Author Topic: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)  (Read 14169 times)

Offline RotoTech99

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #120 on: January 08, 2017, 04:18:05 PM »
Can you show what the set looks like, please?

It looks like a 40xx series, As some of the other forum members have pointed out, most of the information coming out is on the 41xx series.

I couldn't give a guess on it,  but I  am curious about the "4R" code; it looks like part of it got inadvertently clipped in the photo.

Can you resend that photo with the full ""4R" code at the top of your photo showing, please?

Thank you, RotoTech99
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 04:25:47 PM by RotoTech99 »

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #121 on: January 08, 2017, 04:24:20 PM »
Okay RotoTech99, I have entered your 40 as it was when you received it. A few more questions:
The wiring is cloth not plastic?
The phone case had the Bakelite tabs to mount the dial, not the steel bracket?
The original chrome plunger blocks, did they have a hole in the side of each for a Buttler Handle or not?
Is the tag on the base the gold water transfer type or a paper label? That picture is blurry.y
Does the tag list Chicago, Chicago 7 or something else?
You said 6 patent numbers? Is that 6 plus the Des #?
Can you tell me what is printed on the condenser other than the D-68270-A number.

Thanks....Terry
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 04:38:04 PM by AE_Collector »

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #122 on: January 08, 2017, 04:28:22 PM »
Yeah, need a lot more info to try to narrow down the manufacture date at this point?

Quick items to check are cloth or plastic insulated wiring inside? Cloth = old/early & Plastic = Newer/later.

On the stamped decal does it say Automatic Electric Company Chicago, Chicago 7, Northlake or something else?
AE's prior to 1943 (approximately) should have "Automatic Electric Company Chicago" on the base label (if made in the USA).
AE's made from 1943 (approximately) and on should have "Automatic Electric Company Chicago 7" on the base label.
AE's made August 15, 1957 and on should have Northlake Illinois rather than Chicago 7 on the base label.

Terry
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 04:37:20 PM by AE_Collector »

Offline Jrs1958

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #123 on: January 08, 2017, 04:40:27 PM »
More pics

Offline Jrs1958

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #124 on: January 08, 2017, 04:42:27 PM »
Pic

Offline Jrs1958

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #125 on: January 08, 2017, 04:43:10 PM »
Pic

Offline Jrs1958

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #126 on: January 08, 2017, 04:43:56 PM »
Pic

Offline RotoTech99

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #127 on: January 08, 2017, 04:53:37 PM »
My AE40 prior to conversion has the label with "Chicago 7, I'll.

It also says "Automatic Electric" made in USA.

it also has a "DES number which is missing, as i mentioned the decal has damage; I'll retake a photo and post it again, hopefully more readable.

Offline HarrySmith

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #128 on: January 08, 2017, 04:55:49 PM »
JRS-
The last AE I worked on had a date on the condenser, the only date. Yours is next to the ringer, have you checked it for a date? Also I see the wiring diagram tucked in there, they are dated sometimes.
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Offline RotoTech99

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #129 on: January 08, 2017, 05:09:43 PM »
Dear AE Collector:

I couldn't get a clean photo on my gold label, but it did say Automatic Electric, Chicago 7, USA, and made in USA on it. It has the DES number, though it was mostly missing as was some other info. That label is still on my AE40, I haven't changed it.

It did have the 6 patent numbers, plus the DES number
The condenser said Automatic Electric Co. with BN printed below it.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 05:31:53 PM by RotoTech99 »

unbeldi

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #130 on: January 08, 2017, 05:13:20 PM »
Any idea what year this AE40 is from?

Too bad the stamp is so much corroded away, but at least it has the higher numbered patents visible.  In general the stamped patent listings are the earliest, during WW-II some sets had paper labels, after that it was always water decals, I believe, for those made in Chicago anyways.  Phillips Works may have not had decals.

I think this set was made before November 1939.

It is interesting that these early sets include a patent by Siemens & Halske (US1687117 1928 1925 Webber S&H--Telephone Desk Set). The number on the stamp is partly destroyed, but I know it is there.  The patent may be the first to use two cradle rests, with two independent plungers, one on each side. At least that is my interpretation of the situation.


PS:  here are the patents that I recognize on this stamping:

US1615311 1927 1923 Obergfell AE--Impulse-sending device
US1642822 1927 1924 Obergfell AE--Calling Device
US1687117 1928 1925 Webber S&H--Telephone Desk Set
US1689598 1928 1925 Pye AEL--Telephone Substation Circuits
US1738919 1929 1927 Obergfell AEL--Telephone Desk Set
US1878800 1932 1931 Obergfell AEL--Electromagnetic Device (induction coil)
US2068700 1937 1935 Peterson AEL--Calling Device
US2133469 1938 1936 Obergfell AEL--Calling Device
US2149628 1939 1935 Pye AEL--Telephone Transmitter

There are a couple more at far left, that are unreadable, but I think I may have another copy of this label somewhere, I have seen it before. Perhaps Terry has one too.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 05:59:56 PM by unbeldi »

Offline RotoTech99

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #131 on: January 08, 2017, 05:25:11 PM »
Dear AE Collector:

What can you determine from this code "jrs" posted for his black AE40 with chrome fingerwheel, lift butler, handset bands, and what appears to be a Extensicord: SN4022 AO 4RS?

I gave you all the information I could locate, I hope it reached you OK.

BTW: my converted AE40's decal did indeed have six patent numbers plus the the DES number.

It also said Automatic Electric, Chicago 7, USA Made in USA on it.

Apologies if I've been repetitious with this, I have to check each time a new question comes up.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 05:39:47 PM by RotoTech99 »

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #132 on: January 08, 2017, 05:42:37 PM »
I think this set was made before November 1939.

A very early set. The cloth wiring is early but the steel dial mounting bracket to me says very early. AE 50's sometimes have missing plunger buttons as they were removed to remove the set from the wall but didn't get put back together properly and eventually "wandered off" being small parts. But if those parts of the AE 50 are easily lost imagine if the special brass nut that threads up into the bottom of the metal dial bracket leaving a threaded hole for the front base mounting screw were lost!

Another "early" indicator if it still has its handset (and it ISN'T a chrome banded handset) is if the handset caps have black painted grooved brass bands OR grooves cut into the bakelite caps to look like the grooved metal bands. I think these Type 41 handsets initially had the brass bands just like the Type 38 handsets on 1A, 34 & 35 sets but being introduced just as war was about to break out quickly led them to remove the brass bands on basic trim phones cutting similar grooves into the bakelite caps instead. Then someone must have asked why the grooves were needed at all so they ditched that in favour of the much more familiar smooth caps with a small single step molded into the side.

Terry

unbeldi

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #133 on: January 08, 2017, 05:48:53 PM »
A very early set. The cloth wiring is early but the steel dial mounting bracket to me says very early. AE 50's sometimes have missing plunger buttons as they were removed to remove the set from the wall but didn't get put back together properly and eventually "wandered off" being small parts. But if those parts of the AE 50 are easily lost imagine if the special brass nut that threads up into the bottom of the metal dial bracket leaving a threaded hole for the front base mounting screw were lost!

Another "early" indicator if it still has its handset (and it ISN'T a chrome banded handset) is if the handset caps have black painted grooved brass bands OR grooves cut into the bakelite caps to look like the grooved metal bands. I think these Type 41 handsets initially had the brass bands just like the Type 38 handsets on 1A, 34 & 35 sets but being introduced just as war was about to break out quickly led them to remove the brass bands on basic trim phones cutting similar grooves into the bakelite caps instead. Then someone must have asked why the grooves were needed at all so they ditched that in favour of the much more familiar smooth caps with a small single step molded into the side.

Terry

Yes indeed.  Somewhere I have a picture of a 41 type handset with painted brass bands.  Perhaps it was even from the Forum.

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: AE 40, 47 & 50 Base Code Observations (2017!)
« Reply #134 on: January 08, 2017, 06:00:24 PM »
Dear AE Collector:

What can you determine from this code "jrs" posted for his black AE40 with chrome fingerwheel, lift butler, handset bands, and what appears to be a Extensicord: SN4022 AO 4RS?

I have one SN4022 set listed but it doesn't have the steel dial bracket in it. I have two quite closely numbered SN4020's listed and one has enough info to indicate that it also had the steel bracket and an oronge ink stamped label like this one has.

Does this phone have chrome bands? I didn't notice them in any picture.

Terry