Author Topic: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?  (Read 4492 times)

Offline BDM

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2014, 10:48:33 PM »
Enjoy

--Brian--

St Clair Shores, MI

Offline Scotophor

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2014, 12:49:14 AM »
TelePlay, you do realize that the bid lists you've posted are showing all of the automatic bids made by eBay's system, right? That's why some of the stars are gray, and several groups of bids are shown as occurring at the exact same time down to the second. If you want to see what bids a person actually placed (either manually or by using some 3rd-party software or service), you need to change the display option to the "normal" bid history list.
Name: A.J.   Location: LAPNCAXG, EDgewood 6

Offline TelePlay

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2014, 07:34:06 AM »
Yes, I did know that decided to include the auto bids to show how the top bid was exposed. I thought seeing all the data was preferable to seeing just the "new" high bid to see how it was reached. Are you saying that if a top bidder is in at $100 with the top bid at $10, then someone bidding $110 will force eBay to increase the bids by minimum steps until the top bid is exceeded and the top bid then sitting at $102.50?

That was certainly not the case in the current Auction  #116 where the top bid jumped hundreds with only one automatic bid shown. Are you saying the bidder used an automatic bid program/service to place a higher bid and it did the minimum while the #116 phone saw a person placing a higher bid manually causing only one hidden bid to show?

Is that how the auto-bidding software (including eBay's auto bid option) work? I so rarely see this, I think 4 times now in the past 4 or 5 months of the auctions of interest that I have been watching, but it becomes so obvious when the number of bids placed jumps from 3 or 4 to 15 to 20 with only one new bidder joining the auction. Is it the eBay auto bid software which is then too stupid to just jump to the current maximum doing this? The 3rd party bid sniping software would seem to only do this at the last second but that does not make sense for time would run out before the top bid is reached if using those programs.

I will post the "normal" bid lists "without" the hidden bids along with what I already posted tonight when I get home from work and have time to do that. That will then show all the
« Last Edit: April 02, 2014, 07:35:44 AM by TelePlay »

Offline TelePlay

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2014, 09:36:04 PM »
So here is the bid history for the blue 302 now up as Auction Contest 116. Large bid jumps but with only one automatic bid per jump, not a series of consecutive minimum bids until the high bid is surpassed, exposed.

So, the question remains how does the consecutive almost instant minimum bid increases come to be? Is it eBay software, third party software or manual entry, pushing the one click button constantly until the top bid is exposed?

We're getting in the weeds here and this really has nothing to do with phones but having to run the auction contests and seeing this on contest, and other listed phones, got my curiosity up, that's all. Would just like to know how this happens.

Offline Scotophor

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2014, 03:17:17 AM »
OK, in your latest post, notice that the bids are shown in descending order by amount. Now look in the Bid Time column and notice that the times are out of order. If you sort them by time, you will then get a clearer picture of how the bids proceeded and why a particular amount was shown as "current" at any particular time.

Here's how bidding went (dates omitted since all are on the same day):
seller:  $74.99 at 10:39:31 (starting amount)
u***d: bid $100.00 at 11:03:15, current displayed amount still $74.99 (u***d) since this was 1st bid
e***r: bid $1,165.00 at 11:04:25, current displayed amount $102.50 (e***r)
d***s: bid $1,725.00 (OR HIGHER) at 11:07:48, current displayed amount $1,190.00 (d***s)
i***n: bid $1,543.00 at 22:44:07, current displayed amount $1,568.00 (d***s)
i***n: bid $1,700.00 at 22:44:15, current displayed amount $1,725.00 (d***s)

If you view this bid history with all automatic bids shown, there will be a lot of eBay's automatic bids placed at the same time as each of these bids except the first. Yes, those automatic bids will each be one minimum increment at a time, except in the case where someone bids an amount that doesn't fall in step with the increments. For example, if an item starts at $1.00, bidder #1 bids $101.43, and then bidder #2 bids $150.00, the current amount shown will be $101.43 + $2.50 = $103.93. I believe it will be the last automatic bid that is the odd amount; an automatic bid of $102.50 will come before it but since that isn't at least $2.50 above $101.43, the minimum increment is then added to that figure to give the resulting "current" amount.

I imagine that d***s may have been surprised when he placed his bid, to see the current high bid amount jump from $102.50 to $1,190.00, but that's how automatic bidding works.

Also, notice what happened with bidder i***n: he placed a bid, saw that he was not the high bidder, then placed another, higher bid. If the auction ends with no further bids, that second bid by i***n will have cost d***s an additional $157 that he might not have had to pay, if he had waited until the final seconds to place his bid (so that i***n would not have time to place another, higher bid).
« Last Edit: April 03, 2014, 03:40:56 AM by Scotophor »
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Offline TelePlay

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #20 on: April 03, 2014, 07:03:37 AM »
Yes, you are correct. That is what happens when a bidder puts in an early high bid and others slowly catch up to it until surpassed over time. But that doesn't answer the question of why some auctions see 15 or so minimum automatic bids placed within a second or two (as shown in the first two bid list images but not the third) in some cases and not in others. Could it be that when someone uses the "Automatic Bid" option offered in some auctions (and that must be a choice of the seller when listing an item to allow or not allow these minimum automatic bids because this box, shown below, doesn't appear in all auctions) that cause eBay to fill in minimum bids until the amount entered by a bidder is reached?

The remaining question is how does it come to be that in some auctions, multiple minimum bids show up from one bidder and in others, the bid jumps up to the current high bid without all of the minimum bids being placed.

Offline Scotophor

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Re: Ok A.E. Monophone experts, what is it?
« Reply #21 on: April 04, 2014, 02:05:50 AM »
I'm not sure of the answers to those questions. I haven't ever used the second option shown in your latest image. I believe it may work like so, but of course eBay has the final word {clicking that little "(i)" icon should give you the official explanation for it}:

Say the displayed current bid amount is $100.00, with the current high bidder's actual maximum bid amount being $110.00. If you place a normal bid of $120.00, the current displayed bid amount will be $112.50. Then if someone else places a normal bid of $130.00, the current displayed bid will be $122.50.

But if you instead use the second option to bid $120.00, eBay will place individual minimum increment bids one at a time until either your entered amount is reached OR you become the high bidder. Your entry of $120 results in bids on your behalf of $102.50 (resulting in the displayed high bid changing to $105.00 with no change to who has the high bid), $107.50 (displayed hi $110.00) and $112.50 (displayed hi $112.50 and now you are the hi bidder). At this point the automatic bidding STOPS, and the system forgets the $120.00 amount you entered. Now you are the current high bidder, but if anyone else comes along and places any acceptable bid you will no longer be the high bidder, and the displayed hi bid amount will change to $115.00.



I can't think of any advantage to a bidder from using this second method. The only reason I can think of for this to exist is for eBay to get more bids from: (A) people who don't understand or trust the regular proxy bidding system, and (B) "sheeple" who are unable to decide on their own what is a reasonable maximum to enter for a proxy bid, but prefer to gradually approach the current leader's high bid until they either lose their nerve or beat it, then if they get the hi bid, make one final normal proxy bid to add what they think is a reasonable margin to protect it. A lot of bidders seem to operate like this. IMO, they're pathetic. Sniping beats them most of the time, as long as nobody has placed an early stupid-high proxy bid.

Ebay must have reason to believe this alternate bidding method will increase the average final prices of items, or they wouldn't have spent the money to develop and implement it. Perhaps it does.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2014, 02:11:13 AM by Scotophor »
Name: A.J.   Location: LAPNCAXG, EDgewood 6