repository/doc_details/2166-desk-stands-323-tl -- SEE DIAGRAM ON RIGHT

                                On Desk Stands Having One Trans. Cord

                                            Use a piece of #22 gauge
                                            bare copper wire to ground
                                            transmitter by connecting
                                            center terminal and bridge.
                                            Fasten screws securely.

The phone frame was used for the other conductor -- or "ground" -- as in cars.
The 20-B and 20-S desk stands were often converted to 20-ALs (or even 151-ALs) and at that time additional switchhook leaves would have been added so that the transmitter would have been "insulated." At that time, a second transmitter wire would have been added.