Author Topic: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay  (Read 2400 times)

Offline AE_Collector

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7445
  • AE 2 - AECo's 1st Self Contained Desk Phone 1925
Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« on: February 13, 2017, 12:12:05 AM »
There is another Orchid AE40 on eBay at the moment. A 10 day auction starting at $250 with free shipping.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/112300679019

Automatic Electric Monophone
This is a Very Rare Historic Original Phone in Original Condition, Works!
Looks like heavy bakelite base and hand set.
From what I could find, I believe it to be the AE40 (or #40).
Blue colored with chrome colored bands and dial.
Cord is in great condition. no fraying. Handset is in Good condition Too!
Rubber going around the bottom is showing its age - dry and "crackly." with one spot broken off (see Photo)
Ear portion of the handset is yellowed.
The two plungers in the handset cradle bounce back perfectly.
I bought an adapter for a wall land line years ago. I used to use this phone myself. Its been years since I got rid of my land line so it has not been used for sometime. I can see no reason why it shouldn't still be able to work fine.


This phone is Auction Contest #264 here:
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17654.0

Terry
« Last Edit: February 15, 2017, 01:12:07 AM by AE_Collector »

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2017, 06:53:09 PM »
Dear Forum:

Here are couple of AE 40 codes from two AE 40's I saw on eBay:

The first is a AE 40 Painted blue, but shows Orchid internally as the original color: L4505 DSLH SN7

Number two is a black with chrome trim AE 40 with a numerals only dial. The fingerwheel, lift bar, and bands on the handset caps are chrome.

Its code is N 4029 A9 LO1.

What do you think on these?

Its beyond me why someone would repaint an Orchid AE 40; if I did that, at least I would choose a paint that would closest match the original color.

Now on the black with chrome trim AE 40, maybe we're starting to get somewhere.

RotoTech99





Offline poplar1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5866
  • 102C-6 = "Old Brass" Hand Telephone Set
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2017, 07:15:04 PM »
Dear Forum:

Here are couple of AE 40 codes from two AE 40's I saw on eBay:

The first is a AE 40 Painted blue, but shows Orchid internally as the original color: L4505 DSLH SN7


Do you mean this one? The consensus is that it's not painted, just discolo(u)red.
http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17654.msg182383#msg182383




These are a tough call, one of the rare AE colors though this color virtually never is what it is supposed to be (Orchid/Purple) but instead is almost always this nice light blue color. They can be sanded back to Orchid but I've heard that they start turning light blue again quite soon.

Terry
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 08:04:33 PM by poplar1 »
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2017, 07:40:58 PM »
That's the one; if you look inside the housing, it shows as Orchid, and it does not look painted; it has the "factory shine" of the original color. Now perhaps some of the orchid is faded, but it looks to be the original color.

If you look at the handset grip, you'll see orchid showing through there.

If that was painted Orchid, the finish would not be as shiny as the molded color is.

With all respect, I doubt that the light blue finish is original to the set; Maybe it was repainted aftermarket at one point,
but I believe it was probably repainted to utilize old stock, and the original orchid was possibly too faded to return to original or very close to original.

So i must respectfully disagree with the consensus thus far.

RotoTech99

RotoTech99
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 07:52:54 PM by RotoTech99 »

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2017, 08:12:07 PM »
Dear Forum:

It is possible I could be in error on this one, but has anyone looked to see if there might be a line delineating the two colors? that can be evidence of color fade, or, if a housing was painted.

I would suggest higher resolution pictures may help determine better if the AE 40 in question was painted over orchid, or faded orchid.

RotoTech99


Offline poplar1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5866
  • 102C-6 = "Old Brass" Hand Telephone Set
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2017, 08:30:52 PM »
Dear Forum:

It is possible I could be in error on this one, but has anyone looked to see if there might be a line delineating the two colors? that can be evidence of color fade, or, if a housing was painted.

I would suggest higher resolution pictures may help determine better if the AE 40 in question was painted over orchid, or faded orchid.

RotoTech99

Here is an old post:http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=5757.msg69489#msg69489
I would leave as-is for sure.  As homogeneous as that Robins-egg Blue is, the fading must be pretty deep. And no, this is not the example that I found with all of those other AE phones; that one is squirreled away!

After examining about 6 or 7 original Orchid AE's, (1As, 40s and 1 - 50!), it is obvious to me that the orchid pigment must actually leach out over time, leaving the base color of light blue. It's just strange to me how the light blue doesn't fade though once it gets to that point.

We have come a long way in plastics and pigmenting. Most (not all) of the pigments that I use actually cross-links with the plastic at the molecular level, so it can't fade; it becomes part of material.   
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2017, 08:58:51 PM »
"One can't see the beauty around them until they open their eyes." -RotoTech99

Well, in this case, I guess I've been "overlooking" a faded beauty as far as phones go; but I have seen some instances of a good color over painted with a different color that "rang my something's off alarm"…

unbeldi

  • Guest
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2017, 09:21:19 PM »
Discoloration is really not the subject matter of this topic.

Of the few orchid sets that show up, not a single one has the original color anymore, AFAIK.  It is apparent that the dyes used are unstable and quickly discolor into blue.
The orchid shades on the handset area where it rests on the cradle are due to the constant polishing from friction during use and lack of light to the areas when on the cradle.

Since this thread is about codes, the order number of the set was 4045, not 4505, btw.
Here is my record of the set:
L 4045 DSLH SN7; D-780504 A41; Orchid; chrome trim; chrome metro dial (Z|OPER|0) two-line num card; ext cord, >1952

Below is another orchid set in a different state of discoloration, most likely from 1955 or later.
L 4044 ASLH PB1; D-780504 A41; Orchid, gold trim, gold metro dial NoZ, OPER|0 , Extensicord, 2x700 Ω ringer
This set shows a very gradual discoloration on the underside of the handset.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 09:29:14 PM by unbeldi »

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2017, 09:31:29 PM »
The mixup on part of the code was my error, I wrote it down wrong.  Thanks for catching my error, I probably wouldn't have caught it as fast as I'm doing other things while I browse.

BTW: For color fade, the AE 40 you PSR pictured in your reply looks very nice.

RotoTech99

unbeldi

  • Guest
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2017, 09:33:54 PM »
It is not called "fading", but discoloration.
They are pretty much opposites of one another.

Offline RotoTech99

  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2017, 10:11:00 PM »
I still say it looks good :-)

Offline AE_Collector

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7445
  • AE 2 - AECo's 1st Self Contained Desk Phone 1925
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2017, 10:23:21 PM »
It does seem unusual that it changes colour so evenly so that in the end it is still a very nice colour.

I do recall seeing an Orchid AE set listed on eBay once in the past that was still Orchid rather than light blue but I don't know if someone had done something to restore the color or whether it hadn't changed colour for some reason. Virtually every other one that I have seen is the identical same light blue colour.

One other interesting scenario is the phones that Ray K found. Note this "as found" Orchid AE 1A with the base extension that makes it either an AE 31 or AE32 (I can never remember which). For what ever reason, the base extension seems to have remained Orchid while the 1A did the usual colour change. These had been stored for years before Ray found them. It is interesting to see that where a dial once was the color stayed Orchid yet presumably the dial had been removed for years before Ray found them but that spot behind the dial stayed Orchid colour even though it is now just as exposed as the outside of the shell. Maybe having been stored in boxes without light or air circulation prevented any colour change in the exposed area normally hidden under the dial.

Terry
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 10:30:12 PM by AE_Collector »

unbeldi

  • Guest
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2017, 10:58:03 PM »
The long-term stability of the dyes is likely quite different in different types of plastic, even different types of cellulosics, specifically. From the 1930s to the 1950s is a long time during which polymer chemistry advanced significantly. This may not always have had positive effects on dye longevity.

Offline TelePlay

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7053
  • Available by PM
    • . . . the times they been a'changing
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2017, 01:44:05 AM »
Then there was this Orchid AE 40 from 2011 (Auction Contest #69) which was before my time so only had two pictures, one of which seems to be a perfectly changes exterior but the interior of the handset shows its true color.  Sold for $4,350 in June of 2011.



            John . . .

              

Offline TelePlay

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7053
  • Available by PM
    • . . . the times they been a'changing
Re: Another Orchid AE 40 on eBay
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2017, 01:54:38 AM »
And then there was this Orchid AE 40 in transition from Orchid to Blue (Auction Contest #78) which sold for a very cheap $473 back in December 2012. Seems the handset bands went missing some time after the color change began (plastic under the bands was protected from that which changes the color as is the interior surfaces.






            John . . .