Author Topic: Automatic Electric Dial Identification  (Read 20602 times)

Online wds

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #30 on: December 19, 2011, 06:12:10 PM »
Kleenax - that odd looking Kellogg Dial you posted a picture of - I found a picture of it in the 1923 Kellogg Catalog.  Page 254
Dave

Offline kleenax

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #31 on: December 19, 2011, 10:32:41 PM »
Kleenax - that odd looking Kellogg Dial you posted a picture of - I found a picture of it in the 1923 Kellogg Catalog.  Page 254
Excellent!  Thanks for posting this!  I don't have that catalog; only the newer editions.
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Offline GG

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2011, 05:31:57 AM »


Yeah, thanks majorly.  Instant guide to disassembling the one I have.

Question is, is there anywhere one might find a replacement fingerwheel and fingerstop for those, or do they have to be custom made?  (Mine is missing those parts, eeyow).

Kleenax, do you still have any of those old GPO #10 dials for sale, with the small number cards?  I'm looking for two, one for a 150, one for a 232.

Online wds

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #33 on: December 27, 2011, 03:20:17 PM »
Here's a Kellogg dial for sale.  

http://tinyurl.com/kellogg-dial
« Last Edit: December 27, 2011, 03:40:01 PM by wds »
Dave

Offline GG

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #34 on: December 29, 2011, 08:06:25 AM »


That one is probably a little older than mine, which has the number plate on some kind of plastic material. 

Darn, almost $90 and two days to go: that's going to end up out of my price range, so I'm not going to even try for it.  Hopefully someone from around here ends up with it though.  It would probably be current for a Grab-A-Phone. 


Online wds

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2012, 02:44:59 PM »
For future reference, it sold for $145.77 - not bad for a broken dial.  The shunt contact was broken off.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2012, 02:49:54 PM by wds »
Dave

Offline GG

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2012, 07:44:19 AM »

Eeyow, $145 with a broken off-normal contact.  I should almost be willing to list mine without the fingerwheel & fingerstop, to see if the buyer of that one wants another in order to cobble the parts together and make one working one. 

Since we're straying a little from the original topic...

I just scored a GPO No. 8 dial in chrome or stainless steel with numeric numberplate for $50, and a solid metal fingerwheel of the same style (small number label) for less than $15 (that I can install on a No. 10 dial to "cheat" and make it look like a No. 8 dial:-)  These are headed for a Tele. 150 desk stand and a Tele. 232, in whatever combinations & permutations look right.  My inclination is to keep the Tele. 150 in all black as far as possible, and use stainless steel for the Tele. 232.

If you try using the old solid metal fingerwheels from No. 8 dials on No. 10 dials, you MUST be careful to check the clearance between the fingerwheel, the numberplate, and the fingerstop.  You will need a very thin spacer (a washer is too thick) to raise the fingerwheel just a tiny bit so it doesn't crack the numberplate when screwed down, but not so high that it gets jammed on the fingerstop.  Work slowly and do not tighten the center screw fully without checking clearances and testing the dial as you go.  I ran into this issue and fortunately didn't damage anything along the way.  (However, trying to make a trigger dial look like a No. 8 dial is right out; these mods are intended for slipping cam dials only.)
« Last Edit: January 07, 2012, 07:46:59 AM by GG »

Offline DavePEI

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #37 on: July 13, 2013, 09:55:16 AM »
Hi All:

Curiosity calling. I know I once read an explanation for this, but why is it that some AE 24 dials have 5 terminals - some have 6. Now, a 6 terminal one may be used in the same circuit as a 5 terminal one, by jumpering the top terminals and then wiring as a 5 terminal dial. Both varieties are labelled AE 24.

It is my impression that we see more of the 6 terminal variety here in Canada (those dials made at Phillips/AE in Brockville). Did it have something to do with compatibility with retrofitting the dials on other brands of phones, i.e. Northern Electric as was often done?

Dave
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 01:54:44 PM by DavePEI »
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Offline poplar1

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #38 on: July 13, 2013, 10:48:11 AM »
Hi All:

I know I once read an explanation for this, but why is it that some AE 24 dials have 5 terminals - some have 6. Now, a 6 terminal one may be used in the same circuit as a 5 terminal one, by jumpering the top terminals and then wiring as a 5 terminal dial. Both varieties are labelled AE 24.

It is my impression that we see more of the 6 terminal variety here in Canada (those dials made at Phillips/AE in Brockville). Did it have something to do with compatibility with retrofitting the dials on other brands of phones, i.e. Northern Electric as was often done?

Dave

If there is a strap between the inside pulsing spring terminal and the innermost shunt spring terminal, then it would seem that you would have to have 5 terminals, lest the talking circuit be shunted out at all times.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 01:52:35 PM by DavePEI »
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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2013, 10:53:35 AM »
Hi All:

I know I once read an explanation for this, but why is it that some AE 24 dials have 5 terminals - some have 6. Now, a 6 terminal one may be used in the same circuit as a 5 terminal one, by jumpering the top terminals and then wiring as a 5 terminal dial. Both varieties are labelled AE 24.

It is my impression that we see more of the 6 terminal variety here in Canada (those dials made at Phillips/AE in Brockville). Did it have something to do with compatibility with retrofitting the dials on other brands of phones, i.e. Northern Electric as was often done?

Dave

If there is a strap between the inside pulsing spring terminal and the innermost shunt spring terminal, then it would seem that you would have to have 5 terminals, lest the talking circuit be shunted out at all times.
No, but there was one when the phone arrived. I don't believe this was the original dial on the phone,, as the phone was received with the dial, but not wired up. Once I removed the strap you mentioned, all went back to normal as you say, because it was no longer shunted out. The shorting strap that remains is on the top terminals of the shunting springs, making it the equivalent of a 5 terminal AE 24 (whereas in most AE 24s these are physically joined). I have two of the 6 terminal dials, both marked AE 24 here.

When I go over to the museum later, I will take a photo of one of the 6 terminal AE 24s.

The drawing below shows the standard AE 24 terminals and springs (black) with the extra terminal and removeable link superimposed (red).

Dave
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 01:54:14 PM by DavePEI »
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Offline G-Man

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2013, 01:46:39 PM »
AECo type-24A36 dials came in a number of different flavors including some with contact spring pile-ups specifically configured for Western Electric telephones.

While the AK-25 is the most common pile-up used on Automatic Electric telephones, some of the other pile-ups include the following:

                                       AK-24, AK-26, AK-27, AK-28, AK-29

Schematics for them are shown in the Automatic Electric catalogs.

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2013, 02:04:27 PM »
AECo type-24A36 dials came in a number of different flavors including some with contact spring pile-ups specifically configured for Western Electric telephones.

While the AK-25 is the most common pile-up used on Automatic Electric telephones, some of the other pile-ups include the following:

                                       AK-24, AK-26, AK-27, AK-28, AK-29

Schematics for them are shown in the Automatic Electric catalogs.

Without dissecting one of the 6 terminal AE 34s I have, I can't tell if it is the same as one of the other spring configurations, but it must be. Anyway, I guess it was more curiosity than anything, as usually you see the AK-25 combination, then I ran into two 6 terminal ones in a row (yes, I did accidentally say 4 vs. 5 terminal, but of course that is 5 vs. 6 terminals - one of the problems with having the dials in the other house, and typing the message here, as I couldn't look at the dial at the same time as I typed  :) Thanks, G-Man - you have satisfied my curiosity!

Dave
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 02:07:07 PM by DavePEI »
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Offline poplar1

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2013, 02:14:19 PM »
Sorry, but I was confused. The link I was talking about was #14 on a 5-terminal dial. I'm not familiar with the 6-terminal variety as shown in red.
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Offline DavePEI

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2013, 02:18:53 PM »
Sorry, but I was confused. The link I was talking about was #14 on a 5-terminal dial. I'm not familiar with the 6-terminal variety as shown in red.
Ok, so I am still curious. I have seen several of them, and currently have two here. I am pretty sure someone detailed the reason they were made this way, and it seems to me if made it easier to sell them to manufacturers of other phones, and could still be used on AEs, but I could be mistaken... Memory doesn't get better at my age!

Dave
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Offline poplar1

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Re: Automatic Electric Dial Identification
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2013, 02:25:32 PM »
The Signal Corps dials have an extra set of contacts that are normally closed. These can be used in place of a 5H.
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.