AE help needed: I am stuck, really!

[Phonesrfun]

Jorge:

I don't know the story about whether it was cheaper or why they originally did it, or why they discontinued.

Terry:

I have only heard of them being used in the handset like the one Jorge has.  I did not know they used them in operator headsets, but why not?  I have not heard much or seen much in writing about AE switchboard articles.

[AE_Collector]

I have only heard of them being used in the handset like the one Jorge has.  I did not know they used them in operator headsets, but why not?  I have not heard much or seen much in writing about AE switchboard articles.

Did I say something about "operator headsets" or is one of us not understanding the other?

I meant to say that I always assumed that AE phones equipped with the induction coil handsets were a less expensive set to manufacture and likely also a less efficient phone on long circuits. AE manufactured them primarily for use as PBX/PABX stations since the length of the circuit was not an issue and calling outside of the PBX would be done on trunk circuits which probably also made the design of these phones a non isssue.

Telco's were probably not interested in this type of circuit on the phones but on PBX's it would be okay. Some areas had privately owned PABX's many years ago so a less expensive phone might have helped AE get the contract to supply the complete PABX with phones.

Again, I haven't read this anywhere, I just assumed this might be the explanation for this type of phone/circuit.

Terry

[JorgeAmely]

Terry:

Don't PBX's and CO's have more or less the same electrical characteristics? Battery around ~48 Vdc, ringing voltage around 90 Vac @20 Hz?

Does that mean I cannot safely connect my style of phone to a CO line? Should I do it through my Panasonic PBX instead?

Inquiring minds want to know ... 

[Phonesrfun]

It should be just fine.  Your land line should be about 48 volts if your land line comes from a CO.  The Panasonic is about 24 volts.  Either way, the phone should draw about 25-35 mA (or somewhere around there) and drop the supply voltage across the phone to about 6-10 volts. That is all pretty safe.

[AE_Collector]

Yes, like Bill said, it should be fine. A less efficient phone on a long loop from the CO would be more likely to have low transmission levels and possibly some of the characteristics of a phone without a network IE: very quiet receive levels where as your own voice is quite loud in your reciever.

Problems with inefficent phones or phones without a network would not be readily apparent on very short loops from the CO or on PBX's only becasue PBX's are almost always going to be similar to very short CO loops.

Terry

[Phonesrfun]

Did I say something about "operator headsets" or is one of us not understanding the other?

I meant to say that I always assumed that AE phones equipped with the induction coil handsets were a less expensive set to manufacture and likely also a less efficient phone on long circuits. AE manufactured them primarily for use as PBX/PABX stations since the length of the circuit was not an issue and calling outside of the PBX would be done on trunk circuits which probably also made the design of these phones a non isssue.

Telco's were probably not interested in this type of circuit on the phones but on PBX's it would be okay. Some areas had privately owned PABX's many years ago so a less expensive phone might have helped AE get the contract to supply the complete PABX with phones.

Again, I haven't read this anywhere, I just assumed this might be the explanation for this type of phone/circuit.

Terry

Terry:

I am famous for mis-reading things.  oops.

[JorgeAmely]

Terry, Bill:

Interesting comments.

Would it be safe to assume that this phone probably was used in an office building (serviced by a PBX) rather than in a private home, where it would be connected to a CO?

[Phonesrfun]

Terry, Bill:

Interesting comments.

Would it be safe to assume that this phone probably was used in an office building (serviced by a PBX) rather than in a private home, where it would be connected to a CO?

I don't know for sure, but based on what Terry says and what Ralph Meyer's book says, I would say yes.  The voltage of a PBX versus a CO would not be the issue; it would be the loop length (resistance) which would cause poor transmission on longer loops.

Terry and/or Donna:

Are loop lengths these days pretty short as compared with years ago?  Since there are all these cabinets out there in the street providing battery, it seems to me that the "battery" has gotten closer to the subscribers.  Would this be a true statement?

[JorgeAmely]

Stub:

        The AE Catalog 4055-C June 1940 , pg. 13 says you could get the 1A with either  induction coil receiver or induction coil in subset. AE Catalog 4055 June  1934, pg 6 ,says that the induction  coil receiver made that phone a 11-A" The Type 11-A desk stand is equipped with an induction-coil receiver, and can be used with any conventional ringer box which contains a 1 mf. or 2 mf. condenser."  Your phone is a AE 1A with the correct  ringer box.
       The 34A3 came with induction coil receiver and a 205 ohm resistor  and it also came with  a #D-282155-A induction coil in the base of phone. So I guess there are no frankenphones here.     stub

Does you catalog mention something about model ZL-243-A0

[stub]

Jorge ,
              Mine only goes from L-220-AO thru L-225- AO. All of mine work just fine on POTS line.     stub

[AE_Collector]

Terry and/or Donna:

Are loop lengths these days pretty short as compared with years ago?  Since there are all these cabinets out there in the street providing battery, it seems to me that the "battery" has gotten closer to the subscribers.  Would this be a true statement?

I would say that statement is generally true. See what Donna thinks as well.

The total area served by telephone hasn't expanded nearly as much as the total number of telephone subscribers has in the last 40 - 50 years. Since digital switching arrived there are now remotes everywhere thus saving on the cost of copper circuits back to the CO. The expansion is out (and up) from the city centre where the CO's were originally built so without remotes and/or additional new CO's, the loop lengths would have been contiunually getting longer.

There are still long loops out there but not nearly the percentage that there used to be.

Bill - 1
Long Loops - 0

Terry

[JorgeAmely]

I tested the AE34 with the induction coil receiver and noticed very little side-tone. Perhaps too little. The closest thing to a central office is a small building to where all phone lines from our development go to. It is less than half a mile away.

Other than that, I could hear well and the other person could hear me well also. I recruited Dennis to be that person.

Most of the patent numbers stamped on the bottom of the base are to protect the features of the dial and the hook switch.

Patent # 1687695 describes in detail the induction coil receiver.  I attached a copy to this post.

[JorgeAmely]

Hello fellow phon-AE-holics:

Thanks to all who helped with the stuck caps and in figuring out the internal circuitry of this phone. Here are some pictures of the finished product. No gold trim in this one, but it looks pretty good.

In this album you can see more details of the induction coil in the receiver design, the 200 Ohm resistor and the big 1 microfarad ringing capacitor.

http://picasaweb.google.com/Amelyenator/AutomaticElectricModelAE34A3Telephone#

I have used it for a day already in a POTS line and can't tell the difference when compared to a standard AE40 or AE80.

[Dan/Panther]

Jorge;
A gorgeous phone. You outdid yourself..
D/P

[Dennis Markham]

Beautiful, Jorge!  What a nice looking telephone.  Great work!