Author Topic: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards  (Read 75520 times)

Offline Wallphone

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #165 on: January 29, 2011, 09:19:11 PM »
ISTR that ITT bought Kellogg in 1951. For the first year they had a tag on some of their phones that called Kellogg an Associate of ITT.

Offline Sargeguy

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #166 on: January 29, 2011, 09:41:21 PM »
I know how you feel-getting your $6.50 back is not going to cut it.
Greg Sargeant
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Offline Jester

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #167 on: January 29, 2011, 10:37:16 PM »
I did inform the seller of the damage & explained to him where he went wrong in packing this phone.  I won this one late in the evening & he sent me shipping notice early the next morning, so I did not get any instruction to him before it was in the mail--big mistake!  You would think that a seller with a 2000+ feedback rating-- the majority as a seller-- would know how to pack an item.  He did send me a message to tell me he would pack future items of this kind much more carefully & he did refund my $6.50-- but not the shipping.  You're right, Sargeguy-- it didn't help. 

Jonathan,

I haven't checked every part, but the base & C4A ringer are dated 6/59.  The plastics are soft.  I may not be successful, especially with the handset, but I am going to attempt to repair the damage.  If anyone learns of a replacement handset handle, I'm looking for one-- just in case.
Stephen

Offline Dave F

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #168 on: February 02, 2011, 09:44:44 PM »
It's really hard to look at -- I'm so sorry.  Having been through this so many times, you would think I would be numb to it by now.  But no, it still hurts to see what these incompetent doofuses (doofi?) manage to do to us.

Dave

Offline Tom B

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #169 on: March 26, 2011, 07:27:38 PM »
 >:( Received this 50 year old beautiful phone this morning. What a bleeding shame...
Tom

Offline Owain

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #170 on: March 26, 2011, 07:59:25 PM »
Oh dear.

It looks a clean break without any material lost, so might glue back.

Or will Clueless Ebay Seller be refunding?

There are red 706 case plastics on Ebay UK for about 11 inc P&P

I once had a Bell Set 26 arrive in lots of little pieces  :(

Offline Adam

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #171 on: March 26, 2011, 08:09:27 PM »
Welcome to the (unhappy) club, Tom.  It seems we all have had this happen at one time or another.

At this point, because so many of our acquisitions change hands via the mail, I think we must simply accept that a certain small percentage of telephone history will be permanently lost to attrition due to mailing damage.  We can try to minimize it as much as possible, but that fact will never be changed, it's just a reality.

But, we have to get our replacement parts from somewhere, anyway...
Adam Forrest
Los Angeles Telephone - A proud part of the global C*Net System
C*Net 1-383-4820

Offline GG

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #172 on: March 27, 2011, 02:58:43 AM »


Sometimes a well-packed package gets smashed by the post office or parcel carrier.  This is more likely during the winter holidays and other times when employees are being overworked to death, and they take shortcuts such as overloading hand-trucks and carts, or they slip on wet/icy ground and packages go flying. 

That's not the seller's fault.  Usually it's not even the postal or carrier worker's fault, but the result of speed-ups and overwork and under-staffing.  Any item of value should be insured for its real value, not the "price paid," if such a thing is possible.  Then when something gets smashed, file the insurance claim.  If enough people do that, the post offices and carrier services might just hire enough workers to handle the load properly. 

Then there are the ones that are packed crappily, pardon my language but the appropriate adjective begins with a considerably stronger common cussword that probably isn't welcome on this board. 

Ebay is now closing in on 15 years old if not older.  There is exactly no excuse at this point for poor packing, and I don't care if the seller just got started, they should be obligated to understand what secure packing means.  Ebay needs to have it in their terms of service, that if sellers are not familiar with proper packaging methods, they are obligated to have items professionally packed for shipping, and further, that inadequate packing is legitimate cause for negative feedback on a transaction.

When this happens to you:  Write to the seller and politely inform them that the item arrived smashed to bits due to their poor packing, and you expect a 100% refund with no further hassles or you are going to leave scathingly negative feedback.  They will probably reply "oh I didn't know!" and the correct response to that is, "you're selling in a public forum, you're OBLIGATED to know, or have it professionally packed."

After you get the refund, leave "neutral" feedback, rating the seller high on all counts except whatever the one is that has to do with shipping.  Rate that one zero, and in the little box for obligatory verbiage, write in something like this:  "Item inadequately packed, arrived smashed to bits." 

That's called "teaching them a lesson" and over time if enough of us to it, sellers will learn.

Offline GG

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #173 on: March 27, 2011, 04:08:58 AM »


This happened to me twice, both instances being from Australia, which, being halfway around the world from the US, does not make for a gentle ride but is all the more reason to require proper packing.

One was a 232 with integral bellset, where the bellset was smashed along the right bottom edge.  Fortunately all the bits of bakelite were rattling around in the box, so it could all be fixed via the "acrylic repair method" (below), and you truly can't tell it was ever damaged unless you look closely at the specific area. 

The other was an HES 2+10, of the 332 era, that arrived with the left side completely smashed out.  Once again all the pieces were in the packing.  However, this was the *gray* version, rare as can be, and light enough in color that the acrylic repair still shows a hairline if one looks carefully. 

Your red 706 can be repaired and the repair probably will be barely visible or entirely invisible.  Thusly:

The acrylic repair method:

Take the housing off the phone, and remove the dial number ring and its circular metal retaining clip on the inside of the housing  Clean the housing by wiping *away from* the break in each direction, using Windex or similar ammonia-based window/glass cleaner on a clean soft rag.  Do this on the inside of the housing as well as on the outside.  You want to be careful to avoid getting the Windex inside the crack itself because it will bring just a tiny bit of dirt along with it, that will get into the irregularities of the crack, and make the crack more visible.   Then rinse under clean water, over the entire surface, and it's not a problem if this water gets into the crack.  Let the housing dry completely, overnight.  (Not in a heated area: at room temperature.)

Next, get a bunch of tubes of Krazy Glue, the original version that is a very thin liquid with low viscosity. 

Lay out a few thicknesses of newspaper over your work area, and then two thicknesses of clean white un-lined office paper in the area where the housing will be set down during repair.  Do the rest of this under bright light.  I have a lamp with a circular fluorescent lamp around a magnifying glass, and I use that for this purpose.  However bright light alone should be sufficient to let most people see what they're doing. 

Next, practice fit the cracked material together, taking care to see that all the little weird variable areas along the crack mesh together properly. 

Now open one of the tubes of Krazy Glue by piercing the top of the tube with the little tack or pin that's provided.  The glue is an acrylic plastic material (don't get too close when working with it, it has a sharp smell and may make your eyes burn a little) that is rapid setting.  It flows nicely into cracks and it sets extremely quickly, so you'll have to work fast. 

Use gentle hand pressure to spread the crack open a little bit.  Working from the inside of the housing, apply the Krazy Glue liberally.  If the crack doesn't go all the way through such as to be an open break, gently but quickly wiggle the plastic to ensure the glue flows all the way into the far reaches of the crack.  In any case, once the crack has been liberally coated with Krazy Glue along its mating surfaces, quickly bring the two halves of the crack together, and *press* them together firmly and steadily.  In your case you are seeking to press in a front-to-back direction, not putting pressure on the sides of the housing.  Hold that position for 1 - 2 minutes to let the stuff harden.  Then put the housing down on the white paper and leave it sit overnight.

The next day:  Take a tube of Krazy Glue and apply a layer on the interior side of the housing over the cracked area, to fill in any areas that may be chipped on the inside.  Do the same on the outside of the housing, and here it's OK if the bead of Krazy Glue ends up higher than the rest of the plastic.  When done, lay the housing down such that the bead of Krazy Glue on the outside is facing up but tilted slightly toward the bottom.  It will be necessary to find small random objects to prop up the housing in a stable manner in that position: do this in advance as a "dry run" before doing it with the housing freshly treated with acrylic.

Then go away overnight again to give the stuff more than enough time to harden and dry. 

Then repeat the surface treatment the following day, and the day after, until what you have is a bead of Krazy Glue that's consistently just a tiny bit higher than the plastic itself.

Once that's completely hard and dry, it's time to file it down to flush with the plastic. 

Use a *metal* file that has a fine filing surface.  Look very carefully and you will see how to hold the file such that it can shave off the hardened Krazy Glue on the outside of the housing, without biting into the original plastic.  When filing, start with the area furthest from any edge of the plastic, and work back toward the edges (in your case, the dial hole and the bottom left edge respectively. 

Using the file gently and carefully, you'll end up filing off all of the excess bead of acrylic until you have a completely flush surface. 

After that, take the housing to the kitchen and clean the rest of the housing, using Windex on a clean rag, or using a dedicated toothbrush and dish detergent & water. 

You may want to try sanding the area around the crack using the finest sandpaper you can find (e.g. 600 grit).  Just sand lightly to ensure that the surface is flush.

Follow that up by buffing the entire housing using a buffing wheel on slow to medium speed, with coarse buffing compound; and then repeat using fine buffing compound (the stuff I have is black and white respectively).   The goal here is to get the whole thing to a high shine.  The buffing process will make the whole thing totally flush and seamless around the area of the crack.  The high shine will also reflect light in a manner that makes the repair even less visible. 

If done right, this will make most types of cracks utterly invisible and as good as new.  It works best on black housings, and dark colors generally better than light colors.   Red is kinda' in the middle, so it should be satisfactory (I've done it with green as well).  Deep scratches can also be brought up to level with the acrylic method, and those should look completely new when done (I have a white AE 80 with a small area that has a moderately deep scratch, we'll see how that comes out). 

One of these days I'll post some pictures.  I have a blueish-greenish Tesla with a bottom edge that got a minor chunk missing during shipping (unavoidable, box was well packed, Tesla housings are thin), so we'll see what happens with that one. 

If you try this, let us know how it comes out.  706s are made of a good, tough, thick plastic, so this is likely to succeed.  And of course take appropriate care when reassembling the set, including removing the dial fingerwheel first.  (I presume you know the method for using a small thin screwdriver through the slot under the fingerwheel, to eject the center plastic disc; otherwise a suction cup applied from the front will do it, thereby providing access to the screw in the center of the fingerwheel.)


Offline Tom B

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #174 on: March 27, 2011, 08:00:04 AM »
Thanks for the comprehensive guide, GG.
I'm negotiating with the seller (who has offered a full refund, including return postage) to see if we can't work a fair price out and I keep the phone, and get to work on the repair.
Tom

Online Doug Rose

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #175 on: March 27, 2011, 08:01:20 AM »
>:( Received this 50 year old beautiful phone this morning. What a bleeding shame...
Tom.....what a shame!  :'( Such a cool looking phone. Sorry to see this...Doug
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Offline gpo706

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #176 on: March 27, 2011, 10:06:43 AM »
Deary, deary me.

You might think me inconsiderate to say so but it does look like a clean crack, and most probably fixable.

Of course the problem with buying a new case is that the colour may not match perfectly, even in your pics my identical set looks a lot darker red than your example.

Did the handset get packed next to the case?

Good luck with it anyhow mate.

S.
"now this should take five minutes, where's me screwdriver went now..?"

Offline Ed D

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #177 on: March 27, 2011, 12:19:39 PM »


Ebay is now closing in on 15 years old if not older.  There is exactly no excuse at this point for poor packing, and I don't care if the seller just got started, they should be obligated to understand what secure packing means.  Ebay needs to have it in their terms of service, that if sellers are not familiar with proper packaging methods, they are obligated to have items professionally packed for shipping, and further, that inadequate packing is legitimate cause for negative feedback on a transaction.

When this happens to you:  Write to the seller and politely inform them that the item arrived smashed to bits due to their poor packing, and you expect a 100% refund with no further hassles or you are going to leave scathingly negative feedback.  They will probably reply "oh I didn't know!" and the correct response to that is, "you're selling in a public forum, you're OBLIGATED to know, or have it professionally packed."

After you get the refund, leave "neutral" feedback, rating the seller high on all counts except whatever the one is that has to do with shipping.  Rate that one zero, and in the little box for obligatory verbiage, write in something like this:  "Item inadequately packed, arrived smashed to bits." 

That's called "teaching them a lesson" and over time if enough of us to it, sellers will learn.


Hi GG,
I don't fully agree with this approach.  I was with you until the mention of threatening to leave "scathingly negative feedback" if the situation is not resolved with no further hassles.  This is the initial contact to the seller, and IMHO, threatening the seller at this point with negative FB if this is not resolved to your satisfaction is not going to help matters.  Doing so may cause you more grief in the process than it is worth.  Coming on as strong as you suggest will likely put the seller on the defensive, or perhaps more correctly, on the offensive.

In my experience, (I have received one smashed ebay phone and one damaged phone related item so far - both had packing issues) I have found that it is better to first give the seller a chance to make it right, without my making threats.  If the seller is an honest person, let them prove that before making threats.

I had a seller send me a check for a complete refund for a damaged calculagraph, and she told me to keep the calculagraph.  I had only advised the seller of the damage as I felt she could benefit from the FB so she would perhaps pack items better in the future.  I said that I believed I could repair it, and I never requested, or suggested that a refund was due.  One of the levers broke off in shipping because it was in contact with the box and the screw sheared when the box was hit in transit.  I managed to get the broken stub out, and obtained a replacement screw from a local specialty fastener shop.  I voided her check and mailed it back with a note thanking her, and explaining that I could not accept the refund in good conscience.  I felt that it was the right thing to do.

The smashed phone was resolved by the seller with no problem.  I offered to return the broken phone, but he advised me to keep it.  Both sellers were truly "class acts" and I respect them very much for that.

I left both sellers positive FB.  Why diss them when they did what was the right thing to do?

Online Doug Rose

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #178 on: March 27, 2011, 12:31:58 PM »
Very Nice Ed....I agree 100%.

 FYI....threatening a seller with negative feedback is frowned upon by eBay/Paypal and they will take action against the buyer who does threaten negs...Doug
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Offline Tom B

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Re: The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards
« Reply #179 on: March 27, 2011, 02:40:08 PM »
The phone is a darker red than the pics might suggest. I have no intention to leave the seller any negative FB. She seems honest enough, and while the packing was lacking I don't think she meant any harm. I would think she has learned from this.
And, as Dave so truly said, we have to expect some breakages. The only irony for me is that I've received phones from the other side of the Atlantic with not a bit of damage. This 706 came from less than 30 miles away :-\
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 03:37:02 PM by Tom B »
Tom