Author Topic: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.  (Read 1496 times)

Offline tanderson78

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I am fully aware of the irony that my first post on Classic Rotary Phones Forum is a request for a touch tone diagram!  Its a NE-2236QC, and the diagram is here, however, I'm either blind or its a poor scan.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=8809.0

The network, standard 12 button pad, coin chute, condenser, 165A ringer, and a DB-15 cable all connect to the 10 screws on a terminal strip inside the upper housing.

TT pad:  Black, White, Red, Green, Blue, Blue/White, Orange/Black, Red Grey

Ringer: Red, Black, Red/Slate, Slate

Network: H, L2, B, A, GN, F, K, R, C, L1, G, RR

452B Cap: Green, Green

Coin Chute: A, E, X

2 Jumper wires:  Red/White, Yellow/White

DB-15 Male cable:  Orange/White, White/Green, Blue/Red, Blue/White, Brown/White, Grey/White, Green/White, White/Blue, White/Orange, White/Brown, Red/Blue, White/Grey

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Lower housing is wired like a 233G:

Handset:  Black to T, Red and White to TR, White to GN

Coin Relay / Mech?:  Yellow to TR, Red to Y, White/Grey to R, White? to SL

Finally,  the lower housing has a female DB-15, but it only has 7 wires and for the moment, I cannot find it.  As I just recently hooked up a 233G to a 500 series network, it only required 5 wires from the upper housing to the network along with 2 more for tip and ring.  Worse comes to worse, I get out the soldering gun and move wires on the DB-15 in the lower housing.

I guess I am a semi-novice.

Thanks in advance for your help.

________________________________________ ________________________________

It would be great it it worked as close to a payphone as possible, but I don't have the coin relay and it will be a while before I purchase Stan's mini coin controller.

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2017, 03:46:02 PM »
I am fully aware of the irony that my first post on Classic Rotary Phones Forum is a request for a touch tone diagram!  Its a NE-2236QC, and the diagram is here, however, I'm either blind or its a poor scan.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=8809.0

Finally,  the lower housing has a female DB-15, but it only has 7 wires and for the moment, I cannot find it.  As I just recently hooked up a 233G to a 500 series network, it only required 5 wires from the upper housing to the network along with 2 more for tip and ring.  Worse comes to worse, I get out the soldering gun and move wires on the DB-15 in the lower housing.
Yes, the diagram is too low resolution to read.  I have an 17x11" wiring diagram for the NE 2236QC and will scan and post it stuffly.

As far as I can see you have not stated what the actual problem is with this phone.  Listing all the leads and terminals separately does not tell us what the problem is.

What is it that you stated above you "cannot find"?

You probably should not start moving leads around with a soldering gun.  That would probably only complicate your problems. 

I don't understand the relationship between a 233G, which has a rotary dial and uses an external network, having only 5 leads to the subset, with the connections to the upper housing of a 2236, which has the network and a TT dial in the upper housing.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2017, 03:53:47 PM by Alex G. Bell »

Offline Stan S

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2017, 04:27:50 PM »
Tanderson78
I see you made it here.
 
A few comments.
The diagram you referred to is a scan, of a photocopy, of a fax, sent to me 15 years ago by a now deceased  collector named Bruce Crawford. Bruce was one of the most knowledgeable collectors I ever had the pleasure of knowing. 

You are correct about that scan being bad. Go a little further into the thread and take a look at Reply#35. There are two scans that are much better.

The fact that you found a DB15 with a wiring harness doesn't mean it's for a Northern 2236. If it only has 7 leads it isn't.
It could have been used in a Western 1234 or any one of a dozen rotary and TT Automatic Electric model LPCs. Every one of these harness being different.

You will probably have to manufacture a harness. Not really a big deal. The hardest part if you are a purist will be finding the proper color wires.

Stan S.

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2017, 04:41:53 PM »
Here's a full resolution version.

unbeldi

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2017, 05:31:28 PM »
Here's a full resolution version.

Perhaps this combined and reworked version is handy too.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2017, 08:44:29 AM by unbeldi »

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2017, 05:40:39 PM »
Perhaps this combined and reworked version this is handy too.
Sure, for those who have access to an 11x17" printer.  However many are limited to a printer with an 8" swath and prefer to print two letter size stuffs to maintain full image size.  However using an ordinary printer with 8" swath the 11x17" image will print with the least image size reduction on legal size (14" paper) since the proportions of 11x17" is much closer to 8x14" than to letter size (8x11")

unbeldi

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2017, 06:05:32 PM »
Sure, for those who have access to an 11x17" printer.  However many are limited to a printer with an 8" swath and prefer to print two letter size stuffs to maintain full image size.  However using an ordinary printer with 8" swath the 11x17" image will print with the least image size reduction on legal size (14" paper) since the proportions of 11x17" is much closer to 8x14" than to letter size (8x11")

Anyone seriously printing anything anymore ?


Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2017, 06:57:29 PM »
Anyone seriously printing anything anymore ?
Personally I find it more convenient to work with paper and mark it up or highlight it as work progresses.  I can't speak for others.

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #8 on: July 09, 2017, 07:18:43 PM »
Here's a schematic too.  Might be easier in some respects to understand operation and troublestuff with this.

Offline tanderson78

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2017, 10:30:31 AM »
I couldn't find the db15 female, but it was in a bag with other parts.  I had the upper housing apart a week ago, added a newer pad, connected a handset to the correct terminals, and was able to dial and answer.  Then, idiot that I am, took it apart after trying to plug the upper housing into the lower housing.  As the lower housing db15 only has 7 wires connected, I needed to know where the other 8 go.  I'm gonna have to solder 8 more wires into the db15 and reconnect it according to the new scans you have provided.  Not too much of a purist.  At this point, I just want a TT 3 slot that works.  I'll worry about coin relay later.  Thanks for all the replies!

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2017, 01:24:29 PM »
I couldn't find the db15 female, but it was in a bag with other parts.  I had the upper housing apart a week ago, added a newer pad, connected a handset to the correct terminals, and was able to dial and answer.  Then, idiot that I am, took it apart after trying to plug the upper housing into the lower housing.  As the lower housing db15 only has 7 wires connected, I needed to know where the other 8 go.  I'm gonna have to solder 8 more wires into the db15 and reconnect it according to the new scans you have provided.  Not too much of a purist.  At this point, I just want a TT 3 slot that works.  I'll worry about coin relay later.  Thanks for all the replies!
But the diagram only shows 12 contacts in use so it seems you only need to add 5.  However I'm puzzled that it worked before being taken apart with only 7 of the 12 connections completed.

Often leads of the correct colors can be salvaged from a damaged "mounting" (line) cord for a 6-button Key Telephone Set.  50-conductor KTS mounting cords contain all possible combinations of the 10 colors.  Even 30 and 34 conductor ones may contain the color combinations you need.  If the telephone set end is intact the leads will already have spade tips attached.

And strictly speaking, it's a DA15.  The second letter designates the size of the connector body.  "B" identifies a body with 25 contacts.

Offline tanderson78

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2017, 01:06:10 PM »
It didn't work as it came from the ebay auction.  I had to take apart the upper housing and replace the pad using a 2500 diagram before I discovered that the network was good.  The Da15 included with the lower housing was just mounted with its 7 wires but not connected to anything, hence the need for a diagram.  I'm very encouraged now that I know the network is ok.

Offline tanderson78

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2017, 09:37:42 PM »
At least I have made some progress today. I reconnected the network, coin stuff, capacitor,  and wiring harnesses and am finally able to get dial tone and hook switch to work.  However, I am unable to dial.  I know that the pad I have is good because I took it out of a working phone and actually had it wired up to THIS network and was able to dial.  Its my own fault for not taking a photo or notes as I took it apart.  All of the diagrams everybody has hooked me up with have helped.  I just need to figure out how the dial connects to the terminal strip or network.  There still seems to be an issue with something as handset volume is very low and no bell seems to work.  Any thoughts?

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2017, 09:46:31 PM »
At least I have made some progress today. I reconnected the network, coin stuff, capacitor,  and wiring harnesses and am finally able to get dial tone and hook switch to work.  However, I am unable to dial.  I know that the pad I have is good because I took it out of a working phone and actually had it wired up to THIS network and was able to dial.  Its my own fault for not taking a photo or notes as I took it apart.  All of the diagrams everybody has hooked me up with have helped.  I just need to figure out how the dial connects to the terminal strip or network.  There still seems to be an issue with something as handset volume is very low and no bell seems to work.  Any thoughts?
Most dials are polarity sensitive.  Try flipping the line wires to get the dial to generate tones but that will have nothing to do with the other problems.

I have not compared the original dial circuit with that of a standard dial nor the dial you substituted, which I don't think you stated the part #.  It's not necessarily correct that they are interchangeable and that could be related to your lack of receive.  Ringer is another matter.

Alex G. Bell

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Re: READABLE diagram for Northern Electric 3 slot push button payphone.
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2017, 11:36:12 PM »
Most dials are polarity sensitive.  Try flipping the line wires to get the dial to generate tones but that will have nothing to do with the other problems.

I have not compared the original dial circuit with that of a standard dial nor the dial you substituted, which I don't think you stated the part #.  It's not necessarily correct that they are interchangeable and that could be related to your lack of receive.  Ringer is another matter.
As a matter of fact, the most common dials have a W-BL lead and no O-R lead, which is not used as shown in the drawings I posted.  The W-BL lead normally feeds the receiver circuit from the network to the receiver, via the W lead.  This could well be why you hear almost nothing. 

What did you do with the W-BL lead?

Who is the mfr and what is the code of the dial you substituted?