AE 21 candlestick wiring problem

[Haf]

I removed the dial wires from no. 7 and 8 and there was a very very really very soft clicking when dialing, just slightly more than maybe imagination. And yes, the no. 6 connection has only the jumper and the transmitter wire.

[dsk]

Maybe the hook-switch not closing the contacts as it should, when going off hook.
I have stretched a part of your picture 4 time in one direction, and putted on some comments.

As the picture are, all contacts are open = on hook position.

dsk

[Haf]

I will check if all contacts are closed properly when off hooked.

[Haf]

Year, looks like all real closed. It's hard to take a good picture with flash, but what i can detect they are closed. And checked with a piece of paper, the contacts close that strong that the paper is tight in between and you have to pull it with soft force if you want to remove it.

Haf

p.s., tested now with a multimeter for resistance, the have contact and, what I think its strange, all make when connected a little scratching sounds at the transmitter. Maybe because the multimeter conducts little current when measuring resistance?

[dsk]

If  you have a battery 3-6V and connect one pole to number 8, and take the other lead on off no 7 it should be loud clicks, if not remove everything else connected to the receiver wires.
When clicking = OK move from 7 to 1, clicking should happen when off hook. When OK move to 6. clicking in off hook position should be weaker, but when connected you should hear yourselves in the receiver.
Moving to other end of strap (4) exactly the same should happen. Moving to 3, again the same result.
If the dial is not connected to 7 and 8, dialing should result in a number of clicks equal to the digit dialed.
Moving to 2 again the same result. 

If this not happens, try a little moving around, and when you hit the right terminal you know what to move.
I believe we have tested it all now.  Keep the 2 dial cords not connected to 7 and 8, until we get a proper dial tone.

Keeping red and black unconnected to the phone when testing, may let the process be easier, but you will get a to much sidetone.

dsk

[HowardPgh]

Check to see if the transmitter is good.  Try it on another phone or wire it in series with a earphone to see if it is working.  If it is open it would not conduct  the current and let the phone work at normal volume. You could try shorting the transmitter leads and see if that makes the phone louder.
Also check to see if two wires are touching at a bare part, that may be a cause of really low volume.
Check to see if the receiver is OK, The AE receiver I had had a partially open coil.  Make sure the diaphragm is not kinked or dented and check that the gap between the pole faces and the diaphragm is clear of dirt.

A question:
Why does one of the dial leads go to ground through the hookswitch contacts in the original diagram pasted in the wooden subset?

[G-Man]

A question:
Why does one of the dial leads go to ground through the hookswitch contacts in the original diagram pasted in the wooden subset?

Because as previously stated, this telephone was not intended for use on a standard loop-dialing line. Composite/Simplex dialing was accomplished by connecting both lines together through the center-tap of the bell coils and through the hookswitch contacts to ground. This allowed for dialing the exchange from very long rural lines.

Other parties on your line were called by using the magneto.

[Haf]

Yeah..finally I got it working, with a ton of help from dsk, thank you very much and all the others too!! Transmitter and receiver do a good job, loud and clear, tested that before with another telephone and now via a call, I was told no difference compared to a modern one (I didn't tell that it was a candlestick and asked about quality and volume). There is still a quite loud "plopp" sound when hooking off but as I read here at the forum, that should be normal for a telephone like this. And as it is original I will keep it like that, when people got by in the 1930's I should too. Even If I don't understand the difference between the AE candlestick and the WE 202, both tested with the same anti sidetone subset and only the candlestick doing that sound.
Now there are only few problems to solve. As all my AE dials, this one too, are dialing incorrect. Wonder why, never had any problems with WE dials no matter how old they are. And I need a longer receiver cord (mine was shortened badly someday) and a 4 conductor cloth cord for the subset. It's now connected with the 202's black rubber cord.
Again, thank all y'all very much.

Haf

[dsk]

I have made a sketch about how to connect dial right and wrong.

I did put some numbers on a picture of a modern AE dial, no big changes.  

Dialing a 0 should take about 1.2 seconds to dial stops.

The pulse contact (5) shall open and close 10 times and stay closed. The pulse contacts shall remained closed when rotating the dial from rest position to the finger stops.

The dial shall usually not have any oil, if it is dirty, and moves with slow, you may clean with meths, and use thin oil at the spindle ends at pos 4 and 5, and the gear 3. Sometimes at the rotating part between 3 and 5. It is most important to not get oil in the centrifugal regulator (here as a plastic cylinder near 4)  When using oil, it has to be thin, and very little of it.
Use the white end of a match dipped in oil, and just touch the part who needs oil.

Regarding clicks, modern telephones has a varistor across the receiver, you could put one across the receiver terminals. If you don't have one 2 diodes in opposite direction will do. (picture)

When they designed your phone the clicks was not a priority. If you switch wires at the triple kontact set on the hook sw. so the transmitter is connected to the on who makes last, it will be better. (number 5 in the picture earlier in this thread)

dsk

[dsk]

I suggest we try to solve that dial problem.
If we make a special Dial problem thread, it will be easier to find later,
Maybe we may end up with a diagram showing the pulses like this:


dsk

[Haf]

making a threat out of this might be a good idea as I found nothing like that when searched the forum (but maybe I just didn't searched enough)

[dsk]

Then, I think we may end this thread, and start on this one:

http://tinyurl.com/c6tc7k5

dsk

[Jack Ryan]

What ever happened to this Simplex dialling AE 21?

Jack