Author Topic: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate  (Read 4160 times)

Offline Fabius

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AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« on: October 24, 2016, 03:40:08 PM »
Came across this in a local antique shop. At first I thought it was a typical AE40 but then I noticed that though the handset looked like the regular one for this model it had the "spit cup". Also the set had a cloth cover on the bottom. The cover is well fitted to the bottom plate and has a AE tag on it. The cover is slotted for all of the screw locations. Finally the handset cord is the braded type. Is this factory done? If so is it scarce?
Tom Vaughn
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Offline paul-f

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2016, 06:05:46 PM »
The handset is probably a AF-55.

Search the TCI Library for "AE Type 38 & 41 Handsets" in quotes to see the catalog page.

There's also a related discussion here:

   http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=14514.msg150944#msg150944

I have also run across fabric-covered bottom plates on early AE40s.
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Offline Fabius

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2016, 06:37:26 PM »
The handset is probably a AF-55.

I have also run across fabric-covered bottom plates on early AE40s.

Thanks for the information. After reading the info in the library I believe you are right about the handset being a AF-55.

Is there any documentation on fabric covered bottom plates?
Tom Vaughn
La Porte, Indiana
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Offline Jack Ryan

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2016, 07:01:33 PM »
Is there any documentation on fabric covered bottom plates?

I haven't seen any documentation but a lot of AE 40s were used in Australia by the military (but I don't think they were military phones) during WW2 - they all had cloth bases and no rubber. They had standard Type 41 handsets.

One could make a connection between war, rubber shortages and seeking alternatives but I don't know if any such connection exists.

Jack

Offline Jim S.

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2016, 07:56:37 PM »
I have had 1. Other collectors told me they have come across them as well.
The Paper AE tag makes me think factory or factory contract.
________________________________________ ________________________________________ ___
 However I would think they are getting kinda scarce, Many collectors have had them pass thru their hands, but there probably weren't very many made . The value being highest on the condition of the paper tag.


I think they are an interesting variation.
JMO,
Jim S.



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Offline Fabius

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2016, 11:07:43 PM »
Here are pictures of the inside. Notice that there are two condensers (capacitors). It is a straight line ring. Anything indicate an early AE40?
Tom Vaughn
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Offline Jack Ryan

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2016, 11:41:39 PM »
Here are pictures of the inside. Notice that there are two condensers (capacitors). It is a straight line ring. Anything indicate an early AE40?

It depends on what you mean by early. It is early in the sense that it is a Type 40 (not a Type 41) but not necessarily one of the first.

That type normally has black metal rings on the handset so they are early in that they don't have faux metal rings (ie made to look like it has rings).

The dial on yours is definitely not early but it might have been added later.

Can you take a good picture of the circuit? If you can, will you? If the ID is not clear, can you transcribe it?

Thanks
Jack

Offline Fabius

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2016, 11:40:35 AM »

Can you take a good picture of the circuit? If you can, will you? If the ID is not clear, can you transcribe it?

Thanks
Jack

Here it is. What would be the correct dial type?
Tom Vaughn
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Offline poplar1

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2016, 11:45:05 AM »
The metal bracket for mounting the dial is found only on they early model 40s.
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unbeldi

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2016, 12:20:36 PM »
The schematic is also an early type, Form D-53688 Issue 7, earlier than the diagrams I showed in this post.

The dial is a type 51 from the 1950s, but the phone was originally also equipped with a dial (–A0).
The original type was a 24A36 with the standard AK-25 contact arrangement (same as this one).

Would you mind sharing a high-resolution image of the bottom sticker.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2016, 12:28:29 PM by unbeldi »

Offline Fabius

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2016, 12:32:18 PM »
Would you mind sharing a high-resolution image of the bottom sticker.

I will post it when I get home this evening. I have a couple of spare type 24 AE dials.
Tom Vaughn
La Porte, Indiana
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unbeldi

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2016, 12:35:06 PM »
I will post it when I get home this evening. I have a couple of spare type 24 AE dials.

Thanks.
A No 24 would be less authentic than a 51. Likely no AE 40 would be equipped with it, as it predates the 24A36.

Offline Jack Ryan

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2016, 07:04:57 PM »
As I noted earlier, the cloth based phones I have seen were issued during WW2. That in itself, makes the phones "early" but not necessarily the earliest. WW2 began at about the same time as the AE 40 was released (1939) but I am not aware of any cloth based AE 40s being deployed that early.

I am going to have to take more notice of period photographs.

The dial is a type 51 from the 1950s, but the phone was originally also equipped with a dial (–A0).
The original type was a 24A36 with the standard AK-25 contact arrangement (same as this one).

Yes, it originally had a dial. There are also lots of "SN 4046 B0" CB manual telephones that have a cloth base.

I am still not convinced that all cast dials are Type 51 at the earliest but the dial is definitely not the one originally fitted.

Jack

unbeldi

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2016, 07:44:52 PM »
I am still not convinced that all cast dials are Type 51 at the earliest but the dial is definitely not the one originally fitted.


The Type 51 dial was the first with the spring assembly that is no longer removable in one piece.
This one is not, if I looked at the picture correctly.  I think materials are not the criterion, I think I have had dials that appeared to be made from different ones, at least finished differently.

unbeldi

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Re: AE 40 with Felt Covered Base Plate
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2016, 07:57:11 PM »
As I noted earlier, the cloth based phones I have seen were issued during WW2.

It appears reasonable that phones during WW2 would not have a rubber shoe around the bottom edge.
Rubber was a super-scarce material in that period, to the extend that the entire industry, many university labs, and many entrepreneurs were trying to successfully formulate a synthetic rubber substitute that could be produced more cheaply, more rapidly, and in larger quantities than natural rubber.  The country had a projected need that exceeded the supply of almost an order of magnitude, if I recall correctly.
The task was solved amazingly quickly with enormous effort, IIRC, about mid-war period.