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My Bk Precision 1050

Started by bobv, January 10, 2019, 08:30:17 AM

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bobv

#30
A1 Telephone Demo with 1045

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wM-_xvT2gBA

======================

EDIT: The above video was created and posted by Dennis McDonald at A1-Telephone.com, 618-235-6959

bobv

#31
Another Example A1 Telephone with BK1045

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omV-jZsx-6U

======================

EDIT: The above video was created and posted by Dennis McDonald at A1-Telephone.com, 618-235-6959

Key2871

I agree with Doug. I have said I use mine for testing purposes only, some times I use it to help adjust a stubborn ringer. But as a diagnostic tool no. Because it wasn't designed for that. Checking basic operation of a telephone set, transmit and receive, also cords handset and base of modular design.
I'll step off the telephone stool now.

Ken
KEN

FABphones

Thanks teleplay John and ktown Jeff for the info you have posted on this thread.
Info there I didn't know but definitely needed to.
A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

bobv

Quote from: bobv on January 11, 2019, 06:49:16 PM
A1 Telephone Demo with 1045

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wM-_xvT2gBA

======================

EDIT: The above video was created and posted by Dennis McDonald at A1-Telephone.com, 618-235-6959


yes we know that. his title is  there. he using BK 1045 and 1050 some other testers

bobv

Quote from: Ktownphoneco on January 11, 2019, 04:38:31 PM
The facts are beyond the point of an opinion.    You can't calibrate a rotary pulse dial or a T/T dial with either a BK 1045 or a BK 1050. Period.     Yes, I have a Sage 930A, which is what I use to calibrate dials.    Yes, I suspect there are other instruments on the market similar to the Sage 930A, but the BK 1045 and BK 1050 aren't one of them.   No matter how you'd like to dance around it, that's the bottom line.   You keep posting these useless video's of you dialing numbers on the Bk 1045 and BK 1050, which tells people "nothing".     Your posts may mislead someone who, like yourself , probably don't know how to repair or calibrate a dial, and they might end up searching eBay and spending their hard earned money, buying something they thing will work according to your posts, and find out when the instrument arrives, that it can't be used to calibrate a telephone dial, which is why they bought it based on "your" posts.    Stop acting like an expert on dial servicing.   You know nothing about it.

Mr. Moderator - I'm done here.

Jeff Lamb

this pictures from youtube video.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_ZB50WDdsw

check the time frame near 9:17/14:47

tubaman

#36
I've got this that my brother spotted at a car boot sale some years ago (I think it cost £25).
It simulates two lines, one long and one short, and you can dial between them (pulse or tone).  You can manually ring the phones and also test things like line reversal and earth disconnection. 
It was designed to bench test payphones so can also issue meter pulses etc, but I have never needed those bits.
It's getting pretty old now - over 20 years (I can tell that because the makers phone number is missing the digit '1' after the initial zero - that change happened in the UK in 1995).
It gets a lot of use and I would be lost without it.
:)

Key2871

#37
OK, I fail to see the relevance to the YouTube videos.
Dennis never actually shows how the "repair " was done, what he found wrong with the dial. The first one says the dial was locked up, OK what did he find wrong that caused the dial to have been locked up? Notice how he never shows what was actually done, or does he tell what was found wrong to cause the trouble. Yes he used one of many product testers to demonstrate that the dial actually works.
However it does not talk about calibration of the dials, which was already covered by Jeff and John, to tell you that a product tester can not calibrate dials, nor can they be used to do that.
So I fail to see where those videos make your point.
I've always had a problem with A1 and the videos they make about telephone repair. Because no where does he explaine how he came to his conclusion of what was wrong, and how he actually repaired the phone. As most of us know that it isn't hard to repair a telephone, the hardest parts I can see is discovering what is actually wrong, that usually entails replacing a part that failed. Common things are transmitter parts or receiver parts. A1 has his display of test equipment all neatly in view of the camera, to impress those who don't understand how easy it is to fix most common problems with a telephone.
Now it's been a long time since I've had the chance to work on and older dial such as a #4 or a #5 but I also came across a couple that were jammed up, and it was a simple fix to get the dial working again. Notice I didn't say calibrated, because I did not know or have equipment to do this. Did I dial out with my tester? Yes, as I also did on my POTs line to make sure the dial was actually operating the switch as it should. Again leaving out the word calibrate. Because I also had a couple dials that didn't make the grade. Mostly newer dials, and again I didn't know what was needed to repair those. So they did not get repaired.
I'll get off the telephone stool now..

Ken
KEN

TelePlay

     GLOBAL MODERATOR POST

Quote from: bobv on January 12, 2019, 12:11:39 AM
this pictures from youtube video.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_ZB50WDdsw

check the time frame near 9:17/14:47

This is incoherent.

What are you trying to say, what do you mean?

Please explain in detail, restate your post with meaningful content, or it will be deleted.

TelePlay

     Regular Member Post

Appears that this "FREE" software, NummernschalterPrüfer, produces results like those obtained from a Sage 930a or using Audacity. It certainly produces dial data absolutely necessary to calibrate a dial to manufacturer's spec, something a BK 1050/1045 can not and will never be able do to provide - dial speed (PPS) and break/make ratio (60/40 WE spec), information that has to be known before attempting to adjust a dial, if adjustment is needed.

     http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=21454.msg221328#msg221328





bobv

Quote from: TelePlay on January 12, 2019, 03:16:30 PM
     GLOBAL MODERATOR POST

This is incoherent.

What are you trying to say, what do you mean?

Please explain in detail, restate your post with meaningful content, or it will be deleted.


Hi,

There were two SAGE images posted in the forum/thread.  They were taken from a youtube video as screen shots and posted here.  There was another image (1045 with a phone) posted in the message.  This image and SAGE images are not connected or related. 

The two SAGE images were taken as screen shots from the youtube video. I posted the timeframe of the video where we can view these screenshots. when you play the video, you can see these screen shots in that time.

hope this clarifies. 

bobv

Quote from: TelePlay on January 12, 2019, 06:04:20 PM
     Regular Member Post

Appears that this "FREE" software, NummernschalterPrüfer, produces results like those obtained from a Sage 930a or using Audacity. It certainly produces dial data absolutely necessary to calibrate a dial to manufacturer's spec, something a BK 1050/1045 can not and will never be able do to provide - dial speed (PPS) and break/make ratio (60/40 WE spec), information that has to be known before attempting to adjust a dial, if adjustment is needed.

     http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=21454.msg221328#msg221328





hi
did you try this software.  I tried it and not successful.  is this a english version? i got different language.   
if you are successful, could you give some information?
thanks,

compubit

If I recall correctly, the software is in German. The screenshots are provided as a translation of the German on-screen display.

Dennis at A-1 has stated that the videos he provides are more for the customer to relay information of the "before" and "after", and he does not intend for them to be a "how to"or the details in his repair service.  Some of us look at the videos as being of no value; some of us look at the videos as something with insight to the phones we may not have access to (to see the insides, especially some of the specialty Design Line phones, at least for me).

As for tools and equipment, there are a number devices out there to assist, and (in my humble opinion), I don't think there is one tool that can resolve all problems (granted, I don't have any of these devices).

My solution for dials would be to leave it to the pros, and spend the $6 to send to any of the folks who deal with them. I can get a lot of dials done (more than I have) for the cost of many of these machines.

That being said, I believe that we agree to disagree about the specific uses/benefits of these devices.

Let's focus on collecting, and finding each of our own "purple unicorn", and share them with the group!

Jim
(I've said my peace!)
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

TelePlay

     GLOBAL MODERATOR POST

     and

     Regular Member Post


Quote from: bobv on January 12, 2019, 07:47:03 PM
There were two SAGE images posted in the forum/thread.  They were taken from a youtube video as screen shots and posted here.  There was another image (1045 with a phone) posted in the message.  This image and SAGE images are not connected or related. 

The two SAGE images were taken as screen shots from the youtube video. I posted the timeframe of the video where we can view these screenshots. when you play the video, you can see these screen shots in that time.

As suspected, you totally missed the point of that reply and the attached images.

The first image, be it a 1045 or a 1050, was attached to support the comment in the text "dialing numbers on the Bk 1045 and BK 1050" that the only information obtained from either of these two instruments is the number dialed and in the image that was "2."

In the second and third images, annotated with a yellow circle, were attached to support the comment in the text "a Sage 930A, which is what I use to calibrate dials" in that the information within the 2nd and 3rd images show dial's Pulse per Second (9.9 PPS) and Break/Make ratio (64% to 36%), two pieces of data absolutely essential to checking a dial, determining if it must be adjusted and then to check the dial after adjustment to see if it the adjustment brought it into spec or if it is not and requires more adjustment.

Those 3 images had nothing to do with the links to videos being posted and none of the replies posted contained any explanation of why or for what reason the videos (created by someone other than you and posted by you without attribution) were introduced to the topic. Posting a thousands video links would not change the fact that a BK 1045/1050 (or any instrument at that level) will be able to ever help anyone check and adjust a dial, if needed, to be within or within the acceptable range of performance specifications set by the manufacturer, 10 PPS and 60/40%.

A pass/fail system, be it a POTS line, a Panasonic 616/308, a Teltone Simulator, a Radio Shack Telephone Tester or a BK 1045/1050, will never produce a dial's performance data and can never be used to adjust the dial to be within manufacturer's specs and no matter how many videos of those simple pass/fail system being used to show a dial works or does not, none of them can be used to calibrate a dial.

And, yes, this is rocket science since the telephone was state of the art device when produced (WE and its Bell Labs in Murray Hill NJ was the preeminent research and development for state of the art technology including mechanical, chemical and electrical engineering for over a hundred years, they have thousands of patents) from the late 1800s to the late 1970s and duplicating the technology and its practices used in the period of the phone is completely essential to the proper and correct restoration of a dial, to check it and if necessary, to adjust it to be within manufacture specs, not just "work" after "fixing" it. Doing anything less than correct calibration results in a dial with questionable performance and if put into a telephone, one I would not want to buy on eBay if I did not know how to fix a bad dial after receiving the phone.

I certainly "hope this clarifies" your erroneous conclusions and short cut pursuits in telephone dial calibration. Pass/fail checks, as you desire to employ, are not, they can not in any way help properly calibrate a dial.

bobv

In my previous post, I requested if anyone has tested a dial with SAGE 930A, they can post a video.
Also, if anyone tested the same dial with 1045A and 1050, a video can be posted.  The videos of both SAGE 930A and BK 1045A/1050 can be compared.  would you like to do that?  Images would not tell the testing or how it is done or any details like video:) (photoshop can create any type of images too :)

I keep saying BK 1045A/1050 are simple methods to use.  SAGE 930A has sophisticated testing results.  I can't say any clearer than this.
I am using all three equipment and some prototypes. I pick and choose what I feel like to test the dial with.  This is my method and make the dial working.  There are times I don't calibrate the dial at all.  all that is needed is cleaning.  that's my experience having to deal with many dials (about 400 dials).  If I have to get those fixed to original spec by paying $6 per dial plus packaging/shipping/etc., it is costly and I would not learn much about the dials.  My way is hands-on and try different equipment. I am sharing my experience and some video in this forum.  I also shared some reference that others have done.  If anyone likes to use these equipment, it is their choice.