Author Topic: 1C2 Refurb (Project)  (Read 521 times)

Offline compubit

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1C2 Refurb (Project)
« on: February 22, 2018, 11:24:55 PM »
I picked up a 1C2 phone from another member who had the phone but never had it connected (it wasn’t the right type ;) ).  I knew it would need work, so I’m documenting as I go along. This may be boring for some folks, but I’m following my engineering processes to learn and troubleshoot as I go along.

My goal it to restore it to as close to original as possible, knowing that the dial had already been changed out, and not knowing what else was “different”. 

Major Part Dates:
31A Board: 4-77
1A Totalizer: 12-83
20A Coin Slot: 9-80
61C1 Hookswitch/Cover: 4/89 (Teleserviced Corp Sticker)
Tone Pad: 4000CP Dial (Conversion) 4-89
Coin Relay: 4-99 (J&R Fernandez, Inc. sticker)

I’ll post as I go along with pictures.  I’m deconstructing and testing continuity/resistances along the way. As of now, when I connect a line, I get nothing through the handset

So far, I’ve picked up 2 original 70-series Touch-Tone Pads (one each 70A and 70B).  We’ll see how they work.

Jim

Picture 1: the phone (vault cover removed)
Picture 2: inside the cover
Picture 3: inside the chassis
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2018, 11:31:03 PM »
I forgot to mention that I do get the bell ringing when I call in, but can’t answer or get a dial tone...

J
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2018, 11:40:28 PM »
First test: the handset.

The wiring on the handset coming out of the armor cable doesn’t match the normal color codes of Red/Black/White/White, but is Red/Black/Yellow/Green. Interesting since it’s connected to an Oxford Gray “Western Electric” handset.

Also, 2 of the wires were connected to different screw terminals than as described in the BSP...

After checking continuity (Red/Black & Yellow/Green), I hooked the handset up to a 500 set, and all is working (One thing not to have to worry about replacing - gray pay phone handsets aren’t cheap!).

Next up, checking the continuity across the hookswitch... (and dismantling the rest of the innards for testing)

Jim

A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Online Haf

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2018, 07:34:05 AM »
Jim

attached you some cards to document your repairs, changes etc. Maybe you can photoshop to blank ones for your own entries. If you need better scans let me know please. Those belong in every 1C2 for documentation. Found them in several of my out of service phones- special about those in particular, this phone was maintained by Jim/payphone installer in the early 80's. What a coincidence. And I bought it from original owner, a Bible School in Cincinnati.

Haf
Telephone:
0049-030-55474418
001-415-449-4743

Offline HarrySmith

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2018, 09:32:24 AM »
That's very cool. How do you know it was Jim?
Harry Smith
ATCA 4434
TCI

"There is no try,
there is only
do or do not"

Online Haf

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2018, 09:50:40 AM »
Harry

has his Cincinnatti Bell employee number on it and after I told him about this phone he recognized his handwriting. He even remembered where the phone was located originally.

"The phone came from Gods Bible Seminary it was a Christian school. once they told me the location I remembered it. As you went in the front door the phone hung in a coat room on the left side of the hallway. It was semi-public service which meant that they paid monthly for it to be there. On the cards the cause of the trouble is listed like CH for can't hear, NDT for no dial tone, CBH for can't be heard and so on. It is my hand writing on the card about the ground"

Haf
Telephone:
0049-030-55474418
001-415-449-4743

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2018, 03:29:15 PM »
Cool and Thanks!

I have no "history" on this phone, but want to get it as close to "original" as I can...

Jim
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2018, 11:25:14 PM »
Current status:

1) I've disassembled the dialer/switchhook assembly and have been testing for continuity.
2) The J1 to screw connections all tone out to the BSP (Good)
3) The switchhook assembly tones out (Good)...
4) Except, there are only 3 switchhook sets, not 4 - but 2 operate in Parallel (O/O and BR/BR) - No concern for a 1C2
5) I started on the 31A board to tone things out, and had nothing between the R and T terminals except to the bell - which did work.

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

Come to find out, the Green and Red wires (soldered to TB1), which connect the R&T on at the top of the board to 1 & 2 on TB3 (Terminal Bus?) are insulated and stored... 

Now the question is - do I try and put everything back the way it was (to test the existing hardware) or go ahead and reconnect an original 70A or 70B keypad, and follow the BSP - I'm leaning toward do that.  The dialing pad has many more wires than the BSP calls out, and doesn't necessarily use the same color scheme (such as no Black wire, but I do have an extra Silver wire jumper from the disconnection process...)

Anyway, I'm toast for tonight.  More tomorrow...

Jim
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2018, 11:58:02 PM »
We (BC Tel) eventually gave up in the touch pads in the 80E phones and our repair shops sourced another brand of touchpad that they used in the 80E’s being refurbished. These touchpads had at least one, maybe two extra leads as though maybe they were made to work with many different brands of phones and as you mentioned, of course none of the lead colours matched the original AE touchpads.

Hope all goes without too much trouble! Good job of documenting everything which may help someone in the future.

Terry

Online Payphone installer

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2018, 01:05:33 PM »
Is dial wired for dial tone first? is chassis wired for dial tone first? Wiring of dial for dial tone first depends on whether on if it is a A,B or C dial. Before you did all this did you try flipping the trigger in the coin relay to see if you got dial tone?

Offline Sigmaz

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2018, 05:04:24 PM »
Im not sure if this is useful or not but you can try and see if you get the same behavior.

My 1c1 has the same totalizer and when I first got it I couldn't get dial tone.

fooling around I found myself unplugging the round totalizer plug from the chassis. Sure enough TONE!

I found that I had to rotate the totalizer mech to a certain position for it to pass tone, even with the switch set to DTF. to use the phone with the totalizer plugged in.

I'm not 100% familiar with how the 1A model works, and mine may actually be boogered up and not working properly itself.
Although I am thinking that it needs the CO to send signals to return it to it's "home" position to wait for deposit. There are 2 solenoids that actuate in the assembly. One releases a latch and the other steps the spindle.

I hope my fumbling around proves somewhat useful for you.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2018, 05:21:25 PM by Sigmaz »

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2018, 01:36:01 PM »
Mine was an easy fix - it seems like someone along the way got the wiring so out of kilter, that they just did the “insulate and store” to the ring and tip feeding the phone.

I got it back together with an original 70B Touch Tone pad and I had dial tone! I even put a coin in the slot and heard the beeps (1/2/5).  The phone dialed out, but would not disconnect the line when the hookswitch was hung up... 

I checked the continuity on the hookswitch, and it was working correctly, per the meter, so I decided to try the 70A pad. Hooked it up and everything worked correctly: pad, ringer, hookswitch and (at least from what I can tell) the totalizer. The only downside with the 70A is that the # button is a bit finicky.

For grins I decided to reconnect the 70B pad, and now that works, hookswitch and all - guess I had a pair switched (whomever decided to use O-R as a wire was a sadist... especially on older wires where the red is wearing off...).

I’m he only thing not tested is the relay, but to do that, I need to get my (New to me) KS-21250, L1 - Coin Telephone Test Set up and running. One of the 45V batteries is dead, but the other one still generates 45V. I’ve purchased some 9-Volt batteries and clips from Amazon to “build” a new 90VDC source, plus I need 1 new 6xAA holder - 1 works, the other one has an open in it...

Jim
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline Sigmaz

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2018, 07:18:23 PM »
Awesome news, glad you got it sorted out!

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2018, 10:46:57 PM »
Well...

It's not working again. I put the tone pad back in the casing, hooked it up, and the hookswitch won't drop the line. I swapped the pads and get the same answer, so it sounds like something else is the culprit.

Off for more troubleshooting...

Jim
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!

Offline compubit

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Re: 1C2 Refurb (Project)
« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2018, 10:51:10 PM »
It's still in parts on the table in the basement. I ordered a replacement 31A board, but the local post office lost it - I show where FedEx delivered it (I have a GoPost address), but it appears to have been linked to another user, so I have to wait until the automatic locker times out, for them to retrieve it...

Jim
A phone phanatic since I was less than 2 (thanks to Fisher Price); collector since a teenager; now able to afford to play!
Favorite Phone: Western Electric Trimline - it just feels right holding it up to my face!