Capacitor Found in NE 717 - 195AN CAP

[Alex G. Bell]

Some may think its blasphemy, but we are actually drilling a small hole just above the NE logo on the front to affix the dial. As for wiring, it just takes reworking to get it dialing out. The components in the 717 are quite modern, similar to a 302.

You leave the 104B IND rather than replacing it with a 101A?

[Ktownphoneco]

Anytime I restore a N717AP for a customer who provides the set, I replace the 104 induction coil with a 101-A, and wire it up as I would a 302.   It's worth noting here, that anyone wishing to restore the case, it's made of hard maple, not oak or walnut.    If you wish to refinish the wood, use a wood "dye", not an oil based stain.      The fibers in hard maple are are very dense, and too close together to allow an oil based stain to penetrate.     Oil based stains produce a blotchy appearance on hard maple because the oil molecules are too large.      Using a water based dye, the molecules are smaller, and will fully penetrate the grain of the wood and produce a nice rich looking finish.    Top coat with a polymerized tung oil product.      Two or 3 coats will give a durable finish, and if in the future, the surface gets scratched, simply rub the scratched area with a lint free rag dabbed in more polymerized tung oil and the scratch is gone.
When restored in this fashion, the N717AP's make a very nice wall phone with all of the attributes of a 302.

Jeff Lamb

[Doug Rose]

Some may think its blasphemy, but we are actually drilling a small hole just above the NE logo on the front to affix the dial. As for wiring, it just takes reworking to get it dialing out. The components in the 717 are quite modern, similar to a 302.

Matt.... you folks never alter the design?....but drill a beautiful magneto phone to add a dial?  .....Doug

[mazda_matt]

Matt.... you folks never alter the design?....but drill a beautiful magneto phone to add a dial?  .....Doug

This phone was far from beautiful...Chips, cracked wood.. (not the one pictured above) Took a lot of wood filler to get it smooth again.

Thought we could try something new and sell some of these 717's. Have about 40 in rough shape. Will post pictures when we're done.

-MM

[mazda_matt]

You leave the 104B IND rather than replacing it with a 101A?

Haven't got there yet. Will let you know though.

-MM

[mazda_matt]

Anytime I restore a N717AP for a customer who provides the set, I replace the 104 induction coil with a 101-A, and wire it up as I would a 302.   It's worth noting here, that anyone wishing to restore the case, it's made of hard maple, not oak or walnut.    If you wish to refinish the wood, use a wood "dye", not an oil based stain.      The fibers in hard maple are are very dense, and too close together to allow an oil based stain to penetrate.     Oil based stains produce a blotchy appearance on hard maple because the oil molecules are too large.      Using a water based dye, the molecules are smaller, and will fully penetrate the grain of the wood and produce a nice rich looking finish.    Top coat with a polymerized tung oil product.      Two or 3 coats will give a durable finish, and if in the future, the surface gets scratched, simply rub the scratched area with a lint free rag dabbed in more polymerized tung oil and the scratch is gone.
When restored in this fashion, the N717AP's make a very nice wall phone with all of the attributes of a 302.

Jeff Lamb

Thanks Jeff! I will show this to Jamie.

[Dan/Panther]

Some may think its blasphemy, but we are actually drilling a small hole just above the NE logo on the front to affix the dial. As for wiring, it just takes reworking to get it dialing out. The components in the 717 are quite modern, similar to a 302.

The capacitor is certainly needed if the set is used as intended, but only one half of it is strictly necessary, namely the 2 µF capacitor for blocking DC from the receiver.
The purpose of the 0.5 µF capacitor is for tuning the balance of the anti-sidetone network to the length of the loop. From the factory, I don't think it was even connected to function; the leads were stored on a screw terminal.  But it is conceivable, that it could be used for the ringer as well, when used on common-battery signaling lines. Depending on the exact version of the set, and the year of manufacture, the large capacitor served both functions.   The early sets used different capacitor sizes, 1 µF and 0.6 µF, and in these the 1 µF unit was used as both the ringing capacitor and audio capacitor, just like in 534 subsets of 20+ years earlier.  This is shown in my diagrams of the 1717CG: Northern Electric N1717CG (anti-sidetone local battery magneto wall set)

I was mainly referencing keeping the phone original. Not necessarily functional.

D/P

[Doug Rose]

I was mainly referencing keeping the phone original. Not necessarily functional.

D/P

Dan....I am in total agreement. They all do not have to work, but must keep their originality. This is a magneto phone.


There will be someone who will buy this phone with a dial and think they got a a super rare phone, even though they paid a lot of money .....they got a great phone. The bubble will burst when they are told it is not so.....Doug

[TelePlay]

It really depends on three things, the description used to advertise the phone providing full disclosure, the price then accepted by the buyer if its want they want and the moving of inventory that would never sell in beat up, useless condition.

I have a chance to buy a lot of 27 Leich 901B phones plus parts for or from another 10 to 15 phones. Would never get my costs out of the purchase price even if I moved them all by selling some is original condition or spent the money to buy dials and make them a working phone.

If I had over 75 wood mag phones, some of which were in very bad cosmetic condition and I were in the business of selling anything to the public with full disclosure or disclaimer as what is being purchased, that's there business along with the ever present caveat emptor and with the awareness, it's there  money. The very nice phone above is near museum quality and yes, would be a shame to drill. Something needing wood filler and paint to make it look good, that's a different story. I see both sides.

Anyone want a 901B in barn fresh but not rusted condition?

[Alex G. Bell]

This is a magneto phone.

There will be someone who will buy this phone with a dial and think they got a a super rare phone, even though they paid a lot of money .....they got a great phone. The bubble will burst when they are told it is not so.....Doug

Yes and no.  The AP type was a dial magneto phone.  It used the dial for connections through the exchange and the magneto for calls to other parties on the same line.

So adding a dial to the purely magneto non-AP version is not totally bogus in that it produces an emulation of something which existed in the real world, though I too am opposed to bastardizing examples which are in good condition. 

The other side of it is that selling it to the public in usable form perpetuates it.  Otherwise it goes into a land fill.

[mazda_matt]

Dan....I am in total agreement. They all do not have to work, but must keep their originality. This is a magneto phone.


There will be someone who will buy this phone with a dial and think they got a a super rare phone, even though they paid a lot of money .....they got a great phone. The bubble will burst when they are told it is not so.....Doug

Listing will clearly state this is not in its original configuration and no one will be buying this phone to be a collectible. This is merely a way to re purpose a phone that otherwise wasn't worth much.

Most of our customers are not looking for phones in their original condition. They want functional phones or ones that look like they just came off the line.

-MM
 

[poplar1]

The Northern Electric N717AP thread is here:

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=15719.msg163256#msg163256

[mazda_matt]

The Northern Electric N717AP thread is here:

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=15719.msg163256#msg163256

That's really neat. Thanks for the info, I wasn't aware they ever added dials to the 717's

-MM