Author Topic: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)  (Read 1222 times)

Offline LoveOldPhones

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OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« on: February 09, 2017, 04:39:30 PM »
Look at this..... i don't know much about what odd phones were made in the past but what is this paint job? 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/WESTERN-ELECTRIC-MODEL-500-in-Statuary-Bronze-color-II-61-numbered-throughout-/322418562829

was this an actual factory issue phone from  WE ?  or something someone made up ?

thanks

« Last Edit: February 09, 2017, 07:15:10 PM by AE_Collector »

Offline mentalstampede

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2017, 04:50:40 PM »
Statuary Bronze is a legit Western Electric color. It was available on D1 mounts and 300 series sets, but I don't know if it was ever offered on 500 sets. I suppose it is possible as a special order perhaps.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2017, 04:52:59 PM by mentalstampede »
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Offline LoveOldPhones

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2017, 04:53:09 PM »
Statuary Bronze is a legit Western Electric color. I don't know if it was ever offered on 500 sets, but I suppose it is possible as a special order perhaps.

OK... so if its a painted phone.... what color phone is underneath ?  would it be that mahogany brown then ?
lol....  would rather have THAT one. 

Offline HarrySmith

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2017, 05:05:20 PM »
Very Nice! Very rare in my opinion.

BTW - offered by our own Ray K.

Hey Ray, got any pictures of "under the hood?"
Harry Smith
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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2017, 05:41:59 PM »
When color telephone production was resumed after the war in 1949, statuary bronze was only available upon special order for 300-series sets. Those jobs were not fulfilled from the factory, but by the distribution center work shops.  It was never a factory color for 500s.

I would say this is not even a WECo job, surely they would have provided a manufactured numbering card mask, not a poorly hand-cut version (see jagged edges).
Today, many hobbyist painters in home shops can produce finishes like this.

Offline poplar1

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2017, 06:22:52 PM »
Ray's 500 on Ebay (1st picture) is not "statuary bronze" (dash 7). It is closer to "old brass" (--6).
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline WEBellSystemChristian

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2017, 06:44:13 PM »
Are we sure the metallic colors offered on 302s were not offered on the 500? It seems like this and Dark Gold are found on 500s, usually containing a wide range of dates, pointing to refurb shops making them. Maybe WE supplied the clear bezels, and the shops made them out of whatever parts they could find. (like C stock phones.)
Christian Petterson

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Offline poplar1

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2017, 07:13:56 PM »
"Gold" (dash 63) and Ivory (--50) were the  2 standard colors for Bell Chime covers (125A--63 and 125A--50).
(Ref: BSP Section 501-252-100-i7-aug65-f1a-ringer in TCI library)

"Light Gold" (--63) and "Old Gold" (--12) were also available for new 500s as late as 1985.
(Ref: ATTIS Catalog c. 1985)
« Last Edit: February 09, 2017, 07:16:00 PM by poplar1 »
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline jsowers

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2017, 07:43:04 PM »
OK... so if its a painted phone.... what color phone is underneath ?  would it be that mahogany brown then ?
lol....  would rather have THAT one.

If you look at where the paint is scratched off, on the right side, the phone housing is white or ivory underneath.
Jonathan

Offline Jim Stettler

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2017, 09:50:23 PM »
Ray's 500 on Ebay (1st picture) is not "statuary bronze" (dash 7). It is closer to "old brass" (--6).

It is not "statuary bronze' I call it "Old Gold", May be old brass. Poplar1 is typically more "precise/correct" than I am.I think it is real.
JMO,
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Offline poplar1

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2017, 10:01:43 PM »
Here is a photo of Christian's dark gold (dash 12) 302:
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=12275.msg129578#msg129578
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline Jim Stettler

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2017, 10:08:49 PM »
I have a metal set similar to that, the exception is the paint is "shadowed'. maybe dark gold w/ shadow is old gold?  I have been told @ shows that the finish is "old Gold".
JMO<
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Offline poplar1

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2017, 10:56:03 PM »
"Dark Gold" and "Old Gold" have the same color code: --12. So, I don't think black highlights would be appropriate for either one.

Here is a 202 (from II 34) that I purchased this week. I believe it is factory paint, mainly because of the handset cord. Note that the early painted E1B handsets were black Bakelite, not brown.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/322353108054

Here are the 1935 colors from the WE Catalog #9 (for C, D, and E handset mountings and 4H dials):

-3 Black
-4 Ivory
-5 Gray
-6 Old Brass
-7 Statuary Bronze
-8 Oxidized Silver
-11 Medium Gold
-12 Dark Gold



A 1935 BSP shows that both medium gold (--11) and dark gold (--12) sets had "gold" (--11) cords, and that
Old Brass (--6) and Statuary Bronze (--7) had dark brown (--10) cords. (BSP Section C36.101, Issue 2, 7-25-35, Station Cords, All Types).

Medium Gold (--11) and Gray (--5) sets were discontinued before the 302 was introduced.
By 1941, dark gold (--12) sets had gold (--12) cords,  and both old brass (--6) and statuary bronze (--7) sets had brown (--9) cords.  (BSP Section C30.011, Issue 4, 1-2-41, Colored Station Sets)

So for original 202s, if the cords are gold (--11), the set is probably dark gold (--12) or medium gold (--11).
Original 302s in dark gold (--12) would have been equipped with gold (--12) cords.

Old Brass 202s and 302s would have been originally equipped with brown cords (1935, 1941 BSPs above).

Statuary Bronze 202s and 302s also had brown cords (1935, 1941 BSPs).

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=11902.msg126564#msg126564

« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 11:29:43 AM by poplar1 »
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline LoveOldPhones

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2017, 12:31:50 AM »
WOW !  thanks for all the great info !  I learn something from you guys all the time. 
LOVE all the pictures !

Offline poplar1

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Re: OK..... whats THIS? -- (a gold WE 500?)
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2017, 11:32:07 AM »
Here is another "dash 12" gold phone. Note that the box is marked "554 BR--12."

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-WESTERN-ELECTRIC-554BR-GOLD-12-Wall-Telephone-1963-RARE-COLOR-in-Box/262835020953
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.