I know very little about 3 Slot payphones and the changes made to them over the years. I just dug out two black AE's as a friend was asking if I had one he can put in his booth. This is my opportunity to unload one from my storage and get a few $ for it.
These two each have a date on the back and they are 5-64 and 6-64.
They both have what I would call cast backs rather than stamped steel backs that I have seen on some. Presumably cast backs are older?
They both have the squared off rather than sloped top area of the lower housing...where "Automatic Electric Company" is stamped. A sloped front would be older than these square ones wouldn't it?
Both have "Anti Stuffing Decice" coin returns which presumably was the norm by 1964? I know that some of the open coin returns were later converted to ASD where you pull the handle forward to retrieve the coins. The pictures below show a sloped front on a different phone for comparison.
Someone completely rewired the inside of one if these for home use and it does seem to work. One heck of a mess and I'm not sure why they put a new AE network inside even though it still has its original old network coil inside. I just have to assume the person doing the desire simply knew very little about what they were doing. But...it does work!
One has a LPA 86-10 tag on top (the one with the two coil relay) and the second one is missing its tag.
Terry
Coin relays:
First picture shows what I assume is an updated hopper for use with a newer single coil relay though the relay is missing. This phone looks to have been updated by our shops in 1969 (per a sticker inside) so maybe the hopper and relay were updated then.
Second picture is the older original AE double coil coin relay and a slightly different hopper.
So for AE phones would the second half of the 1960's be around when these newer coils and hoppers arrived on the scene?
Terry
These both have lead chutes. I have heard of lead chutes a lot over the years. Did all 3 slots have lead chutes or did they change to something like cast zinc in later years? If lead chutes are hard to find I can't helping wondering if I should part at least one of these 3 slots out since I am missing various parts in several phones anyway.
Terry
For some reason both of these are missing their contact sets for the switch hook. The one that works has a single contact leaf plus the heavy one that lifts the hook when going off hook. They've used these two as contacts to complete the circuit when off hook but the heavy one is not insulated from the phone housing so one side of the line could be grounded depending where the phone is mounted. CRAPPY job.
Terry
Terry,
I can provide at least some answers:
QuoteThey both have the squared off rather than sloped top area of the lower housing...where "Automatic Electric Company" is stamped. A sloped front would be older than these square ones wouldn't it?
The sloped ones read "Automatic Electric Company Chicago Ill, USA". They moved to Northlake about 1956.
QuoteThese both have lead chutes. Have heard of lead chutes a lot over the years. Did all 3 slots have lead chutes or did they change to something like cast zinc in later years? If lead chutes are hard to find I can't helping wondering if I should part at least one of these out.
As far as I know AE had lead chutes to the very end. They are not as hard to find than WE ones for sure. The one on the picture is for 10 cent (55 at the end of the model number)
More to come, have to do some research first :)
Haf
Phone number 2 that ends with the 702 number is a good phone. I suspect that it was maybe a 60 series A/E which is rare. The relay in this phone is a rare Gray relay pre pay. It would be the phone to concentrate on. I would need to see more pictures but I think you could build a nice rare phone here. I also have any parts to build anything. Jim
Quote from: Haf on December 09, 2017, 04:47:00 PM
Terry,
The sloped ones read "Automatic Electric Company Chicago Ill, USA". They moved to Northlake about 1956.
As far as I know AE had lead chutes to the very end. They are not as hard to find than WE ones for sure. The one on the picture is for 10 cent (55 at the end of the model number)
Haf
I will probably cause confusion here but the third black AE I am looking at (with the sloped front) does say Automatic Electric Company with Chicago Ill USA below. I can't find any dates on this one. The first two with square housings both just say Automatic Electric Company.
So this one may be a bit older than the first two but other possibilities include differences in US made versus Canadian made phones though I am not certain that these from 1964 were actually made in Canada.
Thanks for that info Haf!
Here is a bit more info on the third black phone I am looking at. This one I acquired on eBay from the USA and it was rehabbed by CEAC (Communication Equipment and Contracting Co. Inc) in 1979 according to a sticker inside.
It has the same cast back and Bakelite terminal strip like the first two phones.
This one has the older style hopper but has a Teltronics blue board in the base where the relay would be and a Vane switch in the hopper. It's tag says it is a LPB 86-55 so I am assuming some sort of Prepay Phone?
It has an open bucket rather than an Anti Stuffing Device.
All of these have stamped Coin Guages rather than cast so I assume the Cast Guages are much older.
A couple of pictures of it here.
Terry
Jim,
as far as I know AE discontinued the 60 series in Hartfort, so at least the bottom is more modern (702)
As you metion you have all the parts, you don't have an AE metal dial shroud like in the picture in spare you will part with? Mine from my AE 66C crumbled away over the years.
Haf
Quote from: Payphone installer on December 09, 2017, 05:25:24 PM
Phone number 2 that ends with the 702 number is a good phone. I suspect that it was maybe a 60 series A/E which is rare. The relay in this phone is a rare Gray relay pre pay. It would be the phone to concentrate on. I would need to see more pictures but I think you could build a nice rare phone here. I also have any parts to build anything. Jim
Thanks for this info Jim. I replaced the very first picture of the two phones in the first post with a better one. I also added a picture of the tag to that post as well. It is LPA 86-10.
I had pretty much decided that This is probably the phone to keep and will unload one or the other or both the other two phones. I think these are the only black AE 3 slots that I have but I have a beige Touch Call, a Garnet Red Dial and several more chrome dial three slots. I would like to get down to no more than three or four of these, a chrome, a black, the red and the Beige TC.
I had Paul Vaverchak send me a hook contact set for the red one years ago and now I see I will likely need more.
Terry
Yes Haf I have the shroud ,I have never seen one as bad as the one in your picture. Usually they are broken on the eyelets that hold it on the phone. As for the other A/E payphones in the picture the one with the slant front is most desirable. Most all the parts in the phones are late. The most desirable parts are the Gray pre-pay hopper and the black prepay two coil relay it is Gray. The relay is worth between 250.00-450.00 depending who needs it. Not many Gray prepay relays exist most were post pay. The backboards on both phone are the last ones made everything else except the bottom with the slant front is relatively late. As for the chutes they are the most common out there.
Jim,
QuoteUsually they are broken on the eyelets that hold it on the phone.
It is, the dial is just put in without any screws. Nearly everything inside the shroud holding the dial is crumbled away. If you have it and be willing to sell, please pm me- I would be pleased. Makes this payphone usable again.
Haf
Thanks to you both for the info.
Is the crumbling dial shroud made of plastic or pot metal? I know that the newer style AE shroud is just plastic.
How would a Gray Prepay relay look different from a a postpay relay? This one has 510 stamped on each coil.
Would this relay definitely predate the phone from 1964? Thus it may have been dug up to solve a requirement in the field. Maybe the CO was converted and needed a change to how the payphones operated and relays were sent out that may have been from much older phones that had been parted out by then.
The number card on the phone with the Gray relay indicates it was from Whistler BC / Blackcomb Mountain where the big ski resort is north of Vancouver. I know that Whistler was converted to an AE #2EAX in the late 1970's and then to GTD5 but I don't know what it was converted to a #2 from. BC was typically SxS but it could be that Whistler was served by carrier from somewhat nearby Squamish BC SxS CO. BC Tel seemed to be doing Single Slot conversions from the late 1970's through early to mid 1980's.
Is there variation in the hoppers as well beyond the two distinctly different ones I have, one being cast and the other looks to be stamped metal. The one you are identifying as a Gray hopper is the one with the Gray relay?
I was leaning towards selling the older one with sloped front to my friend for his outdoor booth. It has been powder coated likely when it was refurbished by CEAC and it doesn't look nearly as nice as the other two with their original paint. Plus it being a post pay with a blue board makes me lose more interest in it. I am assuming the sloped front us just a little more desirable since it is a little bit older, not worth a lot more than the newer housings.
Thanks for taking the time to read and comment!
Terry
Quote from: AE_Collector on December 09, 2017, 06:08:41 PM
It has the same cast back and Bakelite terminal strip like the first two phones.
Do you mean aluminum? Not cast iron?
Quote from: AE_Collector on December 09, 2017, 06:08:41 PM
This one has the older style hopper but has a Teltronics blue board in the base where the relay would be and a Vane switch in the hopper. It’s tag says it is a LPB 86-55 so I am assuming some sort of Prepay Phone?
LPB 86-55 is semi-postpay. Coins fall directly into the vault, rather than being held in escrow until collected or refunded at the end of the call.
Quote from: poplar1 on December 10, 2017, 03:58:27 PM
Do you mean aluminum? Not cast iron?
Yes I assume a cast ALUMINUM back but will check that.
Quote from: poplar1 on December 10, 2017, 03:58:27 PM
LPB 86-55 is semi-postpay. Coins fall directly into the vault, rather than being held in escrow until collected or refunded at the end of the call.
I meant to say a Post Pay, not Prepay. While I have heard of a Semi Postpay as well...is that only an AE Phone Option, how does it vary from normal Postpay? Either type you drop in a coin upon answer to activate the transmitter but variations on LD or operator calls between the two?
So both phones that have tags on them say they are 86's including the one with the Gray two coil coin relay. Would this relay NOT be for Semi Postpay Service? The phone could have been converted in the field without a number plate change.
Is the A and the B (and I have seen C as well) of LPA and LPB pretty much an indicator of age or something else? The 1964 Phone has LPA tag.
Terry
Haf message me personally about the shroud. The post pay set was made by A/E,W/E and N/E the relay in all of them just simply identified the coin on deposit,all money went in the box period. Pre-pay gave the option to collect or return. The prepaid relay is easy to identify because it has a lever to move the coin gate and release the trap. Since A/E serviced independent companies they produced way more post pay sets. The small companies did not spend the big bucks on the new central office features. Post pay serivice was simple and easy.
Payphones are fascinating, maybe especially the North American 3 slot phones. This thread shows me the need of a book about North American 3 slot phones and their technical solutions. (Haf; you may be the writer?)
So far this thread is the best we have, and I want to say thank you all far all that information!
Please correct me if I am wrong or you disagree.
OK even the extremely rare wooden payphones are of great interest, but when it comes to rotary It looks like Gray "invented" the 3 slot pretty vandal resistant nice looking telephone with a system for recognizing the coins by sound signals.
Compared to European square boxes the 3-slotter are nicely designed, and smaller. The validators was so well designed so they survived for decades! And even pretty early the prepay with coin return was an option. In Norway the payphones with coin return needed 2 pairs until lat 1960'ies.
dsk
LPC seris sets had a cast zinc or Alimunum back board. A terminal block with bo fingers was used and an amphonal connector was used to connect the upper housing..The LPC backboard also has a slot under the terminal strip
And the two coil relay is a Gray and worth a wad.
What design of the handset was the standard on the AE-3slotter in the year of???he design of the 3 slot phones are so old that the plastic handset probably are the latest. Should it be an other on this? (An of-course not a coiled cord.)
(http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=159587;image)
Basic design was 1912 - 1972.
Later AE had same handset as AE 80 and AE 90
I have an AE82 payphone that is complete with an older 2 coil coin relay. I get dial tone and the transmitter and receiver are working, but I am unable to break dial tone. I would like this to work like a regular telephone.
I've tried shorting the upper housing relay and still unable to break dial tone. I also swapped out the dial just in case there was a problem, but still unable to break dial tone.
Can anyone help solve this??
First - Welcome to the forum! Can post some pictures of your payphone, insides & out. We are a very visual group here. We do have an in house payphone expert who will likely chime in but pictures would be helpful.
There are two switches in your phone that are designed to prevent dialing. The first one is a set of contacts on the coin relay. Those contacts short the pulsing contacts of the dial.They are there to prevent toll fraud. Those contacts open and allow dialing if the coin trigger has been hit by a deposit of a coin. The second switch is in the top of the phone. It counts nickels. It's the gold colored assembly with the arm and the spring wire. Lift the spring wire out of the groove in the arm. The arm will flip up and the micro switch will open and take the second short off of the pulsing contacts. With both switches open your dial should now work.