Author Topic: Now the Story Can be Told - 1949 WECo 500 Set  (Read 238631 times)

Offline Jim S.

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #210 on: March 27, 2010, 02:35:56 PM »
I read in a Bell Telephone Magazine article that the design of the G series handset was finalized in 1947.  Not sure if that's true of course, the magazine was written in the late 60's.

McHeath,
Here are some G proto-type designs from 1946
http://www.porticus.org/bell/images/dreyfuss_handset_prototypes.jpg

Jim
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 06:07:23 PM by Jim S. »
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Offline Dan/Panther

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #211 on: March 27, 2010, 04:14:45 PM »
Jim;
How can I download the files, for future reference ?

GPO/ Doug;
Rays site shows almost every model clear shell, except the 500...

Drew;
Does the D177001 show up as a Bell Labs Patent ?

Bwanna;
Golly Miss Donna I'm Blushing...

McHeath;
I did email Lucent with the email address provided by Jim, I requested they send me the missing parts I need. (IT Could Happen)

D/P



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Offline Dan/Panther

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #212 on: March 27, 2010, 04:20:05 PM »
A point has come up concerning contacting Lucent Industries about the phone. Would they have any legal right to reclaim possession of the phone ?
D/P

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Offline bwanna

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #213 on: March 27, 2010, 04:48:47 PM »
A point has come up concerning contacting Lucent Industries about the phone. Would they have any legal right to reclaim possession of the phone ?
D/P


                         :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o


any legal minds here ???
donna

Offline Jim S.

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #214 on: March 27, 2010, 04:59:43 PM »
For the photos, I have been right clicking and saving as a photo.

Another thing to do is to copy the cover. That way you have a referance for locating the magazine.

BTW the 3 photos were all located this morning doing internet searches


 For the BSTJ I had the title and issue. I went to the internet archive and started poking around. I had looked for it in the past and never found it.

To copy the Internet archive page.
I tried saving each page as a photo and pasted them in MS Works document.


In the past I have been able to print things and scan them back into digital.
It all depends on what the site will let you do.

Jim
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Offline Drew

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #215 on: March 27, 2010, 05:19:59 PM »
There must be both utility and design Patents associated with the 500, but did a quick search and did not see anything which seems odd. As I mentioned, design Patent D177001 falls under the year 1956, so your number must not be a design patent number since I'm pretty sure it would have been filed or issued in the 1948-49 time period.  I suppose it's possible that it was filed and not issued until 1956, but that's much greater a time period then usually seen. A detailed Patent search should bring up info on the 500, it's such an important piece of equipment.

 Prototype G handsets as early as 1946 -  bottom left looks close to the production version. I'd love to see case prototypes from '46.

See  http://www.uspto.gov/patents/process/search/issuyear.jsp
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 08:11:01 PM by Drew »

Offline bingster

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #216 on: March 27, 2010, 05:52:27 PM »
A point has come up concerning contacting Lucent Industries about the phone. Would they have any legal right to reclaim possession of the phone ?
D/P

I'm no legal scholar, but I doubt very seriously that they could make any kind of claim for it.  The Labs were a part of AT&T then, but since AT&T was busted up, any ownership AT&T might have had would certainly not be claimable by today's Bell Labs.
= DARRIN =



Offline Jim S.

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #217 on: March 27, 2010, 06:10:55 PM »
I added the photos to the links on from the previous postings.
Jim
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Offline Dan

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #218 on: March 27, 2010, 08:09:56 PM »
Dan/p, since the auction was so difficult to discern what it actually was, was it the dial plate that you noticed or the unique plungers? I am asking because I personally would have not seen the plungers.

The picture of the dial plate  BARELY shows the unique "operator" Z area. Imagine if the photo was 1/2 inch higher, this may have ended up in a trash can without bids.

I know Dennis and you noticed it. Would you have bid on it if the dial plate wasn't shown?

Also several of us (including me) would LOVE to know where he got this or the story behind it. Has the seller responded to any questions yet?

Lastly, I do not endorse a clear shell over it. I would put an early black 500 cover next to it on the side. Some people may actually be confused and think the phone came with an original clear shell. A picture of an early black 1948 or 1949 should be at least part of the display if the clear shell is used.

A 1950, 51 or 52 black  shell would work nicely.

« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 08:12:19 PM by Dan »
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Offline JorgeAmely

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #219 on: March 27, 2010, 08:22:09 PM »
I agree with you Dan. Anyone interested in seeing the uniqueness of this set is only two screws away from seen it.

Jorge

Offline baldopeacock

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #220 on: March 27, 2010, 09:26:47 PM »
I agree with you Dan. Anyone interested in seeing the uniqueness of this set is only two screws away from seen it.



Loose screws?  I've got a couple of those myself.   :)

As for the case - since the original isn't available, IMHO I don't know how much difference it makes whether it's a slightly later black 500 case, or one of the clear Kotke cases.   Neither's a true original.   Something to be said for the clear case idea, since it would show the uniqueness, non-production features of D/P's awesome find without requiring case removal on display.   That's kind of a security thing to me - look but don't touch if you aren't invited.   But as you suggest, Jorge, it's just two screws.   Swapping either a clear or a black case, or removing, isn't a big deal.  
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 09:28:56 PM by baldopeacock »

Offline Drew

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #221 on: March 27, 2010, 10:18:13 PM »
Okay....I went back to page 4 of the thread and looked at the photos of the back of the dial.  The base is marked D-177001 & 125......the dial is marked D-177008 & 132.  If you add 7 to each number on the base, you get the numbers on the dial. They must both be serial numbers.

Sorry if this was brought up somewhere in the 200 plus replies so far, but I didn't see it.

Drew

Offline Dan/Panther

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #222 on: March 27, 2010, 11:10:22 PM »
Does anyone know what the offset is for hole in the center of a finger wheel.
If you draw a line straight through the center of the dial card mounting hole on the finger wheel, the dial is offset slightly. I get 11 or 12 degrees. Anyone know for sure.
D/P

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Offline Dan/Panther

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #223 on: March 27, 2010, 11:39:31 PM »
I keep looking at that photo of Henry Dreyfus and the preproducrtion set, I sure like the black on black.

Dan;
I like to take a close look at auctions with bad pictures. Mostly to see if I can pick up an early date 500. I'm trying to get one each of the 1950 to 1959 black 500, so far I have 9 all but the 50. then I started to concentrate on converting each year to my birth month, so far I've found 3,  54, 55, and 57
Second Just a few days earlier Dennis Markham had made a comment about the Z dial face, and that it would be very difficult if not impossible to find one. I also recalled seeing the pre-production photo with Henry Dreyfus. It appeared to me the phone had a strange dial, and plunger mechanism. When I saw the auction, I screen captured the photos, and enlarged them and enhanced them.
I knew right away I had found something different, but just how different I was even amazed. I spent the next week busting at the seems trying top hold it in, and praying literally that no one else would catch. It came down to the last day, I had put in a bid at $5.77, on  an opening bid of $4.99. Then someone else bid $10.50. I went back in and bid $15.77. Then I went and snipe bid $500.00. Well about 2 hours before the end of the auction , I went back and looked again, I was no longer High bidder, the price was now $510.00. I felt sick, because I knew right then that others saw what I saw. I went back to the snipe and put in $750.00. I knew I didn't have a chance and some high roller was going to get it for thousands probably. The cat was out of the bag. About 30 minutes before the end of the auction, I went back to check where it stood. Much to my amazement, I was once again high bid at $10.50. I though, what wrong Ebay has goofed up, then I thought refresh the page that was the problem. Same thing still high bid, then I checked thew bid stats. The guy that outbid me at $10.50 had retracted his bid, because he meant to type $16.01, instead typed $1601.00. he still didn't thing the phone was worth Even $20.00. I was in, Except for one thing, the ASS had revealed my high bid of $500.00, that ****ed me off and made me mad, because now anyone curious about the high price on this train wreck chassis would realize, at least one person thought it was worth big bucks. My heart sunk. I had it, lost it, had it again, and now was probably going to loose it again. I watched until the end, and no one outbid me at $10.50. Well I about pooped myself, until I refreshed the page and realized someone, had a snipe bid at $220.00. I though my luck, somebody just cost me $200.00, all kidding aside, that $200.00 never bothered me for one second, well maybe one second, because I new I had landed something special. But My snipe saved my butt and I ended up the winner. I will say I was a basket case until I got the phone in my hands, total about 10 days, I was a real Ass to live with for that time.

D/P
I wonder what the guys on ATCA email site are saying now about my brain damage, and DB cooper landed on his head.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2010, 12:44:43 PM by Dan/Panther »

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Offline Dan

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Re: Now the Story Can be Told.
« Reply #224 on: March 27, 2010, 11:59:36 PM »
Dan, Interesting story. I can feel your excitement. I had nothing to compare to your magnitude except when I got my Dec 1950 phone for $20 at the flea market. He didn't even bother to get it off his truck. I had to ask for it. Then I lowballed him from 25 to 20 (kinda crappy, but I needed the $5 for lunch).

I think you are saying the plungers alone would've given you a good idea of it's rarity, so you have a great eye. I only would've spotted the unique dial plate.

How did your bid of $500 get revealed when the wrong bid was dropped? Are you saying that sellers know your maximum bid but other bidders do not? If that's the case, I could see major corruption --the seller could call a friend to drive the bid up but not quite hit your max bid (in your case, drive it to say 490 or so. )

I really don't know the intricacies of ebay.
"Imagine how weird telephones would look if our ears weren't so close to our mouths." - Steven Wright