Author Topic: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial  (Read 2761 times)

Offline persido

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1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« on: August 13, 2015, 12:40:00 PM »
Came across this metal 302, the date 1940 is on all parts, except for the 4H dial,  I think the date on it is 1931, see picture below. the phone looks all original.
My question is, would the phone company or Western Electric use a 4H dial on a telephone produced in 1940?

Thanks....Scot

unbeldi

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2015, 01:23:04 PM »
Came across this metal 302, the date 1940 is on all parts, except for the 4H dial,  I think the date on it is 1931, see picture below. the phone looks all original.
My question is, would the phone company or Western Electric use a 4H dial on a telephone produced in 1940?

Thanks....Scot
Not at the factory, no.
But during refurbishing they would use whatever had been refurbished to proper specifications.
Looks like the dial was installed with some kind glue or epoxy or something that melted very easily.
It oozed out around the dial.


Offline Fabius

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2015, 04:52:15 PM »
Take the 1931 4H dial out to use on a earlier type dial phone and replace it with a 1940 5H.
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Offline poplar1

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2015, 04:56:38 PM »
That's not glue, just a melted 59A dial adapter.
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

unbeldi

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2015, 05:08:35 PM »
That's not glue, just a melted 59A dial adapter.

That was my initial thought too, but how would it get that hot and still look fairly nice.   Have you seen this before, and does the brown rubber of the early 59A really have such a low melting point?
I looked up the melting point of rubber and found it typically is somewhere close to 200ºC, but I suppose this can vary greatly.

« Last Edit: August 13, 2015, 05:18:16 PM by unbeldi »

Offline Ktownphoneco

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2015, 06:17:28 PM »
I tend to lean towards the glue or epoxy theory, especially considering that it's not all that likely that a 1931 4H dial would end up in a 1940 telephone.    Which tends to suggest someone has played with the set.     However, even though the wires, the set and the dial itself appear to be in fairly nice condition, and any exposure to a prolonged heat source, hot enough to melt rubber, would probably do significant damage to the aforementioned components, but I'm wondering if the set, through it's connection to overhead wires, was hit by lightening.       
A 1940 telephone set would probably be using ground ringing, which in most cases would mean the set's circuitry would be connected directly to a ground rod outside the customers premises, or an iron pipe running through the ground to a city watermain.     
A lightening strike produces a lot of heat, but is of short duration, unlike a house fire.      Heating is quick, followed by an immediate cooling off period.     Telephone line lightning arrestors didn't offer 100% protection in all cases.

I'm not suggesting a positive answer to a specific theory, just stating a possibility.   

Jeff Lamb

 

Offline andre_janew

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2015, 07:51:28 PM »
I've heard that the older phones are capable of surviving a lightning strike.  This phone has been around for 75 years, so it may have been hit by lightning at some point.  Of course, nobody would know that for sure except for the customer who had the phone after the 4H dial was put on it. 

Online Doug Rose

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2015, 07:54:21 PM »
I agree with David....I think the gasket has melted. I have found them inside 302s before looking very similar....Doug
Kidphone

Offline Ktownphoneco

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2015, 08:02:06 PM »
If the set was hit by a lightening strike via the overhead telephone line, it could account for the fact that the dial that the set was was most likely equipped with from the factory, a 5H, was damaged and removed, and replaced with another dial.

Jeff Lamb



Offline andre_janew

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2015, 08:15:00 PM »
If that were the case, then there should be a complete gasket there in addition to the melted one.  Right?

Offline tallguy58

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2015, 07:08:34 AM »
Not so much melted from heat as from chemical decomposition.
Cheers........Bill

Offline Ktownphoneco

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2015, 09:43:03 AM »
A lightening strike on the line is not necessarily the case, only a suggested possibility.    But if in fact that was the case, the presence of a second gasket would depend on several  things.     If the existing gasket didn't bond to the dial, the original dial could have been removed, leaving what's left of a gasket as indicated in the picture.    If that is what's left of the original rubber gasket, it may have been too difficult to remove and whoever replaced the dial, decided just to leave what was left of it in place, and installed the 4H dial.
I can see enough of the remnants of  2 out of the 3 rubber hole grommets to know that at least part of the original rubber gasket is still present.   If the current dial can be removed so that the entire dial cavity of the housing can be seen, it would go a long way in determining whether or not it's a case of a melted rubber gasket, or some sort of glue, or rubberized gasket material out of a tube.    Personally, I'd remove the dial and carefully remove whatever that material is, and install a replacement gasket.      If the induction coil is original to the set, and is undamaged, it would most likely rule out a lightening strike, or a telephone line knocked down and coming into contact with hydro lines.    Personally, I'd remove the dial and carefully remove whatever that material is, and install a replacement gasket.    But as far as what the material is in the picture, I wouldn't rule out any option at this point.

Jeff Lamb   

Offline baldopeacock

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2015, 10:43:11 AM »
Not so much melted from heat as from chemical decomposition.

Good call.

Offline persido

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2015, 12:48:39 PM »
I took the dial out, it's a melted gasket, I thought it was going to be difficult, but it just popped right out, the gasket was very brittle and just fell apart.

Scot

Offline DavePEI

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Re: 1940 302 w/ 4H dial
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2015, 06:29:20 AM »
That's not glue, just a melted 59A dial adapter.
That's what you get for speed dialing  ;)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2015, 06:31:37 AM by DavePEI »
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