Author Topic: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems  (Read 3276 times)

Offline Matilo Telephones

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2014, 02:52:16 PM »
Kenton, I do not see the diode across the coil, on the right.

I checked one of my phones. It doesn´t pop. It does have a diode.

Please see my pic. Different coil, but the idea is the same.

Groeten,

Arwin

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Offline dsk

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #16 on: January 19, 2014, 03:10:03 PM »
If I guess right, your dial should look like this in rest position.

I have marked the spring stopping the pulse wheel in right position before when it returns after the last break.
The P indicates the pulse contacts, these shall open 10 times when dialing 0 (when the dial returns)
The other N.C. contacts should be closed at rest position, but open when the dial are moved slightly out of rest position.

dsk

Offline LarryInMichigan

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #17 on: January 19, 2014, 04:58:35 PM »
I just opened my phone, and it has a coil which looks likes the one in Kenton's pictures.  There is no varistor or diode.  I took a couple of germanium diodes I had lying around and connected them in parallel with the receiver on terminals 6 and 7.  The 'popping' sound has been greatly reduced.

Larry

Offline Matilo Telephones

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2014, 05:07:06 PM »
That is weird. I´ve had literally dozens of them, refurbished them. None were missing the diode and none were making loud popping noises. And now 2 across the pond.

Well could be coincidence. Perhaps someone removed them.
Groeten,

Arwin

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Offline LarryInMichigan

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2014, 05:09:57 PM »
Mine has the white "Made in Holland" sticker on the bottom which was probably added so that the phone could be sold by Radio Shack in the USA.  Kenton's was probably also imported by Tandy Corp. and sold by Radio Shack.  Perhaps the diodes were removed when they were prepared for export.

Larry

unbeldi

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2014, 09:51:33 PM »
I like these phones a lot.... but they don't seem to score any brownie points on the FOTM competition, no matter how mint they are.

Still, none of mine make any clicking sounds.
There must be something wrong if one does.  Perhaps people thought they can stick their screwdrivers into them because they were sold at Radio Shack, LOL.

unbeldi

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2014, 09:56:39 PM »
Since this topic appeared earlier in this thread, the REN value I have measured for my units is 2.2, quite high for a 'modern' instrument like this.

I guess the Bat Mobiles needed a little more power to get going...

Offline Kenton K

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2014, 11:09:40 PM »
Yes, these batmobiles certainly use a lot of juice! I also tried hooking it up to the main line and it would not ring because I had 4 other telephones on the line!

And my telephone does have the made in Holland sticker, so a radio shack phone. So possibly the varistors were absent from radio shack phones?

I have since attached 2 diodes to the receiver terminals and the clicking has been softened a bit. Still loud, but not unbearable.  I then tested the phone with a 500 U type receiver (with a varistor) and the pops were not at all bothersome. So the solution to the problem is to find a u1/3 varistor.

Thanks everybody for your help!

unbeldi

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2014, 11:20:50 PM »
In this thread I presented an essentially mint unit of this model only a couple of months ago:
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=10534.msg111923#msg111923

We believe, that that phone was probably among the last ever manufactured of these in late 1970.
Indications from primary sources tell that the model line was discontinued by the end of 1970.

My presentation has an inside picture of the components.

As the picture shows, mine has the semiconductor device on the induction coil across the receiver. Whether this is a varistor, or a package of back-to-back parallel diodes isn't clear and I haven't examined the part at all.


« Last Edit: January 19, 2014, 11:30:04 PM by unbeldi »

Offline poplar1

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2014, 11:26:37 PM »
I cant really see what components missing, but I don't have the Heefmaf myselves.
When you have got it ringing and working OK else, it would be interesting to hear about the clicks, I may guess it is as Larry says.
I did never pay attention to those sounds before I got some American phones to play with. They are just better on those ant click and anti tinkling solutions.  ;D

dsk

dsk, would you please give your opinion of why receiver clicks (when hanging up and when dialing) and ring tap were not considered a problem.

Also, why low impedance ringers continued to be used in Europe long after they were discontinued here. In your country, did they wire extension ringers in series with the main station? Were even modern ringers low impedance? What about currently produced phones with electronic ringers---how does the REN compare with the REN of North American electronic ringers?
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

unbeldi

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2014, 11:32:47 PM »
how does the REN compare with the REN of North American electronic ringers?

All good questions....   but this one needs to consider that REN values were measured differently in various countries, so one can only compare actual impedances in ohms.

Offline poplar1

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2014, 12:29:11 AM »
how does the REN compare with the REN of North American electronic ringers?

All good questions....   but this one needs to consider that REN values were measured differently in various countries, so one can only compare actual impedances in ohms.

Like the shirt sizes--XL, TG, 42, 52? I guess I'm just interested in how many phones of any given type will ring on a station port of a Panasonic 616, if you have a shelf full of all types to choose from. While I know you can't have as many WE 8A ringers (534A subset) as WE B1A ringers (302) on a given port, I wanted to compare how many WE 2500MMGBs (electronic ringers) vs. European electronic ringers.
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline dsk

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2014, 12:39:56 AM »
I cant really see what components missing, but I don't have the Heefmaf myselves.
When you have got it ringing and working OK else, it would be interesting to hear about the clicks, I may guess it is as Larry says.
I did never pay attention to those sounds before I got some American phones to play with. They are just better on those ant click and anti tinkling solutions.  ;D

dsk

dsk, would you please give your opinion of why receiver clicks (when hanging up and when dialing) and ring tap were not considered a problem.

Also, why low impedance ringers continued to be used in Europe long after they were discontinued here. In your country, did they wire extension ringers in series with the main station? Were even modern ringers low impedance? What about currently produced phones with electronic ringers---how does the REN compare with the REN of North American electronic ringers?

More or less a way of thinking.
The phone was a rough tool, and you did not have a choice. If you want a phone you took whats installed, usually one, and the next was expensive. A maximum of 2 here!
Than its no need of more expensive ringers.
"All" automatic lines was for one subscriber each.

The REN measuring was never an issue here, so my measuring as described in another thread are made with a ringer from a 500 to compare with 0.9?? REN.

dsk

Offline poplar1

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #28 on: January 20, 2014, 12:58:45 AM »
dsk, so if I understand you, it is less expensive to manufacture low impedance ringers, and the automatic exchanges never had party lines, so the lines were never heavily loaded with multiple ringers on the same line.

Thanks to you and unbeldi, I now realize that I shouldn't use "REN" even though I'm trying to determine how many electronic ringers can be rung simultaneously, as currently manufactured in both countries.

Extensions here were expensive but not prohibitively. In the 1950s a 1FR (single party, flat rate, residential)line cost about $6.00 per month, with one phone included in the monthly line rate, and an extension was $1.50 per month. You can still lease a WE phone for about $5 per month and a flat rate residential line here is now about $40 per month including all the junk fees and taxes.

« Last Edit: January 20, 2014, 01:02:03 AM by poplar1 »
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline Matilo Telephones

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Re: Help!- Heefmaf PPT Dialing Pops and Ringing Problems
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2014, 01:54:53 AM »
Partylines with frequency ringing was unknown here. Holland is a small country and very densely populated. Party lines is a solution I think more fore sparcely populated areas with long dinstances to cover.

Enen into the 70ies a subscription was quite expensive and having an extention even more.

In the 50ies and 60ies you could have a white Phone instead of a black one. That would cost you 50 euro (100 guilders) wich was a huge amout of money in those days.
Groeten,

Arwin

Check out my telephone website: http://www.matilo.eu/?lang=en

And I am on facebook too: www.facebook.com/matilosvintagetelephones