Author Topic: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.  (Read 2581 times)

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #30 on: August 31, 2017, 03:14:12 PM »

 Just had the Mail Lady drop off a few things, its like Christmas around here! All of this is going to be used on the 551C, hopefully.

 Two new to me phones, these really need some going through. Sending one of the dials to Steve Hilsz (found his name on the forum). The expert Dial God.

 Phones
 1 C/D 500 12/56
 1 C/D 500 10/55

 Amp Cables!
 1 - 10 foot Extension Cable M/F
 2 - Male connection cables
 1 - Female connection cable.

 CO Lines.
 I picked up this Blue-tooth connection box that connects a cell phone to a regular phone. It is supposed to provide ring/tip as it should from a CO. I am curious to see if I can make this work with the 551C as a CO Line. From what I understand people have made these work using the SAN/BAR KTU's. I dont think these will work with the 400D KTU's but not sure. In all, I am not sure if it will work at all, weeeel seeeeee.

Offline rdelius

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #31 on: August 31, 2017, 04:03:14 PM »
500 sets will  need to be rewired with a-lead control to work on  1a2 ksus. 564 sets are what you need for all functions to work

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #32 on: August 31, 2017, 04:12:20 PM »
500 sets will  need to be rewired with a-lead control to work on  1a2 ksus. 564 sets are what you need for all functions to work

 I knew they would require something to modify them, or, special something to get them to work correctly with the KSU. This is all part of the experience. These will be a lot further down the road but, I can at least get them looking nice and use them on my regular phone line hopefully.
 
 Think I am about there on phones rdelius, unless someone comes along with a deal I cant pass up on 1a2. I should have 5 1a2 phones and these two 500's.

 Appreciate your feedback as always, thanks for looking out for me.

 (sent you a PM right?)
 Mike

Offline Weco355aman

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #33 on: August 31, 2017, 05:27:51 PM »
The X-link will work with 400d iss 15, also 400g and h ktu card's
I have a few 400h cards, also ITT k400e will work as well.
Phil

Offline Jim S.

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2017, 05:59:48 PM »
I have played with Xlink before. I think it a very practical way to make a rotary phone work.
JMO,
Jim S.
You live, You learn,
You die, you forget it all.

Victor Laszlo

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #35 on: August 31, 2017, 06:27:09 PM »
Quote
I knew they would require something to modify them, or, special something to get them to work correctly with the KSU. This is all part of the experience.

Very simply, here is some background info about single line telephones. It might help guide you as you play with Chapter 2 "Key Systems" before you had immersed yourself with Chapter 1 "Basic Phones."

My comments refer to WE or equivalent 500, 2500, and 56x and 256x phones. There are others, that use the same technology, but are just bigger with more wires.

Every SLT has a switch hook (SWHK). That's the electrical switch that operates when you take the handset off-hook, and restores by gravity when you hang up.  It has, among other contacts, two sets of MAKE (normally open) contacts. One set opens and closes the TIP side of the line, and the other set opens and closes the RING side of the line. Tip and Ring are terms that refer to the metal, current-carrying parts on a switchboard plug, and by extension and convention, they refer to the two wires on a CO line. Tip, Ring and Sleeve are the three leads in a switchboard cord. Look at a stereo headphone plug and you will get the idea.

In every key set, the line selection keys MAKE the Tip, the Ring, and the A lead. The individual A lead, when grounded in the tel set, operates the A relay in the associated line card. That card lights the line lamps by sending 10Vac on the Lamp lead for that line, out to the phones, and then back to ground on the (LG) lead.

SLT's used on 1A2 systems need to be converted to "A lead control".  One set of the SWHK contacts are "borrowed" to create the MAKE contact for the A lead. One set is kept in service to open/close the line. One side (Tip, let's say) is continuous through the phone, but Ring is interrupted by the SWHK contacts.  You need to do this conversion (by simply moving a couple of wires) so that the SLT will light the lamps on associated key sets, and not cause other electrical non-compatibility such as false hold, no ring trip, etc.

So, now, in addition to understanding the deal with using a SLT on a key system, you also know why each key on a key set needs 3 pairs, aka 6 wires (actually 5 because we can use one common ground return wire for all the individual A leads) between the KSU and the tel set.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2017, 06:45:10 PM by Victor Laszlo »

Victor Laszlo

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #36 on: August 31, 2017, 06:42:31 PM »
Teaching 1A2 by typing messages causes a syndrome known as "Oh..wait...there's one more thing I need to explain..."

As you proceed, ask whatever you need to know. It may be our fault that it wasn't included in the first messages, but we'll catch up and eventually (after a few years) you'll know as much as we do.

Offline Babybearjs

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #37 on: September 01, 2017, 12:19:08 AM »
the jack shown on my 551C is for the incoming CO lines. its a RJ-45 jack and allows for all 4 lines to be connected. I can send you pics of my system I have in my house if you like, whats your regular email address? this way you get the pics, unless you've already seen the pictures on the forum...
John

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #38 on: September 01, 2017, 08:44:02 AM »
the jack shown on my 551C is for the incoming CO lines. its a RJ-45 jack and allows for all 4 lines to be connected. I can send you pics of my system I have in my house if you like, whats your regular email address? this way you get the pics, unless you've already seen the pictures on the forum...

 Can you post them here in this forum if its a 551 KSU? Or if you prefer email, I think you can get to that through my profile. I would rather not post my email here in public.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2017, 09:22:49 AM by digoxy118 »

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #39 on: September 01, 2017, 08:57:59 AM »
Very simply, here is some background info about single line telephones. It might help guide you as you play with Chapter 2 "Key Systems" before you had immersed yourself with Chapter 1 "Basic Phones."

 Thanks for this victor, good info.

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #40 on: September 01, 2017, 09:06:06 AM »
The X-link will work with 400d iss 15, also 400g and h ktu card's
I have a few 400h cards, also ITT k400e will work as well.

 Thats good to know. I have read that the 400d was to temperamental for the X-Link.

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #41 on: September 08, 2017, 09:25:13 AM »
Questions:
- What more per line do I need to punch down on the 551 Block? I have punched down lines 1-4 but only T, R, A, AI, LG, L. It just seems there should be more to do here for buzzers or ringers or whatever. If so, an understanding of colors and what to punch down here would be for some great discussion.

- On a Facebook post, one mentioned that it appeared the 551 block was set for buzzers after reviewing some of my pictures. I have no idea how to determine this and understand what to modify to set this to ringers. I have included pictures if one could take a look at this.

- I have the 118a Ring Generator, I would like to attach this to the RG and RB block connections however, there does not seem to be a polarity marked on the ring generator, only two screws to screw on leads, is there a polarity on this ring generator? if so, what connector goes to each the RG/RB?

Updates 9/8/17 :
 - Added a single female emphenol cable and connector to right side of KSU Block, ran out bottom of KSU Box.
 - Connected amphenol splitter/adapter to female end of emphenol.
 - KSU Powers on, everything as far as voltage looks good.
 - Connected two key sets (phones)
 - Verified stepping through each line, lamps work fine on both sets.
 - Made outgoing call through Key Set - KSU using X-Link, works great, sounds great.
 - Tested many of the key-sets I have, they all seem to work the same.
 - I have scrapped the idea of using an external block.

Needed:
 2 SAN/BAR 4000F KTU's.
 1 Western Electric 551C Plastic Cover.
 1 118a Ring Generator Bracket.
 3 Female ended amphenol cables, to punch down 551 Block.
 
Wanted:
 Picture sharing of your Western Electric 551.
 Recommended acquisitions of equipment to play with that utilizes the 551.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2017, 09:33:56 AM by digoxy118 »

Victor Laszlo

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #42 on: September 08, 2017, 11:00:55 AM »
The output of the 118A is alternating current. It is is therefore not polarity sensitive. As long as one side is connected to the B battery ground (as shown by the black wire in your photo) it will work OK.

Offline poplar1

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #43 on: September 08, 2017, 01:12:24 PM »
Be sure to remove the red and blue wires that are going  from G+- and S+- to RG and RB before connecting the 118A
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

Offline digoxy118

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Re: Making the Jump 1A2 Western Electric.
« Reply #44 on: September 13, 2017, 08:38:00 AM »
Sounds good guys, I will give that a try as soon as I get a few minutes to get it hooked up. I am actually stalling a bit to see if I get lucky with a bracket for the 118a. This would be great.

I am using the 551 now with a 565HKM Rotary, I have it on and use it to pick up calls from my cell phone. Luckily my cell phone rings and I know I am getting a call, but it all seems to work.

Will get some more work done on it in a few days and will report back. I do have a few more questions posted above if anyone has some answers.

Thanks for the help once again guys.