Question about colored 302's

[MagicMo]

I know that colored 302's came out in 1949. Does anyone know the exact month and day? The plastic sets.
Thanks
Mo

[G-Man]

I don't know the precise date but most of mine are dated from the late '40s to early 50's.

Others may be able to pinpoint the exact date or you may want to inquire on one of the other list.

[baldopeacock]

I know that colored 302's came out in 1949. Does anyone know the exact month and day? The plastic sets.
Thanks
Mo

They came out earlier than that, Mo.   I've seen two ivory 302s from 1941.   Other pre-war color 302s have been discussed here in the past.   The earliest ones I've heard of were '39.

The early color 302s have some unique features.   The plungers are color instead of clear plastic.   The all-original one I've seen in person had a different clear plastic fingerwheel, thicker, and held down with an X-shaped metal retainer.   The handsets are solid plastic.   The cup under the finger hold area under the cradle is painted metal.   I think there are some other differences.

A pre-war Ivory 302 is discussed in this thread:  good photos show the peculiarities.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=3827.0

This thread shows a red 1940.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=2950.0

[Jim Stettler]

Here is some text I posted in March 2010:
In January I was corresponding with Jon Kolger about early 302's.
The following is a compilation of his e-mails on the subject:
________________________________________
Hi Jim,

Yes the handsets were completely solid.  I don't remember if the handsets
and caps were grooved... I don't have one in front of me to check it out.
All my examples are in storage.

There were other differences as well:  The handset cap threads were
different than the latter versions; the plastic used to make it was
different, much more opaque and not so translucent;  The hookswitch buttons
were the same color as the phone; the little finger cup piece underneath the
hookswitch was made of metal painted the same color as the phone; and the
dial, if it had one, had a completely different style of fingerwheel (much
thicker) and method of mounting it to the dial.  Also, the dial card had to
be inserted inside the fingerwheel AFTER the fingerwheel was attached.

I'm still looking for a blue example of these early 302s.  I have all the
other colors.

I just looked at a green 302 dated 1941 and it has a solid handset with no
grooves on the handle or caps.  I can't say definitively that they were all
this way, but I would say it is very likely.  I hope this helps...

The sets with the colored plungers were NOT the smaller plungers, just the
regular size plungers of the latter 302.  The dials were 5J with the white
painted housings.  I'm not sure when they started to make these early
colored sets.... Most of mine have a 1941 date, but I seem to recall having
one dated 1939.  I'm pretty sure I have a NOS 5J dial somewhere dated 1937.
I'm also not sure when when they started to make 302s again.  Dave Johnson
just stated 1945 on the listserv.  I don't know when they started to make
the colored sets... I've never paid that much attention to the dates on
mine... Probably early 50s.

Jon
________________________________________ _
I was waiting for the subject to come up,before posting the info.

Jim

[MagicMo]

I had no idea. Thanks for all the info!
MO

[deedubya3800]

My ivory 302 is dated 3 23 42, and was probably among the last made before the wartime hiatus. Colored plastic 302's returned in 1949, but with a lot of different parts, including, but not limited to, the switch hook buttons, the filler plate under the lift, the handset handle, the handset caps, the finger wheel, and the finger wheel retainer.

[unbeldi]

This seems like a good place to post this info, as it answers definitively by reliable reference the initial question of this thread.

The Bell Laboratories Record Volume 27 of January 1949, page 43, has a short notice that announces the resumption of manufacture of colored 300-series telephones.

Colored Telephone Sets
Production has been resumed on colored telephone sets of the combined type, with the ivory color to be available first and old rose, gray-green, dark blue, and Pekin red to follow shortly. These colors are mixed with powdered plastic before molding. The four metallic colors, statuary bronze, dark gold, oxidized silver, and old brass will be produced by finishes applied in Western Electric's distribution house shops. Colored sets will be available initially in the Nos. 302, 304, 305 and 306 sets, and later in the 354 set.


However, what does this imply w/r/t colored metal 302s. Have any custom-painted metal 302s been found dated post war?

[poplar1]

However, what does this imply w/r/t colored metal 302s. Have any custom-painted metal 302s been found dated post war?

Catalog #11 (1950) is no help since 302GWs are shown only in black. As previously noted, by 1941 ivory, gray-green, blue and pekin red 302s were being produced only in plastic, with 5J dials and transparent finger wheels, and the metallic colors were still painted, with 5H dials and painted finger wheels.  (C30.011 Issue 4)

In 1949, and perhaps until 1954, production resumed, as noted in the BLR article. The "improved" transparent finger wheel for the plastic sets had already been invented by 1947. (Addendum C30.011, Issue 1, 12-15-47). (This is the one with the "movable finger wheel clamp.")

By "custom" do you mean non-standard colors? Non-standard painted colors were available for both 302s and 202s by 1941.

I have one painted bronze 302 that was reissued in 1949. The housing is painted metal, the baseplate is 6/40; the handset is brown Bakelite dated 100 (10/40); the dial is a 1949 5H (case and finger wheel both painted bronze). The plungers are painted as is the metal part under the hand hold. The transmitter was new (1949) and the receiver was restamped 1149R. EDIT: Not sure what the color is--not statuary bronze

It seems unlikely that there would have been "new" metal housings in 1949, or that plastic housings would have ever been painted in metallic colors. So while the bronze example refurbished in 1949 makes sense, I wonder how it would have been possible for either a Bell operating company or an independent company to order a "new" metallic colored 302 in 1949 or later. Since the article indicates that the four metallic colors would be applied in the distributing house shops, and not at the Indianapolis factory,  this seems to indicate that by 1949, all painted sets were in fact refurbs and not new.

[unbeldi]

I have an ivory metal 304 dated in 1946 on the base with a 5J* dial dated 4-47. Clearly they made 5J dials after the war and before this 1949 resumption date.  What did they make them for if not for colored sets? Replacement for sets from prewar times?

Perhaps I'll post the phone in another thread sometime. I bought it for parts because of condition, but have been reluctant to tear it apart because it just might be real and I have been liking it just the way it is.

[poplar1]

I have an ivory metal 304 dated in 1946 on the base with a 5J* dial dated 4-47. Clearly they made 5J dials after the war and before this 1949 resumption date.  What did they make them for if not for colored sets? Replacement for sets from prewar times?

Perhaps I'll post the phone in another thread sometime. I bought it for parts because of condition, but have been reluctant to tear it apart because it just might be real and I have been liking it just the way it is.

Are all parts including the cords and transmitter dated 1946 or 1947? If this was a new set and not a refurb, then it contradicts the 1941 BSP which said that metal 302s would no longer be manufactured in ivory, pekin red, green or blue.

[unbeldi]

Are all parts including the cords and transmitter dated 1946 or 1947? If this was a new set and not a refurb, then it contradicts the 1941 BSP which said that metal 302s would no longer be manufactured in ivory, pekin red, green or blue.

If so, that would certainly do so, but what the BSPs of 1941 say may or may not be so interesting anymore in 1946, there was a war in between.

I never thought it was newly made and at first I had my doubts it being original issue. The ivory silk handset cord was torn badly and stretched and used up, dated 1950. Ok, so it may have been refurbished in 1950, that doesn't wipe out the date of 47 on the dial, etc. Receiver and transmitter were also 1947. The receiver however was a refurbished unit of 1938, stamped 947R. Dial plate 150B of I-47, finger wheel & mount is the rotating latch type. Handset is brown, grooveless Bakelite. Feet were cloth covered, but very torn up. So, essentially all dates are close 46/47, except cord.  The big turn-off for me was it has black plungers, but there is no indication that this was a black phone once. The paint is in bad condition, but it seems it is a first coat.

[poplar1]

We do know, however, that manufacture of color phones was discontinued completely in 1942. So if the BLR record is correct, no new color 302s were produced between 1942 and 1948.

[poplar1]

While so far there is no written evidence that new colored phones were made between 1942 and 1948, it's quite possible that remanufactured colored sets were issued from the WE shop in order to maintain existing customers' colored sets and possibly even for new customers ordering colored sets, particularly from 1946-1948 with pentup demand for new service.

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The repairman was instructed not to replace individual parts on a painted set. (C30.011 Issue 4, 1.02) Therefore, there had to be available replacement sets in the Bell storeroom or that could be ordered from the WE distributing house.

One reason for switching manufacture to plastic colored sets c. 1941 was that the plastic sets had "a more permanent finish."(1.01) "With colored plastic telephone sets, which are not as subject to fading or discoloration as painted sets, individual parts may be replaced if necessary." (1.03)


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WR-C30.011 Issue 1 8-5-42
Colored Station Sets

              1.02 The manufacturer has a factory stock of certain of the
                      colored sets and the sale of these sets to new customers
              will be continued until the stocks have been reduced to an
              extent that only limited numbers are available for maintenance
              replacements.

The items shown as "normally stocked at the factory" included 302As (non-dial) and 302Cs (dial), both with 2-conductor mounting cords, in all 8 colors, also F1A handsets in all 8 colors. Also dials: 5H in -6, -7, -8 and -12 metallic colors and 5J.

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[unbeldi]

The Bell Laboratories Record Volume 27 of January 1949, page 43, has a short notice that announces the resumption of manufacture of colored 300-series telephones.

Colored Telephone Sets
Production has been resumed on colored telephone sets of the combined type, with the ivory color to be available first and old rose, gray-green, dark blue, and Pekin red to follow shortly. These colors are mixed with powdered plastic before molding. The four metallic colors, statuary bronze, dark gold, oxidized silver, and old brass will be produced by finishes applied in Western Electric's distribution house shops. Colored sets will be available initially in the Nos. 302, 304, 305 and 306 sets, and later in the 354 set.

I just pulled out an old broken ivory Tenite 302 housing with the intent of making an acetone solution of a good chunk of it. Looking at the date stamp, it turns out to be from December 20, 1948, just before the publication of this announcement of the resumption of production. So, I have one of the very first ivory Tenite housings after the war!
Do I still want to dissolve it?