Author Topic: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....  (Read 1239 times)

Offline Babybearjs

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wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« on: January 31, 2018, 02:53:41 AM »
well, I thought I'd throw this one out to you all.... I recently added 3 #208A KTU's to my 1A1 system and am having a hell of a time with them.... right now, I've taken them completely off line and just wired in 1 unit... and it fighting me.... I got the power and control circuits figured out, but the light circuit is where the problem is right now..... Based on the BSP, Terminal #15 is suppose to go to terminal #3B on my 207.... done... but no light.... yet when a tester is placed across Terminals 3 &4 on the 207, I get power... so... I traced it and found that when the line is picked up.... I get 24Volts???? How? its 10 at the 207, where is the extra voltage coming from... I've torn this thing apart a half dozen times and still can't get the lights to work right.... Yet the rest of my system is working fine... its just the lamp feed on this 207-208 circuit... has anyone else ever run into this issue? I don't understand what I'm doing wrong....
John

Offline rdelius

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Re: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2018, 09:33:13 AM »
My old telephone hand  drawing shows lamp from power supply to 29 on 207c, lamp ground 10,20,30,40.lamp lead to tel set 3.
not sure if this will help .This was wired with 212a line circuits
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 01:30:09 PM by rdelius »

Online Ktownphoneco

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Re: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2018, 09:49:25 AM »
John   ...  I'll be right up front here, I know nothing of key systems at all.    "BUT", I do have a "1450 page" Bell Canada Key Systems Manual dated 1980, and it includes sections on the "1A' and "1A1" Key Telephone Systems.    If there is something I can scan for you and post or e-mail to you, I'd be more than happy to do that if it helps you out.   I'll give you a good quality scan so you can easily read the information.  If it helps, I can give you the BSP number and section titles so you can tell me what sections you'd like scanned.   Bell Canada manuals use both the U.S. Bell System Practice numbers, Northern practices and Bell Canada's own practices.    They generally follow the U.S. BSP numbers, which addition sub-sections unique to Bell Canada, and usually end with the suffix "CA".    Northern practices usually start with the prefix "NT" (Northern Telecom).

Here's an example of a similar BSP AT&T and Bell Canada :   
                                                                                            AT&T BSP : 518-114-402 - "1A1 Key Telephone System - Line Pickup, Holding Line and Busy Lamps, and Common Audible Signal 202A, BN, C, D, and 212AN Key Telephone Units Connections".

Bell Canada BSP :  518-114-402CA -  "1A1 Key Telephone System - Line Pickup, Holding Line and Busy Lamps, and Common Audible Signal 202A, BN, C, D, and 212AN Key Telephone Units Connections".

If your interested send me a "PM" and let me know.     Enjoy the day.

Jeff Lamb

Offline Babybearjs

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Re: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2018, 10:01:45 AM »
 :) Thanks Jeff, problem solved! but do send me that Canadian copy.... I'd like to see it... I've got a copy of the Key System Service Manual (KSSM) and would love to see a Canadian version....
John

Offline HarrySmith

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Re: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2018, 11:23:59 AM »
:) Thanks Jeff, problem solved! but do send me that Canadian copy.... I'd like to see it... I've got a copy of the Key System Service Manual (KSSM) and would love to see a Canadian version....

How was it solved? Inquiring minds want to know!
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Offline Babybearjs

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Re: wiring issues.... 1A1 system and that darned 208 KTU....
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2018, 04:00:16 AM »
I had completely broken down the 3 208's I have, taking the first one, I connected a 4 pair cable as follows: Blue Pair 12, 13. Orange Pair: 39, 40. Green Pair 15 and 29, Brown Pair 28, 29. then I took a second 4 pair cable and used it as my A-Lead and control cable... Blue pair, 17 and 14. Orange Pair, 25 and 30 green pair (spare) brown Pair (Spare) (these pairs are tied to ground for now.) Both of the 4 pair cables are colored Brown. the third cable is my control cable and connects all the C-Leads between the 207 and the 208's (Codes 2-10) when I was wiring the control cables I made a redundant connection thinking I had missed something  I tied terminals 17-18 on my 202KTU to 27 and 28 On My 212KTU.... thus making a short on my lamp battery and blowing fuses... I couldn't figure out why I wasn't getting any lights yet all the intercoms were working.... until I pressed a station line and noticed the blown fuse.... I slowly disconnected each one of the lamp feed connections and temporarily tied them to some terminal strips until I discovered that once I disconnected the lamp fed from the 202KTU everything started to light up again except for the by-passed units... then I grabbed my schematics and verified my connections....which is where I found the problem.... I had tied the Lamp feed circuit to the time-out and cut-out terminals on my 212KTU and I disconnected that mistake.... and then re-read the schematic which showed that terminals 17 and 18 went to the 212KTU, BUT.... connected to terminals 27 and 28B which are the Flash contacts.... once that was fixed... everything started to work right. I just had to reinstall the individual intercom stations.... #2 front bedroom-Home office. #3 livingroom #4 Roberts desk #5 Kitchen #6 back bedroom #7 front porch #8 unassigned #9 storage shed- work bench... and #0 for test....(telephone closet) This project really took too much time... and it was complicated when I tried to move all 3 208's at once only to have the mounting bars fail and have to disconnect everything to repair the situation. I even took the second pair of cross mount bars and re-tapped them to 12-24 like the original specs used.... even that is not working like I'd hoped... yes, the holes line up better, but the bars are too wide and don't allow for a snug fit.... The good part of all this, is that its easier to trace the individual station assignments.... they are all on 1 66 block... from top to bottom... 2 through 10... that took me a bit of time.... had to trace the leads to the different phones to make sure they are in order.... still have to verify the kitchen and porch lines as they toned out OK, but once connected, no pick up.... I was have problems remounting the 208's and I think I might of broken a wire or 2.... but am too tired of fighting with the system for now to fix it.... plus My roommate has a cold, and he just gave it to me....Time for some Nyquil..... I post some pictures later... this project was really interesting.... going from a simple intercom system to a more advance one with lamp flashing assignments... in all this I even reinstalled my original 207C, as I forgot the spare was damaged...yet to be fixed... well... that's all for me tonight.... I hope you are all doing OK and enjoying your own projects...
John