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Helsby (H.07) Candlestick

Started by FABphones, November 21, 2020, 04:34:23 PM

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FABphones

Does anyone know anything about this perch marking H.07?

(no images available at time of posting)

A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
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Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
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Jack Ryan

Well, there is no context - neither the rest of the phone nor the country but...

Helsby made a phone with a perch similar to that - perhaps it is H 07 - Helsby, 1907.

Jack

FABphones

Next project on the workbench is this Candlestick. Marked to rear of perch:  H.07

Appears to have been heavily painted in gloss, with a worn purple fabric baseplate cover. Trumpet mouthpiece broken, missing receiver.

I'd like to know more about this model and see what it would have looked like originally so I can restore sympathetically. Guessing the high gloss purple combo needs to go...

Additional images of this model would help enormously if anyone could please add.

 :)
A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

FABphones

Spent some time today doing a little more investigating. I discovered that until it came to me, this phone spent all of its time just a few miles down the road from the British Insulated Helsby Cable Company, UK. It is indeed a Helsby telephone.

Online references say it was made by Western Electric (first used by the National Telephone Company).

Assembly was at Helsby:
...Rather than build their own phones completely, they seem to have bought in Western Electric phones and parts initially. A typical early phone will be standard Western Electric, but will carry at least one branded BI&H part as well as BIH circuit diagrams inside the case and bellbox.

Looking at the attached image, it appears the full gloss finish may be original.

There is a circlip for attaching a cover to baseplate. I have leather or suede, in brown or black to replace the purple with something more suitable.

Helsby history:
http://www.telephonecollecting.org/Bobs%20phones/Pages/BI&H/History.htm

Image of similar (No2) telephone for comparison:
http://www.museumoftechnology.org.uk/objects/_expand.php?key=60

If this phone was made using Western Electric parts, should it have a Western Electric receiver, or a British receiver, as per the attached image below?

A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

FABphones

The fabric baseplate cover was stiffly adhered inside the circlip with what appeared to be a wood glue. Now removed, a replacement cover in keeping needs to be added.

I'm throwing this one out for opinion from fellow CRPF members  :) :

Replacement baseplate cover -
Suede or leather?
Brown or Black?
Other?
A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

RDPipes

I haven't the first clue as to what was original on these but, if it where mine I'd go with brown suede.

FABphones

Also:

Unable to find any images of this telephone, further work will need to progress using research so far. Due to the scarceness of this model I will have to use the oldest replacement receiver I can find which is in keeping with the phones history (as currently known).

There are earlier models of receiver which may well have been on this phone, sadly, each of which I am unlikely to find anytime soon.

Did Helsby assemble these using a WE receiver or a British receiver - their ...one branded BI&H part?
At this time I can find no confirmation as to which.

So meantime - which receiver to use:
WE?
British Receiver Bell 1A?

Images attached showing rear of phone, how each of the two choices of receiver fits into the switch hook.

Again, opinions as to which might be the more correct please....

 :)
A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

FABphones


I can find no image of this model phone but did find an image of a predecessor which shows a 1A style Bell Receiver. So based on that and the following information (links attached), a Bell Receiver 1A has been added. A NOS cord, still with it's manufacturers label, was in my cords bin. I also found an identical Bakelite mouthpiece for this phone in good condition so was able to swap out the broken one. Will add brown suede ( which has been packed safely away in that can't remember place  ;D   ) to the base.

"... bell receiver introduced in Britain to meet British Post Office specifications for their pulpit-style Western Electric-based standard wall phones".
http://www.telephonecollecting.org/Bobs%20phones/Pages/SwedEricsson/EricssonReceiversandHandsets.htm

"In Britain, The Telephone Company in London represented Bell's interests and held their patents. In 1880 it amalgamated with another company representing rival inventor Thomas Edison, and formed the United Telephone Company.

United in turn formed a new company, Consolidated Telephone Construction and Maintenance Ltd, to produce Bell-type phones for the United, and Gower-Bell phones for overseas and British Post Office sales. This company also produced a small range of modified Bell phones for local use.
These phones are usually incorrectly identified as Western Electric because of their internal parts.

Documentation is poor and few of their phones have survived, so it is often difficult to assign a phone to BTMC Antwerp, Consolidated, or Western Electric's later British factory.

The United eventually became the National Telephone Company, and still bought Bell and Consolidated phones.

... In 1903 the National Telephone Company stopped buying WE phones and signed contracts with L M Ericsson instead. The Bell patents they administered had expired so they were now free to do so. The new Western Electric factory at Woolwich, bought on 1st January 1898 to replace an earlier and smaller factory set up in 1883, concentrated on supplying phones, cable and switchboards to the British Post Office".
http://www.telephonecollecting.org/Bobs%20phones/Pages/Bell_WE_files/BellWEHistory.htm
A collector of  'Monochrome Phones with Sepia Tones'   ...and a Duck!
***********
Vintage Phones - 10% man made, 90% Tribble
*************

Sargeguy

If this was an American phone I'd go with brown felted wool (pool table felt), or suede.  the suede has to be really thin though.
Greg Sargeant
Providence, RI
TCI /ATCA #4409

Etienne

I agree with your choice about the brown suede. If you put brown cords on it, the most appropriate base colour probably is brown. I'd say felted wool rather than leather as it is what was used in France, but for a British-American phone I have no idea of what was really original. Using what would have been used (easily affordable) as a replacement in the UK seems to be the most reasonable. After all, these covers did worn out.